Kayakers Help Wanted

[charnicus]

My girlfriend and I have been in the want for kayaks for some time now.

They will be used in small to medium lakes until we work up the confidence to get a little more advanced.

What are some good kayaks to look at for us starting out? Perhaps a middle of the road as such to avoid an upgrade for awhile. Paddles included. I’m hoping to pick some up second hand unless of course that isn’t the best way to go.

 

[Blutroop]

Hobie cat mirage tandem island. Has the foot Pedal propulsion system, outriggers to make a trimaran and a mast. You could actually pack camp gear with you. If you don’t wanna go all in like that just get the first decent deal you come across.. make em take y’all out in em to seal the deal and make sure it will work for ya. Lakes are a good safe way to work through the learning curve. Also if you have any touristy areas near you on a lake, you should be able to find a rental company and see if you like their style. Rental companies usually find designs that hold up well and work for the average person.

 

[carsonpass]

My girlfriend and I have been in the want for kayaks for some time now.

They will be used in small to medium lakes until we work up the confidence to get a little more advanced.

What are some good kayaks to look at for us starting out? Perhaps a middle of the road as such to avoid an upgrade for awhile. Paddles included. I’m hoping to pick some up second hand unless of course that isn’t the best way to go.

Find a couple of used 9 foot kayaks by Old Town Swiftys or the Perception model , should find used fro$100 to $300 depending condition gear; a good carbon or fiber.glass paddle is worth the extra dollars Ashe reduced weight and stiffness makes the biggest improvement to your paddling experience

 

[charnicus]

@carsonpass @Blutroop thank you guys for the responses.

We are definitely looking for separate kayaks. Nice to hear they can be had for such a good price. I’ll definitely keep the test drive in mind assuming that the distance is feasible for the seller. I’ll also look into a nearby rental company before purchase!

Again thanks guys. ?

 

[Feesh]

What’s your budget?

If you can find a local shop that allows you to demo/test paddle that will give you an idea of what you like.

I prefer “sit in” - my current ride is a Jackson Kilroy. Jackson makes a terrific boat, but they start around $1,000.

Paddle size is dictated by paddler height, boat width, and type of paddling (high or low angle).

I’ve had many deals on used boats from Craigslist or Facebook. Also, get a comfortable life jacket and wear it.

 

[charnicus]

What’s your budget?

If you can find a local shop that allows you to demo/test paddle that will give you an idea of what you like.

I prefer “sit in” - my current ride is a Jackson Kilroy. Jackson makes a terrific boat, but they start around $1,000.

Paddle size is dictated by paddler height, boat width, and type of paddling (high or low angle).

I’ve had many deals on used boats from Craigslist or Facebook. Also, get a comfortable life jacket and wear it.

I was looking about 400-500 per boat for a starter. Once my gf’s tattoo heals up we’re going to go test drive some of the rentals at a nearby small lake.

Sit in is what I’ve been looking at as I’d like to work up to going down the Sac river and the like.

High vs low angle. Is that a preference thing or dependent on sit in vs sit on?

For the second hand market are there some brands to stick to and brands to stay away from?

 

[Feesh]

High vs low angle is preference - REI has a good Article on it.

No real brands to stay away from, but look up the new price and make sure to pay much less. Look for any breaks in the seat or outfitting or any substantial damage to the bottom of the hull.

 

[charnicus]

High vs low angle is preference - REI has a good Article on it.

No real brands to stay away from, but look up the new price and make sure to pay much less. Look for any breaks in the seat or outfitting or any substantial damage to the bottom of the hull.

I’ll be sure to check that out.

Thanks for the inputs. ??

 

[Feesh]

Certainly. REI has some great gear articles. I learned most of what I know doing it the wrong way for years - if I can pass on some knowledge I’m happy to help!

 

[thejeep]

You mentioned getting more advanced than flat water in the future so I would recommend a white water boat now. A river runner like the liquid logic remix can paddle on the lake or any moving water you wish. Buy a used boat and get a descent paddle from Werner new. You can get skirt and helmet used.

Figure out how to paddle forward and back on a lake and get some instruction on how to roll. Once you can roll every time on flat water go find some class II and then the sky is the limit.

 

[charnicus]

Certainly. REI has some great gear articles. I learned most of what I know doing it the wrong way for years - if I can pass on some knowledge I’m happy to help!

I’ll have to check out their articles. Thanks!

 

[charnicus]

You mentioned getting more advanced than flat water in the future so I would recommend a white water boat now. A river runner like the liquid logic remix can paddle on the lake or any moving water you wish. Buy a used boat and get a descent paddle from Werner new. You can get skirt and helmet used.

Figure out how to paddle forward and back on a lake and get some instruction on how to roll. Once you can roll every time on flat water go find some class II and then the sky is the limit.

Is 9-10 feet the ideal length?

 

[Feesh]

I had a Dagger Mamba creeker for awhile - great white water and quick river boat, but tracked poorly on lakes and anything slow. Whitewater boats are a beast of their own. You’ll have much less fun paddling a whitewater boat on a lake, but if you plan to work into faster rivers that’s the ticket. I think my boat was just under 9 feet.

 

[charnicus]

I had a Dagger Mamba creeker for awhile - great white water and quick river boat, but tracked poorly on lakes and anything slow. Whitewater boats are a beast of their own. You’ll have much less fun paddling a whitewater boat on a lake, but if you plan to work into faster rivers that’s the ticket. I think my boat was just under 9 feet.

I saw Liquid Logic had a hybrid boat that was in between a whitewater (maybe more quick water) and lake boat. Their claim is that it’ll operate well in either condition.

9’ should load well in the back of a Taco well ?.

 

[Kayakfish1]

I fish and bowfish out of my kayak a bunch send my personal preference is a sit on top, I run a wilderness systems ride 135....its stupid stable and handles great.
Good choice on 2 singles vs a tandem....... she might not be your girlfriend for long if you went that route lol

 

[Feesh]

I fish and bowfish out of my kayak a bunch send my personal preference is a sit on top, I run a wilderness systems ride 135....its stupid stable and handles great.
Good choice on 2 singles vs a tandem....... she might not be your girlfriend for long if you went that route lol

I have a Pamlico 135 Tandem - the only other passenger is my dog.

 

[thejeep]

Is 9-10 feet the ideal length?

I’d say so. It really comes down to your ideal. Do you really want to paddle white water and just use flat water to learn? Then I’d get a whitewater boat 8.5-10’. I’m partial to planing or semi planing hulls vs displacement.

Also if you just want to get on whitewater with the gf the easiest consider a small raft like an Aire puma or the tributary counterpart.

 

[charnicus]

I’d say so. It really comes down to your ideal. Do you really want to paddle white water and just use flat water to learn? Then I’d get a whitewater boat 8.5-10’. I’m partial to planing or semi planing hulls vs displacement.

Also if you just want to get on whitewater with the gf the easiest consider a small raft like an Aire puma or the tributary counterpart.

That’s exactly it. Well ideally. I’m hoping I can trick at least one person I know into kayaking. Couldn’t imagine white water being a solo operation.

 

[thejeep]

It’s usually not(cough).

You have to meet the community.
Join a club would be easiest and quickest. Learn some basic skills and be able to get down your local river. When you feel ready show up at take out of your next river of choice and talk to who ever is there. Ask about running the river with them.

What part of the country are you in.?

 

[charnicus]

It’s usually not(cough).

You have to meet the community.
Join a club would be easiest and quickest. Learn some basic skills and be able to get down your local river. When you feel ready show up at take out of your next river of choice and talk to who ever is there. Ask about running the river with them.

What part of the country are you in.?

I never really thought of that as obvious as it should be.

I’m in the California Bay Area.

 

[Mr.BR]

For starters stay away from WW boats , they are slow and don't track so can kill the enthusiasm before you ever progress to WW paddling most people into kayak and canoeing never realy venture into white water paddling.

You set the budget quite low so choice will be in the low end rotomolded boats. next step up would be vac formed boats they are lighter, stiffer and generaly have less drag but are not as care free as rotomolded stuff.

Generaly i would avoid tandem boats they tend to end up not being used much as most are near useles without the second person or some other weight balancing them out , invest in better than basic paddles as they make all the difference .

Sit on tops might look fun but are slow as hell due to excesive width and generaly poor hull shapes.

 

[charnicus]

For starters stay away from WW boats , they are slow and don't track so can kill the enthusiasm before you ever progress to WW paddling most people into kayak and canoeing never realy venture into white water paddling.

You set the budget quite low so choice will be in the low end rotomolded boats. next step up would be vac formed boats they are lighter, stiffer and generaly have less drag but are not as care free as rotomolded stuff.

Generaly i would avoid tandem boats they tend to end up not being used much as most are near useles without the second person or some other weight balancing them out , invest in better than basic paddles as they make all the difference .

Sit on tops might look fun but are slow as hell due to excesive width and generaly poor hull shapes.

Im definitely not against both spending more and upgrading as the needs change.
Even if I decide later that white water ain’t going to be for me I can’t imagine I’d grow tired of paddling through calm water. Tahoe, Lake Shasta, etc.

My first round with a Kayak was in the Pacific Ocean many years ago in a sit on and wasn’t a fan. I never felt I was connected and the high center of gravity made it hard to manage.

Tandem is a definite hell no for me. Just as you said I’d be alone in it 99.23% of the time.

 

[Mr.BR]

Its just much less fun if things are not moving anywhere. More advanced the users,longer faster boats they use.

Sit on tops can have CG as low as other kayaks altough usualy not in an effort too keep your ass dry as possible, they are also more stable hulls due to being wider in general but what is lacking is the 3 point conection hull to body (ass , and thighs ) that adds stability and control over the hull.

Am more of a canoe guy but have built plenty of kayaks as well.

 

[charnicus]

Its just much less fun if things are not moving anywhere. More advanced the users,longer faster boats they use.

Sit on tops can have CG as low as other kayaks altough usualy not in an effort too keep your ass dry as possible, they are also more stable hulls due to being wider in general but what is lacking is the 3 point conection hull to body (ass , and thighs ) that adds stability and control over the hull.

Am more of a canoe guy but have built plenty of kayaks as well.

Yeah might as well be swimming haha.

That’s badass. Maybe a dumb question but you make them out of wood?

 

[Mr.BR]

Have also made wooden ones . but mostly composite.

* am a second generation boat builder and we have built thousands of kayaks and canoes

 

[charnicus]

Have also made wooden ones . but mostly composite.

* am a second generation boat builder and we have built thousands of kayaks and canoes

Dude you should show some. That’s like badass level 1000.

 

[boydfayette]

I’ve whitewater kayaked for 18 years; 10 of which I averaged 250-300 days a year (I did it for work and was very poor).
Don’t fall into the trap of getting one for lakes and rivers; they are completely different crafts.
Some folks have made good points, but more importantly a WW kayak will be extremely unstable and potentially dangerous for an unskilled person to take out even on a lake.
Choose one or the other to start. A recreational/lake kayak is going to be easier to jump into and start paddling. Learning how to paddle a WW boat is more akin to learning a martial art as there is a BIG psychological factor and the physical movements are much more intricate.

Either way I highly recommend finding a specialty store. Beyond fitting you with properly sized gear, often times they will offer instruction and you can tap into their community to find folks to paddle with.

 

[thejeep]

[QUOTE="boydfayette, post: 7932312, member:
Don’t fall into the trap of getting one for lakes and rivers; they are completely different crafts.
Some folks have made good points, but more importantly a WW kayak will be extremely unstable and potentially dangerous for an unskilled person to take out even on a lake.
Choose one or the other “

?
Thanks yoda. I’d love to see video of some lake beat downs. Lol.

In all seriousness water is dangerous and will get you when you least expect it.



Just ask EJ.