Is the Leica PRS worth looking at?

[FjallJager]

I am scope shopping and thinking about the Leica PRS.

Going to be a long range practice scope, I don't shoot PRS. I am into one on my price because of a coupon for about $2200 new.

Does it beat a Nightforce ATACR, Kahles 6-24, and Leupold Mark 5 or Mark 8?

 

[Glassaholic]

A lot of guys who run them really like them, glass seems to punch above the price and mechanics seem to share some design influence from Delta Stryker 4.5-30. If the reticle(s) work for you then they offer very good value for the cost.

 

[Hegre]

I am scope shopping and thinking about the Leica PRS.

Going to be a long range practice scope, I don't shoot PRS. I am into one on my price because of a coupon for about $2200 new.

Does it beat a Nightforce ATACR, Kahles 6-24, and Leupold Mark 5 or Mark 8?

Fwiw, I just sent back a March 5-42 HM and ordered a second Leica PRS after having the two side by side. The only drawback is you need to shoot at 17-18x to use the tree rather than 13-15. Other than that it is an excellent scope with great turrets and glass

 

[Chickentoast]

^Do tell re: the March return - I've been skeptical of all the recent praise for their new scopes but was planning on buying the 5-42 HM to find out for myself.

 

[Yoteski]

I was going to try one, but the reticles turn me off. The PRB reticle looks like an overthought out jumbled mess in the pics I've seen; maybe better looking through it?
They should take the other reticle they offer, add a simple Christmas tree and then I'd be interested.

 

[Hegre]

^Do tell re: the March return - I've been skeptical of all the recent praise for their new scopes but was planning on buying the 5-42 HM to find out for myself.

Nice scope, but the dipoter setting is unusually shallow (-2) so they do not work for some shooters in our household. I liked it, unbeatable FOV, but frankly the Leica came out pretty much the same for my eyes at 500 meters and since they are on sale in eastern EU right now , I can get two for the price of the March. Also got a ZCO coming next week so we can compare that to the Leica. My wife loves her Leica

 

[Hegre]

I was going to try one, but the reticles turn me off. The PRB reticle looks like an overthought out jumbled mess in the pics I've seen; maybe better looking through it?
They should take the other reticle they offer, add a simple Christmas tree and then I'd be interested.

I would get one for myself if they made a slightly more defined reticle that works at 12-15x. Something like my 7c vortex or the ZCO mpct3.

 

[Chickentoast]

Nice scope, but the dipoter setting is unusually shallow (-2) so they do not work for some shooters in our household. I liked it, unbeatable FOV, but frankly the Leica came out pretty much the same for my eyes at 500 meters and since they are on sale in eastern EU right now , I can get two for the price of the March. Also got a ZCO coming next week so we can compare that to the Leica. My wife loves her Leica

Thanks! I have a ZCO 527 so would be interested to hear your comparative analysis once received. My favorite all-around value is the Burris XTR3, which is ~30% less than the Leica here in the US. If the March doesn't blow me away, expect I'll get another.

 

[Glassaholic]

Thanks! I have a ZCO 527 so would be interested to hear your comparative analysis once received. My favorite all-around value is the Burris XTR3, which is ~30% less than the Leica here in the US. If the March doesn't blow me away, expect I'll get another.

March has different appeal for different shooters. I helped a guy out here on the Hide last year, he bought both the ZCO 5-27 and the March 5-42, he ended up feeling the ZCO was better in just about every way. Another guy I helped in May, same situation, he ended up buying ZCO 5-27 and March 5-42 and his opinion was March was way better. The March is a very short scope with an 8.4x erector, there are going to be some hurdles to overcome, but if you're aware of those shortcomings and prefer a short scope then you'll be pleasantly surprised. The edge distortion on the March 5-42 bugs me (as it does on most scopes that have edge distortion), this is something that the 4.5-28x52 scope manages much better (than the 5-42). If you're looking for pure optical performance, TT - ZCO - Minox ZP5 pretty much rule the roost. If you want greater FOV, magnification, shorter scope, etc. then you'll be looking at other scopes.

Based on early reports it sounds like the Leica may be close to the ATACR optically, but with much better FOV. Now that Leica has a much better warranty (transferable) they are more appealing because resale won't leave the new owner out in the cold.

 

[Hegre]

March has different appeal for different shooters. I helped a guy out here on the Hide last year, he bought both the ZCO 5-27 and the March 5-42, he ended up feeling the ZCO was better in just about every way. Another guy I helped in May, same situation, he ended up buying ZCO 5-27 and March 5-42 and his opinion was March was way better. The March is a very short scope with an 8.4x erector, there are going to be some hurdles to overcome, but if you're aware of those shortcomings and prefer a short scope then you'll be pleasantly surprised. The edge distortion on the March 5-42 bugs me (as it does on most scopes that have edge distortion), this is something that the 4.5-28x52 scope manages much better (than the 5-42). If you're looking for pure optical performance, TT - ZCO - Minox ZP5 pretty much rule the roost. If you want greater FOV, magnification, shorter scope, etc. then you'll be looking at other scopes.

Based on early reports it sounds like the Leica may be close to the ATACR optically, but with much better FOV. Now that Leica has a much better warranty (transferable) they are more appealing because resale won't leave the new owner out in the cold.

Both the Leica and the March 4.5-28 have the same issue for me. Neither has a great standard PRS reticle that works at typical PRS magnification. If either come out with a good prs tree, they will be very good.
A March with an mpct3 style reticle would be killer (preferrably without the non metric funnytunnel)
Even the FML would work if they doubled the thickness and maybe made the large dots hollow

 

[Glassaholic]

Both the Leica and the March 4.5-28 have the same issue for me. Neither has a great standard PRS reticle that works at typical PRS magnification. If either come out with a good prs tree, they will be very good.
a March with a mpct3 style reticle would be killer (preferrably without the non metric funnytunnel)

Just out of curiosity, what makes a "great standard PRS" reticle for you?

 

[Hegre]

Just out of curiosity, what makes a "great standard PRS" reticle for you?

One that has a tree that can be used at 10-15x against dark background and at high speed. The FML cannot even be used at 20. The Leica reticle is ok if you do not shoot under 18x, but that is AFAIK not where the vast majority of PRS shooters are. I say that as a happy owner of two Leicas.

Good examples are 7c and mpct3

 

[Glassaholic]

One that has a tree that can be used at 10-15x against dark background and at high speed. The FML cannot even be used at 20. The Leica reticle is ok if you do not shoot under 18x, but hat is AFAIK not where the vast majority of PRS shooters are. I say that as a happy owner of two Leicas.

Good examples are 7c and mpct3

This thread is for the Leica and I don't want to hijack it further but would like to discuss this more, I'll copy this into the March 4.5-28 thread...

 

[Hegre]

This thread is for the Leica and I don't want to hijack it further but would like to discuss this more, I'll copy this into the March 4.5-28 thread...

The Leicas reticle is more of a niche prs reticle for those who want a subtle tree that is there, but kind of disappears or is not distracting when not in use. This is in fact why we bought our first Leica as we specifically wanted that feature, but I think it fails to appeal to the typical prs shooter. I really do hope that both March and Leica will offer one more tree that is aimed at the 10-15x users and is open without the solid lines of the pdk, but very clear and easy to orient oneself in at speed.

 

[FjallJager]

Is their PRS reticle usable at all without being illuminated at 5x to kill a fox at 50 yards? Or is it too hard to see.

I'd love to see a THLR type reticle in this scope.

 

[Hegre]

Is their PRS reticle usable at all without being illuminated at 5x to kill a fox at 50 yards? Or is it too hard to see.

I'd love to see a THLR type reticle in this scope.

Main cross is very clear.

 

[FjallJager]

Good to know, are you buying them from Optics Trade or someone big like that?

 

[Hegre]

Good to know, are you buying them from Optics Trade or someone big like that?

Optics trade are great, but I got one Leica on sale from a local shop that stopped carrying them and this latest one was abroad.
Have to say optics trade are really good to deal with though. Highly recommend!

 

[FjallJager]

Cool, just checked they have some deals but not better than I can do on these.

 

[Hegre]

edit
wrong post

 

[littlepod]

I really like the Leica reticle and how the tree kind of fades away when not in use. I sold mine as I was just getting into PRS shooting and I need to use lower magnification to find my targets. The reticle lines are only usable at 18+. I've heard they know our feedback and there will be a revision coming.

 

[gconnoyer]

Got to check one out last weekend at a match.

The glass is really good, turrets and mechanics seem good, but the reticle is really thin/small for PRS use (IMO)
It reminds me of how the S&B LRR reticle looks. I think its a good scope, but I think if you're aiming strictly for PRS usage there is better stuff out there.

 

[ShotgunDiesel]

I’ve had my Leica prs with the PRB for about a year now. I’ve shot a few matches with it and few like I have a pretty good grasp on it.
At first the reticle definitely takes some getting used too. The open circle center is really nice for prs as its small enough to be refined but open and fast enough at the same time.
My gripe with the tree is the X’s and +’s. Odds and evens, dots and numbers. It’s a lot of information going on. It is however really nice that it fades into the background when you aren’t using it. I think it’s an under appreciated quality of the reticle. With simpler aiming points it would be ideal. It functions like an MSR or SCR when needed but also slides in with Xmas tree when needed. 15x it’s a little hard to see if you are running a holdover stage or something. 18x is perfectly fine.
The body of the scope is very much a Delta Stryker LOW made type. The internals from everything I can find are not. Ilya has a write up about it somewhere. I’m guessing they utilized the chassis to save cost.
The glass is baller, like really freaking good. I liked it much better than my Nightforce glass. I have several MK5’s and it’s a bit above them. The coatings they use have fantastic contrast and color.
Tool less turrets are the shit. The included zero stop Allen wrench is a great touch. The only reason I would consider getting rid of mine is for a 7-35 mk5 to standardize with all the rest of my stuff. Not because it’s any better in any way but because I have like 20 leupold products and this one German thing sitting on a rifle. Lol. Hope it helps.

 

[ShotgunDiesel]

7x,12x,15x,18x and 30

 

[Chickentoast]

^How many mils across can you view at 15X and 30X? Pics are cut off at edges...

 

[ShotgunDiesel]

^How many mils across can you view at 15X and 30X? Pics are cut off at edges...

30x is 6.2 in either direction. 15x is 12.4

 

[Chickentoast]

^Thanks, just as a comparative reference, XTR3 gives 7 mils @ 30X and ZCO is 7.2+ but only @27X.

 

[ShotgunDiesel]

^Thanks, just as a comparative reference, XTR3 gives 7 mils @ 30X and ZCO is 7.2+ but only @27X.

My mk5 T3 is right at 7 on 25 and right at 12 on 15x. The h59 is 12 at 15x also but it’s only a 3.6-18. That’s interesting info I had never compared before.

 

[Chickentoast]

My mk5 T3 is right at 7 on 25 and right at 12 on 15x. The h59 is 12 at 15x also but it’s only a 3.6-18. That’s interesting info I had never compared before.

Yes, I never gave it much importance, but after getting the XTR3, I think it really does make a big difference. Tried the MK5 also, and glass was very comparable to XTR3, but FOV was much smaller... just checked: XTR3 is ~8.4 mils @ 25X. I'll probably try a wide angle March next...

 

[Budrichard]

I don't shoot PRS either.
Purchased my Leica PRS last year from CameraLand with the L-4a reticle to mount on my AISA 6mm CM.
Most of my other optical equipment is Leica but I have scopes ranging from S&B, Leupold and Athlon.
For my application, bullseye long range shooting it's very nice at an attractive price point compared to ZCO and others.

$2200 is a good price.
-Richard

 

[FjallJager]

I am going to order the mil-hash model,

 

[hectorso27]

I don't shoot PRS either.
Purchased my Leica PRS last year from CameraLand with the L-4a reticle to mount on my AISA 6mm CM.
Most of my other optical equipment is Leica but I have scopes ranging from S&B, Leupold and Athlon.
For my application, bullseye long range shooting it's very nice at an attractive price point compared to ZCO and others.

$2200 is a good price.
-Richard

Hi, The 4A reticle is in second focal plane?

 

[gr8fuldoug]

We will have a couple of demo Leica PRS 5-30x56i - PRB illuminated's arriving this coming week if anyone is interested