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James River Armory 03A4?

dbateman

Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Apr 6, 2010
906
3
41
Mt Isa QLD, Australia
Hi guys I have an opportunity to get an 03A4 for a pretty good price it is a James River re'po.

Any one had any experience with this companies work ?

It has a repo 2.5x scope on it.

I know its not the real thing I just want a nice shooter and we don't see these come up very often over here.

Thanks.
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

G'day,
I'm no expert on these but here's what I can tell you from my limited research. It seems these repro's are getting better as we go along. Apparently the ones made a few years ago (like some of the earlier Gibbs) were made kind of sloppily and the optics were pretty crappy. It appears that due to the popularity, other makers have been producing these and doing a better job. Even the newer scopes are better. Still Chinese... But better. I've seen them for sale on the auction sites for under $1,000.00 but that's here. No idea what they'll bring Down Under. Hopefully someone with more hands-on experience will chime in.

Cheers,
John
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

Thanks John.

I haven't been able to find much info on them a few reviews but all I could find has been positive.
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

James River has not been making the A4 very long so I am sure you prob will not find many reviews. I picked up a sporter 1903A3 and had it built into a A4. It had the org barrel installed and was a Sept 43 measuring a 1 at the muz and 3 at the throat. I put a lyman alaskan on mine and I am very pleased with it.
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

I own a James River 03A4 repro. I've had it since back around Christmas time, and it's a good rifle. It has the newer version of the Leatherwood 2.5X scope, and it is also quite serviceable. I have been shooting it in preparation for the vintage sniper match at Camp Perry, and I've been very happy with it. I know two other Shooters with JRA 03A4's and both of them have had minor issues, so quality control may be a bit lax. For me though, it's been a reliable accurate title.

HRF
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

I believe you mean the M73 scope. Some later rebuilt may be seen with M84 scope or Lyman alaskan scopes. But Leatherwood ART II scopes did not exsist until after the 1903A4 rifle was retired. The ART scopes were used on the XM-21 and M-21 rifles and to a little extent on M-24's. The James River rifles comes with a Chinese made copy of the M73 not a Leatherwood.
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

I was just trying to abbreviate my post. The scope is, in fact, an M73 reproduction, manufactured in China, and sold by Leatherwood.

HRF
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

OK it here and for the most part I am happy with it.

However I think it has the earlier production scope on it, its only serial No. 8** and it's a bit rough, I have sent Hi Lux an email and I am sure we can sort it out.

I havent had a chance to get it to the range yet but I will update when I do.
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

If it's one of the newer ones, it should be marked "M73G2". The older ones were marked "M73B2" (if my memory serves correctly). The serial number on mine is only 771, so I wouldn't be too worried about that. Posted below are the spec's I got from Hi Lux when I contacted them about it. I hope you find them useful.

M73G2 SCOPE SPECIFICATION


(1) Model No.: M73G2
(2) Power: 2.5X
(3) Objective Lens: 16mm
(4) F.O.V. AT 100 Yard: 24.09feet
(5) Eye Relief: 3.54”
(6) Length: 11.8” (300mm)
(7) Weight: 8.3 O.Z.
(8) Main Tube: ¾”
(9) Reticle: Fine Crosshairs
(10) E / W Adjustment: ½ MOA per Click, 60 click ( 30 MOA )per full turn .
(11) Total Min. Adjustment for both Elevation and Windage: 50 MOA
25MOA Up and Down (Total Min. Adjustment: 50 MOA elevation);
25 MOA Left and Right ( Total Min. adjustment: 50 MOA Windage).


HRF
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

How do you think it compares to the Gibbs???

I've sold a few of my C&Rs to reinvest in one of the 1903A4 reproduction and I'm torn. I'm not sure who manufactures the barrel for the Gibbs but James River states their barrel is a Criterion/Kreiger.
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

The Gibbs / Rock Ridge are supposed to be Shaw barrels. I ordered a JRA rifle yesterday. The guy I spoke with said Gibbs is no longer in business, and that Rock Ridge has taken over their contracts / business for producing the 1903A4 reproductions, and that they use Shaw barrels (or at least he said that's what is supposed to be on them). JRA uses Criterion/Kreiger barrels. When I get my JRA rifle in, I'll post some thoughts on it.
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 1kHIT</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The Gibbs / Rock Ridge are supposed to be Shaw barrels. I ordered a JRA rifle yesterday. The guy I spoke with said Gibbs is no longer in business, and that Rock Ridge has taken over their contracts / business for producing the 1903A4 reproductions, and that they use Shaw barrels (or at least he said that's what is supposed to be on them). JRA uses Criterion/Kreiger barrels. When I get my JRA rifle in, I'll post some thoughts on it.
</div></div>

Excellent...thank you.
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

James River Armory built an LRB-based M14 clone a few years ago. I was extremely pleased with the quality of their work. Also, the other clones that I saw were very nice.

I would deal with them again if I had the funds.
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

Talked w/ "Gaye" at JRA - got my tracking number so my 1903a4 should be here by the end of this week! Hoping for good weather to shoot and take pics. I'll try and post a review when I get it in and have had a change to shoot it for group. Needless to say, I'm pretty excited. For the record, working with JRA has been a top-notch experience, so far!
laugh.gif
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

Got the rifle in today! I am not a fan of the small 2.5x scope that comes on them, so I ordered mine without the hi-lux scope. I got a decent discount, so I was happy. I have a Weaver K4 60-B scope I mounted. Mark at JRA said that to mount the scope just call Brownells and tell them what scope I am planning on using and they'll be able to get me the correct rings. He said Leupold rings will fit the Redfield Jr. mounts, and they do! I got the rings in earleir this week First impressions are as follows.

The action is WAY smoother than the Gibbs I had about 2 years ago. I had to work to smooth the action up on the Gibbs and the JRA rifle is nice straight out of the box. The wood and metal fit and finish is in a word: superb. I cannot say more than that, it really is that good. The trigger will require some work, however. I'm hoping it will smooth up a little during use. If not, I'll have to have it worked on. Also, the material used on the Redfield Jr. mounts is not too strong, IMO. I felt as if I could damage it easily when tightening down screws, or installing the rings. I'll see when I shoot it, and hopefully all will hold firm. I plan get some pics up later on tonight when I get back home, and possibly shoot it tomorrow or Saturday if the weather cooperates.
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

Got a chance to go out early this morning and shoot the 1903a4 by JRA. As I mentioned above, the quality of the workmanship is superb! I couldn't have asked for a nicer rifle, IMO. In with the weapon, JRA includes a flyer about needing to tighten down the rear trigger guard screw after each shooting session. In fact, they go on to claim ZERO warranty liability if the stock cracks due to firing the weapon with the screw loose. My screw, sadly, could stand to be about 1/4" longer, as only TWO threads even bite into the threading on the rear tang of the receiver. I'll address this with JRA later this morning. Now, here are a couple of pics from when I first got to the range showing the rifle with the Weaver K4 scope on it.

IMG_0469.jpg


IMG_0471.jpg


After sighting it in at 25 yards, I moved back to 100 yards. Windage was pretty much right on from the beginning, which I was glad, since I'd spent a fair bit of time at home last night doing a simplified "boresighting" down in my basement getting the rifle set up. I planned on using a 300 yards zero, which BulletFlight for my iPhone said should put the rounds 4.25" high at 100 yards. I had Prvi Partizan 150gr FMJ, and some Sellier & Bellot 168gr HPBTM rounds. The bulk of the rounds I plan on using are the Prvi ones. After getting it sighted in for what I wanted at 100 yards, I put up a new target and shot 4 rounds of Prvi for group. The Weaver K4 is only a 4-power scope, and for me being used to scopes with MUCH more magnification, this took some getting used to. The group is shown below:

IMG_0474.jpg


The trigger pull came set right about 5.5lbs. It is very smooth, but it is much heavier than I've been used to on other rifles in the past. I was pretty pleased with the results, given the extremely cheap ammo, that many reviews just said it's "very reliable". It works great for me, IMO. The left flyer could've been the wind gusting up to 10MPH, as there was a pretty steady 5-7MPH wind from a straight 3 o'clock position. I adjusted down about 1", as I could see that I was still about 1" high at 100 yards from where I wanted to be. I then shot some 168gr's to see how they might group. These are the results for the 4 shots:

IMG_0475.jpg


Once again, it was probably me and this time my breathing, but 3 were good, and 1 was low. That, and again, I'm MUCH more used to a higher power scope than a 4x one, but I wanted to keep it somewhat 'old style'. The S&B rounds grouped fairly well, especially so if I discount the one pulled low!
frown.gif


All in all, this is a fun rifle to shoot, and I'm glad I have it in my collection. I'm going to look into some trigger options, and see what I can do to lighted the pull. I'm also going to address the very short screw for the guard with JRA. That being said, I love the gun! On youtube, MAC TV does a review of the Gibbs rifle, and he makes a comment about "stout recoil", and the rifle being "silly accurate". He shot a much better group than I, and he wasn't kidding about the accuracy. However, he very much understated the recoil. That steel buttplate, combined with a 150gr bullet coming out at 2910 fps smarts! My shoulder definitely felt it by the end of the morning. LOL! Well, that's the end of my initial experience. JRA has been great to work with so far, and the quality of their product is just plain amazing, IMO. Later! Jason
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

Wonder if they have used the right screw?

My smith had a similar issue with his Gibbs...turned out to be a screw from a Krag or something similar, not the correct Springfield version. His stock cracked first time out.
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

My stock didn't crack, or have any issues, but I DID order a set from Brownell's. JRA, being an hour ahead of me, and closing at 3PM, I wasn't able to get a hold of them. Strange that both a Gibbs AND my JRA would have the same 'issue'. I'm confident that given the longer screw from Brownell's, the rifle will function flawlessly (as long as I do my part!) LOL!!
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

Couldn't see the pics earlier but they're there now....looks good and it shoots pretty well. Keep "doing your part"!
wink.gif


Made the mistake of shooting my 1903 a couple of weeks back with only a t-shirt on and with that meat hammer chequered butt plate....predictable and colourful results on the shoulder!
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?



IMG_0469.jpg


IMG_0471.jpg


Very nice looking rifle- I`m beginning to think about getting one.

What are the markings in the scope base?
- can`t quite make them out

Is the barrel marked on the end of the muzle like the original military barrels were?
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 1kHIT</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The Gibbs / Rock Ridge are supposed to be Shaw barrels. I ordered a JRA rifle yesterday. The guy I spoke with said Gibbs is no longer in business, and that Rock Ridge has taken over their contracts / business for producing the 1903A4 reproductions, and that they use Shaw barrels (or at least he said that's what is supposed to be on them). JRA uses Criterion/Kreiger barrels. When I get my JRA rifle in, I'll post some thoughts on it.
</div></div>

I'd be interested in who told you about Gibbs not being in business any longer, as I have supplied leather M73B1 scope caps to Gibbs & never received payment, even after several emails from them promising that funds would be forthcoming!!
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

The recoil is a unique experince for me with this type of rifle and a steel butt plate. LOL!

The markings are serial numbers. They match the receiver.

Mark at JRA is who told me about Gibbs not being around.

Thanks for the comments. Looking forward to much more shooting with this rifle this week if I get a chance.
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

Got off the phone with Mark at JRA. It appears they know the rear guard screw is too short. He told me that when the 1903 went to the 1903A3, there was enough difference that the screws were now too short for the rear guard screw to reach fully into the rear tang. He said that's a design flaw from the original. Hmph. At any rate, he acknowledged there are after market screws that are longer, but he said they may be too long, so just I'm just going to have to live with it. I told him only two threads from the screw even made purchase in the rear tang, and that tightening them much more than thumb tight brings a very serious risk of stripping the screw. He again just said they were all short on the original 1903a4's.
frown.gif


That being said, when I get the longer screws I ordered from Brownell's, I'll see how they fit. If they are indeed too long, I"ll file down the screw somewhat and see how that goes.

In either case, IMHO, this is a key detail that, to date, seems to have been left out of many on-line reviews of this type of rifle, and wanted to make sure others are aware of this before purchasing, as it could be a deal-maker, or a deal-breaker for them. It would've been for me. As it is, if I only have to spend another $10 (that includes shipping), and the rifle then, in my mind, is 'better', then I can live with that. More to follow later this week.
laugh.gif
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

Turning down a screw shouldn't be a big deal....but interesting to hear it described as an original design flaw.

Hadn't heard that before.

Not entirley sure I would believe it myself....after all, how many hundreds of thousands of 1903A3's were produced. It can't have been too hard for a manufacturing change to be effected, even in wartime, if a design fault (or simple part) risked rendering a weapon - with strong recoil, designed for rough handling and use in combat - useless after a couple of shots??

After a couple of googles - can't find any mention of this as a known flaw/weakpoint on original rifles (assume either my google-fu is weak or it isn't there to be found?)

Will be interested to check through the books when I get home to see if I can find it mentioned.

It was certainly a "breaker" for my smith's Gibbs stock!! I'll have to check with him what made him think it was a Krag screw rather than an original.

Just good that you spotted that before it did any damage to yours!
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

BasraBoy,

Thanks, and yeah, good that it didn't bother mine! The "it's a design flaw" is what prompted my "Hmph." LOL! There is a bushing that goes between the rear guard and the rear tang, to prevent over tightening of the screw and bending down the tang. That being said, I am at a real loss to see why the screw wasn't made even 1/8 of an inch longer!!! I mean, if you are going to go to all the effort to produce a product that, IMO, is better, quality-wise, than a rifle issued back in 1943, why not go ahead and spend an extra $3 and use a screw that would go at least 1/2 way into the rear tang!!! I'm not saying I'm going to tighten it down to 150 in/lbs of torque, but I am going to tighten it up pretty good, and will probably secure it with a small dab of Loc Tite. I don't plan on breaking the action from the stock on a routine basis, so to me, having to "tighten back down the rear guard screw after each shooting session" is just plain wrong, IMO. Don't get me wrong, this really is just splitting hairs for me, as I'm totally satisfied with the quality of the rifle in every way. This is something that will be only a minor inconvenience for me to fix myself, but I DO want it make sure it's fixed, at least in my mind. Sorry for your smith's Gibbs stock - THAT would really set me off, if that had've happened to me!
frown.gif
Later, Jason.
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

Jason, would you mind posting a link or a product number for the screw you ordered from Brownells?

HRF
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

hrfunk,

Here is the part number I used:319-414-306WB. Under the various tabs showing the info, it clearly states for Springfield rifles, and a couple of the Q/A comments shows how these screws go farther into the rear tang, whereas many 'original' ones only has 1-2 threads going in. Hope this helps.

Jason
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 1kHIT</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Sorry for your smith's Gibbs stock - THAT would really set me off, if that had've happened to me!
frown.gif
Later, Jason. </div></div>

Yeh..he was pretty pi55ed!! The worst bit was he contacted Gibbs and the Big Cheese (can't remember his name, but it's in Paul's article) promise a replacement stock free of charge. But surprise, surprise nothing ever showed up. Now maybe that is because we are in the UK...or maybe not. We'll never know. But it was yet another example of how not to deal with your customers. Maybe one day kids at business school or anybody working in sales/marketing/CS should be made to study The Gibbs Rifle Company?

If they have gone for good, I know one Brit who won't be sorry to see the back of them!

Shame saddler seems to have lost out too, I've got a number of his repro leather bits for my various rifles and he is another enthusiastic and knowledgable guy supporting classic/vintage rifle users.

Anyway, enough of the Gibbs stuff, this is a positive thread about the JRA.....glad you got your 03A4 and that you're happy.

Now...go enjoy it!
smile.gif
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

Basra,

Thanks guy! Hope you have a GREAT time shooting as well. Now, if ONLY someone over here would make a JRA-quality replica of the Number 4, Mark 1 "T", I'd have a smile a mile wide!!!! LOL!!
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 1kHIT</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Got off the phone with Mark at JRA. <span style="color: #FF0000">It appears they know the rear guard screw is too short. He told me that when the 1903 went to the 1903A3, there was enough difference that the screws were now too short for the rear guard screw to reach fully into the rear tang. He said that's a design flaw from the original.</span> He again just said they were all short on the original 1903a4's.
frown.gif

</div></div>

I don't know JRA from a hole in the ground, never met them, never had any dealings with them...

Mark at JRA IS telling the truth!!

The short screw is a <span style="font-weight: bold">KNOWN ISSUE</span> with the M1903A3<span style="font-style: italic"> (& by default the M1903A4)</span>

I have an old B&W publication by the US NRA on the Springfield Rifle. The book comprises a whole series of articles & such, plus quite a few reprints of the most common questions asked in the Rifleman magazine.

One specific article addresses exactly this problem - the screw is too short. What they say to do in the article is get a spare screw, cut the end off - then file a notch in the underside. Screw this in from below until it is flush with the upper, then insert the std screw as per normal...
IF I can find the booklet I will scan the article in question...

Hope this puts some minds at rest!
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

Saddler,

I'm glad to know the short screw is a known issue, but I'm having trouble following in my mind your solution as per the magazine article. As BasraBoy mentioned earlier, it can't be THAT hard to have made a screw a little longer. Not sure why they didn't, but that's neither here nor there, now.

I'd be quite happy to read the article if you ever do come across it again. Thanks for sharing your insight.
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

saddler- thanks for the clarification.

You live and learn!
wink.gif


Stunned that this would have not been remedied during original production, let alone by guys offering remanufactured rifles.
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

+1


[/quote]Stunned that this would have not been remedied during original production, let alone by guys offering remanufactured rifles. [/quote]
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

As you guys will be well aware, the M1903A3 was a bit lacking in refinements & war-time conditions dictated that it was made from a few parts that were stamped, not as well finished, etc.

Rather than use a screw that was purely fit-for-purpose for the 03A3's only, they went with the std M1903 series screw & left a hole!

I've had the booklet longer than I've owned my M1903A4, and even though I've read it cover to cover several times I've not bothered to follow the advice re. the hole as it's not a big issue for me...it's just part of how the rifle was made.

The scan below is from <span style="font-style: italic">"The M1903 Springfield Rifle"</span>, 1986 - (8th ed.), NRA, Washington D.C.
...I have another NRA booklet - <span style="font-style: italic">"Model 1903 Springfield Rifles"</span> 1989 (1992, 3rd ed.); this latter one is totally different re. contents

M1903A3screw.jpg


Hope this helps!!
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

That's a great article. However, doesn't really address what my concerns are. My concerns are there are only 2 threads from the screw making purchase in the threaded hole in the rear of the tang. Just adding a 'cap screw' in the top of the tang, won't really make it any stronger. I'm not concerned with there being an 'unfilled' hole, I just want the rear screw to make more purchase for added strength. The after market screw from Brownell's should be in today, so hopefully I can report later how it works.
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

Got in the screw today. Here is a picture of the difference between them:

IMG_0477.jpg


The Forrester screw went in without any problems, and NO, when fully tightened, it didn't protrude out the top, like some people claim it would. See next photo:

IMG_0478.jpg


Yeah, the screw is a slightly different color, but it's entirely contained in the rear guard hole, and unless I turn the rifle over, it isn't even noticeable. But more importantly, in my mind at least, it securely holds the way it was intended. A LOT more than 2 threads made purchase in the hole in the rear of the tang. Just a bit of info for anyone wanting to try a different screw; the one I listed above worked great for me. Hope this helps shine some light on things.

Jason
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

Ah - misread what the issue was.

At least now you have the longer screw you now also have the option of using the short one as a donor to cut up & follow what the above clipping suggests; if it floats your boat, that is.

Looks like a nice rifle - just glad I got lucky back when I did & picked up a genuine Remington A4 (the strangest part about me buying it was I'd been after <span style="font-weight: bold">an M1903 rifle</span>, <span style="font-style: italic">ANY VARIANT</span>, for getting on 5 years & the FIRST one I was offered - the A4 !)
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

Saddler!!!

Too funny! Neat how that worked out, being after one rifle, and the first one you get offered is that one! LOL! They really are a LOT of fun, and looking forward to running it again in the morning. Have a great one! Jason
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

I'll be ordering a couple of those longer screws today. Thanks for the info!

Keith
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

Thanks for the info about the tang screws. I ordered one from Brownells and received it in less than 48 hours without any special shipping. They come in a pair--front and back.

Did you happen to notice (I did) that Brownell's <span style="text-decoration: underline">front</span> tang screw is also longer than the original?
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

Actually, since I didn't seem to have any issues with the front tang screw, I didn't take it out to check - do you recommend replacing that one as well with the one from Brownell's?
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BasraBoy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If it ain't broke........ ?? </div></div>

Ehh....Good point!
laugh.gif
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

Sexual innuendo alert:

I don't know about you Basraboy, but I always prefer a long screw to a short one.
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

I ordered a 1903A4 from Creedmoor Sports this evening. Will post pics when it arrives.
 
Re: James River Armory 03A4?

Bravo, can't wait to see your pics! I hope you enjoy your rifle even half as much fun as I have enjoyed shooting mine!

What ammo are you planning on running through it?