Rifle Scopes Leica vs Minox Glass

[ucsfl05]

Hi Everyone,

New to the Hide, first post here. I was super pumped about the Leica PRS but after watching DLO's review I'm not so sure how I feel about the reticle.
Ive never looked through either. Looking for some advice:
1) Can anyone comment on the optic quality between the two?
2) I will be using this for long distance shooting and hunting. Ive never had an open-circle reticle. The concept makes sense but the mantra "aim small, miss small" seems contrary to this design.

Thanks!

 

[Glassaholic]

I assume when you say "Minox" you are referring to the ZP5 line as other Minox lines do not use the same quality glass. I read one of ILya's (@koshkin) posts regarding the Leica and I thought he mentioned it did very well for its price point, but was below Tangent, ZCO, Minox ZP5 and Schmidt with regard to overall optical quality, but still very good. I agree with you, the PRB reticle is very confusing and I do not like it personally, but I can be very picky about reticles. I am not averse to center circles, but would have liked to see Leica put a dot inside that center circle, our eyes naturally "center" when you see a circle and I have my own reticle design with a center circle but also with a center dot. But something else to consider is this, most of us dial elevation and hold wind, with this reticle, unless you live underground you are not going to be aiming with that center circle, you'll be aiming with whatever hash mark lines up with your wind hold based on your solution given your conditions.

 

[Prebanpaul]

The MR4 reticle is. Clean fast and crisp.

 

[260284]

I picked up two of the ZP5 with the MR4 and they are a great scope. Never looked through a Leica, so no comparison here. Shot with a guy who was using a TT last Saturday who also owns Kahles, Minox, and S&B, and he claims the Minox has the best glass. He just has trouble seeing the turrets on the minox when dialing his dope. He also like the tooless zero on the TT.

 

[260284]

Shot some on paper at 338 yards Wednesday evening and could clearly see 22 caliber bullet holes in paper at that distance with the ZP5.

 

[jarredsc]

So does the Minox have better glass than the tangent cause a lot of guys say their similar a lot say it’s better and a lot say tangent is the best you can buy Somone with an honest review should give an answer not Somone who ons a 4500 tt that doesn’t want to downgrade their expensive optic by saying Minox has better glass

 

[Glassaholic]

So does the Minox have better glass than the tangent cause a lot of guys say their similar a lot say it’s better and a lot say tangent is the best you can buy Somone with an honest review should give an answer not Somone who ons a 4500 tt that doesn’t want to downgrade their expensive optic by saying Minox has better glass

You're asking for opinion, I cannot tell you that my ZCO or ZP5 are "better" than Tangent Theta, but what I can tell you is my ZP5 and my ZCO (even though it's the 4-20 version) gives up very little to what I have seen through Tangent Theta. In the end it should really come down to other features like reticle and turrets because the glass in all these alpha scopes is stellar.

Take a look at ILya's review on high end optics, his ranking is as follows:

1. Tangent Theta 5-25
2. ZCO 5-27
3. Minox ZP5
4. Schmidt 5-25

 

[Threadcutter308]

So does the Minox have better glass than the tangent cause a lot of guys say their similar a lot say it’s better and a lot say tangent is the best you can buy Somone with an honest review should give an answer not Somone who ons a 4500 tt that doesn’t want to downgrade their expensive optic by saying Minox has better glass

I no longer have my ZP5 MR4's. Presently, I have ZCO 5-27's (MPCT2 and MPCT3) and TT 5-25 Gen 3.

From my experience, IQ is as follows;

1. TT
2. ZP5
3. ZCO

As I am stepping into my flame suit........I would also say that they are SO very close, that you would be ecstatic with any of them. My personal favorite at this time is the ZCO. From a price/performance/IQ/ergo standpoint, they are my favorite.

From simply a price standpoint, ZP5 is the way to go. The IQ of the ZP5 is batting well above their pay grade. I don't like the ergo's as much as the ZCO, but if you can pick up a lightly used/safe queen/virgin white box ZP5, that's really hard to beat. TT's ergo's are good and the tool less turrets are the cats ass.

But, like I said, all 3 of them are exceptional. There really aren't any warts on any of them.

 

[StrayDog]

OP: I have a Leica PRS PRB.
I also was skeptical about the reticle, and I'm still on the fence about the tree and circle. But I took the plunge because I really like the rest of the reticle, the tooless turrets, the low parallax, the glass was praised by Ilya, and I got a deal. It's a rimfire match scope for me.
Like DLO said, it's a confusing tree that demands you dial for everything, which Iis ok for me. It's not too dense, and I'll never use it unless a COF is a required no-dial stage. I prefer to dial elevation and I can the tune the tree out, but i'm really not a fan of the mismatched markings. It's schizo!
Also, like was said above, the circle is not ideal for shooting groups at .1mil, but usually you're holding away from center anyways. And, it's smaller than any representation I've seen so far. I shot some good groups anyway, and didn't miss the center dot. Dot drill groups below are hasty 10rd mag dumps. I will admit that a center dot is still my preference.
See the pics at 30x 20x and 15x. My phone camera wouldn't pick up the reticle at 10-12x, but the circle is still usable against white or light targets, but gets lost in dark black at 10x for me.
Also, the circle is NOT illuminated, which is annoying since that would fix the washout at 10x.
The glass, oh yes, it's awesome. I only have Razor2s and an AMG to compare, but it's the best I've seen in person. Can see mirage and air swirling much better right off.
I have more to say, but I'll shoot some NRL22 matches in June and July and chime in on the Leica thread once I use it more. I've only shot out to 100y so far, so I'm still feeling her out.
Really enjoying these turrets for zero shifting between .22lr brands and lots. That was a primary reason for my purchase. And the .2 mil vert and wind stadia are ideal for me.
It's just one I had to see for myself, and I'll know more after a few matches!

 

[Southern180]

I own a NF atacr and leica PRS prb.
Glass is great in both , I like the leica rectical for it's fine lines, NF is way to thick.

 

[308pirate]

I don't see what the big angst is about with that Leica reticle. Seems perfectly fine to me.

Anyone who thinks an open circle aiming reference can't be very precise must have never shot a match rifle with aperture sights.