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JAE-700 Query

S

Samuel1749

Private
Minuteman
Jun 29, 2010
13
0
36
Austin TX
Hey guys i know a LOT of people have ordered a JAE-700 and are currently "waiting" on its arrival but has anyone considered that it may be a scam? Ive spent the past 2 hours online trying to find definitive evidence that its legit and i cant find anything. Ive read a lot of people have talked to this "Lisa" who is telling them what the want to hear and keeps saying the production is getting delayed but so far i haven't seen one delivered. I see PLENTY of forum posts of people TWO-FOUR years ago saying they just ordered their JAE-700 and that it was due to arrive the next year then the year after that. Recently i read that it was supposed to be delivering in March/April of 2010 and now its been pushed back to October???

Is it just me or does the 400 dollar deposit up front and 100 dollar cancellation fee just seem like a scam? Ive got the parts lined up that i want on my model and i am ready to order it but theres no way im giving 400 bucks to a website company that has yet to deliver ONE order. Doesn't this seem a little fishy to ANYONE else??

I understand custom orders but the website went up 4 years ago and i havent seen ONE person get their 700 yet...
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

They really do make the JAE-100 M1A stock, which is really very nice, and certainly quite real. I've had a few conversations with Lisa on the phone to iron out issues with the JAE-100 and Gen2 JAE-100 stocks, and she was friendly and helpful.

I doubt it's a scam, although it looks like that product has certainly dragged on for way too long...

I never heard about the $100 cancellation fee, though. That's not quite right.
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Samuel1749</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Sorry i live in Texas. Not an option. </div></div>

If you would have filled out your profile then Ranger might have known that you werent down the street from them. As far as a scam, it does seem like BS to put a deposit down then have a bit of it NR. I have copped a feel of the M1A version and its pretty nice I would think the Rem 700 would be on par with that but for some reason they cannot seem to get this thing out of the gate.
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

There is a word for that, its called VAPORWARE! Google it.
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

I don't believe it is a scam in the strictest sense of the word, but it certainly is a pretty questionable business practice to drag customers along for such a long time with hollow promises and no real facts or information to justify/explain the delays. These stocks have been vaporware for at least 3 years that I am aware of...always with JAE standing behind their mantra of "its coming soon" all while quietly maintaining the position that their lead times are purely estimates and are subject to change without notice! (WELL NO $H!T)!!

Now...I can't question their product quality. The JAE-100 M1A stocks are VERY nice setups, well-made, durable and arguably one of the finest stocks/chassis setups available for that platform. I am sure that when (or if) they ever get the 700 chassis to market that it will be of the same quality. I am just glad that I'm not one of the folks on the hook for the $400 deposit that are stuck between a rock and a hard place!
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: USMCj</div><div class="ubbcode-body">There is a word for that, its called VAPORWARE! Google it. </div></div>

Unobtanium.....

do you want the full list?
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

It smells like BS to me..... I looked into these 2 years ago...

Why does it take 4 years to produce a stock... Hell I could have taken a block of metal and my wife's nail file and had one already.

I guess its a wait and see.
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LFOD1776</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I never heard about the $100 cancellation fee, though. That's not quite right.</div></div>

Yeah if you go to their order form page you can click and see that on the bottom of the order form it says this in small red writing...

"SHIPPING AND OTHER RATES:
Shipping within 48 States:$30.00 per Stock and $12.00 per shipment of Options that are not shipped with stock/Alaska & Hawaii $45.00 per Stock and $17.00 per total shipments of Options
CANCELLATION FEE: $100.00 per stock"

I understand that people have gotten their JAE-100 but with today's economy i wouldn't put it past them that they may in fact be going bankrupt and are still just "taking orders". I'm sure there is no way they could rob everyone of their $400 deposit but if they run this on forever they will get a lot of $100 cancellation fees. That's if they don't just up and disappear altogether. If you look at the link i posted you can also note that as far back as February they have had a "30% off discount" for their accessories as quite the little incentive bonus to placing your order with them this year.

IDK its all just very disconcerting and there is hardly ANY research explaining this. Ill message them at their email and see what they have to say. I'm sure i'll be speaking to a "Lisa" very soon. Ill get back to you guys on this.

.Dave
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

Another VERY fishy thing to note. Check out this Credit card information form that you have to mail in if you order by CC.

http://www.jallenenterprises.com/orderdetails.htm

"Form of payment (Credit Card or Check)

* Credit Card Form (Downloadable PDF)
* Please DO NOT e-mail credit card information"

Not very many ONLINE businesses wont do billing online...strange.
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

Samuel1749, if the delay and their policies have you concerned, choose another stock maker.

I know Lisa, she knows their product line and has never mis-led me, I do not see her scamming anyone.

When we projected a delivery date on a recent project we sold out of the first production run before making the first delivery and were late. We had half a dozen customers cancel their orders because we could not deliver in a manner to suite their expectations. Each one of these cost us;

1. the initial credit card charges
2. the time to process the initial order
3. the time to address the customers concern(s)
4. the charges associated with a refund to credit card

So having a policy of a $100.00 cancellation fee would limit such situations and make the potential customer really decide if they want to proceed, in other words, limit the problem customers.

My opinion, your public posting and suggestion of them scamming people and possibly going bankrupt the same day you join SH is troubling. Furthermore all of your expressed anxiety and accusations are without foundation as you have by your own OP have ZERO first hand experience in dealing with Lisa or ordering the stock in question.

I'd say the 100.00 cancellation fee has been validated.
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

Kasey,

I don't have a dog in this hunt but to call someone who has been on the hook for 3-4 years for a product which is ridiculously far past its due date, a "problem customer" because the company eats some CC fees is stretching it.
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

good point smokshwn, and had Samuel1749 been on that proverbial hook, I'd posted differently.
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

Kasey i wasn't saying that i was positive they were scamming people out of their money. But perhaps they bit off more than they could chew when they announced the JAE-700 two years ago at the Shot Show. And as far as how long i have been a registered member with SH (one day) you should consider it an act of good faith i found this site to be the best possible source for the answers to my "anxiety" as you put it.

As far as "first hand experience" is concerned... I now have it.
Lisa emailed me back 3 hours later today. This is what she wrote.


"Hi Dave,



We showed the first prototype of the JAE-700 RSA at Shot Show 2008. It started out as a look-a-like version of our JAE-100 G2 but with a chassis to fit the bolt action. After feedback, further testing, and development, we have implemented changes and improvements to the JAE-700 product and process that allow us to launch the Short Actions (RSA) and Long Actions (RLA) simultaniously because of certain commonality features. The Aluminum Chassis is built to withstand the recoil on a .338, even if you have the Short Action version.



When you see the inside of the stock, it will be self evident that it is not a traditional bedding system. In an effort to protect our proprietary product, we are not showing detailed pictures until we start production which should be sometime by the end of the year prior to Shot Show. The JAE-700 will be displayed at Shot Show this January in Las Vegas if you want to wait and see it in person.



A deposit secures a place in line and locks you into the price and promotion (if applicable). The cancellation fee of $100.00 covers credit card and processing fees. For customers who have ordered the JAE-700 stocks and waited a long time past the estimated delivery date, we have been waiving the cancellation fee if they decided to cancel.



Due to the addition of machined parts and increased costs of manufacturing the final product, the price is increasing to $799.00 for the Basic Stock of the JAE-700 (Short and Long Action) starting July 1, 2010. Also, the promotion of 30% off Accessories will be ending tomorrow for the 700 stocks. For those who have pre-ordered prior to that date, they are locked in to the price at the time of their order. It only goes up for orders placed July 1st and after.



Estimated lead time for pre-orders placed now is Feb/March based on us starting production of backorders before the end of the year.



Our M1A/M14 stocks have been shipping for over 4 ½ years and have had great reviews. Below is some of the customer feedback on the JAE-100 G2 stocks that we’ve received through e-mails. If you would like to see pictures of the G2 stocks for color reference, please let me know."

To which she went on to send me 20+ long user reviews. Now ive got a few thoughts on this. A few thoughts indeed.



1. The 30% discount is an off and on reoccurring promotion over the past year. If u click my link you can see that ad was from the month of Feb. with the same discount.

2. What are the odds the price of the JAE-700 is going up from 699 to 799 tomorrow. I'm surprised they didn't use that on their website as an incentive to buy now. But as it stands there is no notice of this anywhere on their website.

3. A previous thread i read said a man was told his order was pushed back from march/april of this year to October and now she says it will be released in Feb/March of NEXT year? Come on give me a break. Many people don't shop online with the readiness to wait 9 months for their product let alone people who have been waiting 3+ years.

4. I have "ZERO first hand experience" because i did my RESEARCH before giving this company with a shaky "foundation" my hard earned money. And my research shows that this company is nowhere near ready for production at least not for another year.

I WILL however be keeping my eye on them from now on and hopefully after a year or 2 has passed they'll be on the market and in customers hands. I think asking this query on SH was a very reasonable idea seeing as how it will inform many potential buyers with the knowledge ive sought after over the past week.

I didn't mean to step on your toes Kasey, i'm sure Lisa is a lovely lady.
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

What Kasey said.

This guy sounds more like somebody with an ulterior motive, rather than a genuinely interested customer. I don't buy it. Why join and post here instead of emailing or calling JAE first? Smells.

I've spoken with and emailed back and forth with Lisa numerous times. She, and her company, are legit.

To be clear, I am one of the customers who has had his chassis and accessories ordered ($400 deposit and all) for a LONG time, now. They REALLY need to go ahead and finish R&D on the 700 chassis, but I'm not worried about their honesty. In the meantime, I'm rockin' a TacMod!
smile.gif
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

Hi Dave,

I'm glad you got a reply from Lisa, my suggestion remains if you cannot over-come your anxiety about doing business with them, go with your gut and buy elsewhere.

My issue with your post is you suggest that they are scamming people, then you suggest they are going bankrupt and now state they are a company with a "shaky foundation". All of this based on what? the fact they have pushed out a delivery date???

And more to the point of your state of mind you make no concession to this part of her reply which shows a understanding for those that have waited long enough:

"A deposit secures a place in line and locks you into the price and promotion (if applicable). The cancellation fee of $100.00 covers credit card and processing fees. For customers who have ordered the JAE-700 stocks and waited a long time past the estimated delivery date, we have been waiving the cancellation fee if they decided to cancel."

If I may suggest another approach, how about;

"Does anyone here have first hand experience with JAE Stocks, especially with the JAE-700 stock. Then follow that with how long have you waited?"

Can you detect the difference in the approach?

Last, your clumsiness is noted, my toes are fine thank you. The last time I spoke to Lisa was before 2010 SHOT. Be assured, she is a asset to this industry as she has intimate knowledge of their product line and has indicated no tendency to mis-lead her customers to me.

Take care and enjoy the hide, it really the best.
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

I definitely have no ulterior motive chainring. I'm currently in the process of building my first long rifle kit/package/unit/thingy and i guess i was just butt hurt when i saw how sexy that stock was yet they didn't have a solid release date for it yet. Seemed a bit unreal the string of bad luck the stock has had. I spent the past few days looking into the JAE-700 so i wouldn't say im not a "genuinely interested customer". If anything im VERY interested i simply didn't call JAE first bc i wasn't sure how legit they were. And seeing as how long the stock has been delayed i honestly don't think my skepticism was unjustified.

I apologize in my bluntness on the subject but i cant help it that that's honestly what i thought. Kasey i know i could of asked for first hand experience about the JAE-700 but my research online told me that nobody has one yet heh. It's just a wait'n see for now. Thank you all for your insight and input.

.Dave
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

Dave and all others,

Was the cancellation fee in effect when you placed your order, or was this something added later?

Just asking, Its not on my copy of my order.
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

I'm not quite sure Denz but it is on the current order form at the very bottom. Lisa's recent email to me makes it sound as though its always been in effect.

"A deposit secures a place in line and locks you into the price and promotion (if applicable). The cancellation fee of $100.00 covers credit card and processing fees. For customers who have ordered the JAE-700 stocks and waited a long time past the estimated delivery date, we have been waiving the cancellation fee if they decided to cancel."

If you email them im sure Lisa will have an answer for you within a day.

[email protected]
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

So I just have to ask Sam, why is it the first thing you do when you come to this house is bitch? 8 Posts, all here on this subject. Blank profile, no data and a bad experience with a business. You are not making a solid first impression, nope, not at all.
Anyone who knows special maching processes, Design to CAD to trial, test, then back to CAD knows the process can take a while(read years). Would YOU release a product that has not met your own goals to a shooter like yourself until it was properly tested then set up for proper manufacture to insure only the highest quality came off the line? I do not think JAE would either.
I waited months for a scope, months for a stock and that was stuff that was already well past the testing and design phase and well into production. Preproduction? Man, that takes a long time. Tooling, process lines, shoot, tons of stuff to do it right to the scale these people are doing. Take a moment to step outside of your wee corner of the picture and look at the whole frame for a while. See it for what it is, a large picture that takes a lot more understanding than you are giving it.
Just my thoughts.
Man, 8 posts, all bitching, little substance
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

My GOD dude calm down. I wasn't "bitching" I joined bc i had a question i needed answered and it already has been. I behaved very maturely and I thanked everyone for their input. This topic is over. I didnt join to make a profile and stay on this site every day all day long like Mr. 9k Posts Lookin To Make 10k here. This is a forum...ANYONE and EVERYONE can come here and ask their questions and they don't need your negativity added to bring them down and make them feel foolish. It doesn't help. Almost everyone joins a forum to LEARN more and find ANSWERS to questions. People like you are why newbies leave forums in the first place. Ill be sure to PM you ALL of my future questions and make sure they are up to your standards and approval. Now hows THAT for bitching...


And as far as first impressions go, in between your insults, thanks for your input also... pshh lol what a joke
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Samuel1749</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm not quite sure Denz but it is on the current order form at the very bottom. Lisa's recent email to me makes it sound as though its always been in effect.

"A deposit secures a place in line and locks you into the price and promotion (if applicable). The cancellation fee of $100.00 covers credit card and processing fees. For customers who have ordered the JAE-700 stocks and waited a long time past the estimated delivery date, we have been waiving the cancellation fee if they decided to cancel."

If you email them im sure Lisa will have an answer for you within a day.

[email protected] </div></div>

Samuel1749 - Waiting is a bitch... but since you seem to not want to wait any longer (which I don't blame you) maybe you should take the advice of the previous posters and just cancel your order. The email from Lisa clearly states that the $100 cancellation fee will be WAIVED. Get your money back and get another stock OR wait until JAE has a production JAE-700 IN STOCK and pay them what ever theyre asking at that time.

What else can you do about it? Nothing. Also why I personally DO NOT order BIG items if its not "in stock"... usually.

On another note its bad juju to "badmouth" a company on here without solid EVIDENCE per say. This aint "gossiphide". If I were you I'd edit the title of this thread and remove the word "Scam". Just giving you a heads up.
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

I appreciate the thread title edit.

It IS reasonable to inquire about the stock.

Welcome to the 'Hide!
smile.gif
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SNIPERS4DUMMIES</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Look into the Aries belt fed uppers, they held some peoples monies for 7+ years </div></div>

that would be "the shrike" uppers, and they are still pretty much non-existent on the open market.
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

Samuel1749, I too appreciate the title change and again, asking questions is always good, making un-founded accusations never is.


pupdawg, he has not placed the order.
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

I found this thread before starting a build based around a Remington 700 Varmint SF in .308, and ended up preordering a short action stock based in part on my conversation with Lisa and their currently existing JAE100 product.

If I don't get the stock around April as promised, they indicated they'd have no problem not charging me a cancellation charge. Options, colors, etc. will be confirmed before the actual build in case I change my mind, which I'll likely do regarding one or two details.

In short, I don't think they'll fold or go out of business considering the success of the JAE100 product already on the market, and I can get my $$$ back if I don't get what I want when I want it. Not much more I can ask for at this point.

JD
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SNIPERS4DUMMIES</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Look into the Aries belt fed uppers, they held some peoples monies for 7+ years </div></div>

Its alot more then that. They started taking money in 1999. And that was $1k for pre-orders.
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

I simply refuse to hand over money to any business who does not have actual product in stock. Period.

Companies who continue to take 'deposits' when they do not have product immediately ready for shipment, have suckers for customers.

Refuse to be a sucker. Later, you won't have to cry about getting screwed.
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

Yorba Linda California... North Orange County (figures)

I had a issue with WOLF ammo where it kept jamming into my ar-15's it was a hassle and they where out of yorba linda as well. well the cs dept was.

nice looking stocks though
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: farmboy28</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Yorba Linda California... North Orange County (figures)

I had a issue with WOLF ammo where it kept jamming into my ar-15's it was a hassle and they where out of yorba linda as well. well the cs dept was.

nice looking stocks though</div></div>

Last person to screw me out of $300 lives in Yorba Linda. What an interesting coincidence.
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

I was looking at getting one of these stocks a ways back, (almost a year and some change ago), and its still not out.

This reminds me of the wait time we've been dealing with trying to get one of the RED Scarlet video cameras...

I hate vaporware. If you dont have it, dont advertise it.
 
Re: JAE-700 Scam?

So this must mean the HK MR556 is a scam as well..........hmmm I wonder if HK knows that?.......
 
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