I have a LMT MWS with a 16" barrel that consistently shoots .80 to 1.1 inch 5 shot groups with Black Hills 168gr and good handloads. Is anybody really getting significantly smaller groups with the 18" s/s and 20" barrels?
- Thread starter limamike56
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Re: LMT MWS 18 & 20 Barrels Worth It?
Smaller groups is not the draw to the longer barrels. They will give you more velocity to reach out a little further.
However, if you are planning to stick with 308 I don't see the draw of the longer barrel. I've had awesome results with my 16", making several hits at 1100yds in a this past spring and one at 1290 back in Feb. I had a 20" ss .308 barrel for a while but went back to the 16" ss.
Smaller groups is not the draw to the longer barrels. They will give you more velocity to reach out a little further.
However, if you are planning to stick with 308 I don't see the draw of the longer barrel. I've had awesome results with my 16", making several hits at 1100yds in a this past spring and one at 1290 back in Feb. I had a 20" ss .308 barrel for a while but went back to the 16" ss.
Re: LMT MWS 18 & 20 Barrels Worth It?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: m1ajunkie</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Smaller groups is not the draw to the longer barrels. They will give you more velocity to reach out a little further.
However, if you are planning to stick with 308 I don't see the draw of the longer barrel. I've had awesome results with my 16", making several hits at 1100yds in a this past spring and one at 1290 back in Feb. I had a 20" ss .308 barrel for a while but went back to the 16" ss.
</div></div>
Thanks for this perspective. Is there any significant difference in accuracy between the s/s and chrome lined barrels?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: m1ajunkie</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Smaller groups is not the draw to the longer barrels. They will give you more velocity to reach out a little further.
However, if you are planning to stick with 308 I don't see the draw of the longer barrel. I've had awesome results with my 16", making several hits at 1100yds in a this past spring and one at 1290 back in Feb. I had a 20" ss .308 barrel for a while but went back to the 16" ss.
</div></div>
Thanks for this perspective. Is there any significant difference in accuracy between the s/s and chrome lined barrels?
Re: LMT MWS 18 & 20 Barrels Worth It?
I don't know about the difference between the cl and ss from personal experience. I actually sold my original chrome lined before shooting it for accuracy.
However I have seen on several forums awesome results from the regular chrome lined barrels. They seem to be shooting just as well as I can get my ss to shoot. I'm no great shot, but with my ss barrel using both the 175smk and 178amax I would call .75 moa my best.
I don't know about the difference between the cl and ss from personal experience. I actually sold my original chrome lined before shooting it for accuracy.
However I have seen on several forums awesome results from the regular chrome lined barrels. They seem to be shooting just as well as I can get my ss to shoot. I'm no great shot, but with my ss barrel using both the 175smk and 178amax I would call .75 moa my best.
Re: LMT MWS 18 & 20 Barrels Worth It?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: lIMAMIKE56</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have a LMT MWS with a 16" barrel that consistently shoots .80 to 1.1 inch 5 shot groups with Black Hills 168gr and good handloads. Is anybody really getting significantly smaller groups with the 18" s/s and 20" barrels? </div></div>
I heard somewhere that Black Hills may not be the most ideal one to buy for gas guns...
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: lIMAMIKE56</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have a LMT MWS with a 16" barrel that consistently shoots .80 to 1.1 inch 5 shot groups with Black Hills 168gr and good handloads. Is anybody really getting significantly smaller groups with the 18" s/s and 20" barrels? </div></div>
I heard somewhere that Black Hills may not be the most ideal one to buy for gas guns...
Re: LMT MWS 18 & 20 Barrels Worth It?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: green338</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I heard somewhere that Black Hills may not be the most ideal one to buy for gas guns...
</div></div>
True dat.
Accurate but too hot - at least in my MA TEN's.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: green338</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I heard somewhere that Black Hills may not be the most ideal one to buy for gas guns...
</div></div>
True dat.
Accurate but too hot - at least in my MA TEN's.
Re: LMT MWS 18 & 20 Barrels Worth It?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: smschulz</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: green338</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I heard somewhere that Black Hills may not be the most ideal one to buy for gas guns...
</div></div>
</div></div>
Black Hills has always been very accurate ammo for me.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: smschulz</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: green338</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I heard somewhere that Black Hills may not be the most ideal one to buy for gas guns...
</div></div>
</div></div>
Black Hills has always been very accurate ammo for me.
Re: LMT MWS 18 & 20 Barrels Worth It?
Bump.
Bump.
Re: LMT MWS 18 & 20 Barrels Worth It?
Hope to get out this wekend and give you some info. For now I am not really happy with my 18" barrel. Have to work damn hard to get 1 MOA.
Never spent much time with the original 16" but going to see what she does as it seems you guys are getting better groups at 16" than me with the longer barrel.
Hope to get out this wekend and give you some info. For now I am not really happy with my 18" barrel. Have to work damn hard to get 1 MOA.
Never spent much time with the original 16" but going to see what she does as it seems you guys are getting better groups at 16" than me with the longer barrel.
Re: LMT MWS 18 & 20 Barrels Worth It?
I experienced an increase in accuracy going from a 16 CB to an 18 SS, but honestly, for me it's hard to shoot accurately with my MWS with the factory trigger. The best group for me so far using FGMM is 0.60", but usually I'm shooting just under moa.
I experienced an increase in accuracy going from a 16 CB to an 18 SS, but honestly, for me it's hard to shoot accurately with my MWS with the factory trigger. The best group for me so far using FGMM is 0.60", but usually I'm shooting just under moa.
Re: LMT MWS 18 & 20 Barrels Worth It?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Alpine 338</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I experienced an increase in accuracy going from a 16 CB to an 18 SS, but honestly, for me it's hard to shoot accurately with my MWS with the factory trigger. The best group for me so far using FGMM is 0.60", but usually I'm shooting just under moa. </div></div>
What were your best groups with the 16 inch chrome barrel before switching to the SS barrel? Thanks.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Alpine 338</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I experienced an increase in accuracy going from a 16 CB to an 18 SS, but honestly, for me it's hard to shoot accurately with my MWS with the factory trigger. The best group for me so far using FGMM is 0.60", but usually I'm shooting just under moa. </div></div>
What were your best groups with the 16 inch chrome barrel before switching to the SS barrel? Thanks.
Re: LMT MWS 18 & 20 Barrels Worth It?
TTT.
TTT.
Re: LMT MWS 18 & 20 Barrels Worth It?
I'd like to try an 18" myself. My 16 cl is a solid 1 moa, and occasional .75 gun. I'd like to think it or I can do better.
That's with factory 168's and 175's.
I'd like to try an 18" myself. My 16 cl is a solid 1 moa, and occasional .75 gun. I'd like to think it or I can do better.
That's with factory 168's and 175's.
Re: LMT MWS 18 & 20 Barrels Worth It?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TallShot</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'd like to try an 18" myself. My 16 cl is a solid 1 moa, and occasional .75 gun. I'd like to think it or I can do better.
That's with factory 168's and 175's. </div></div>
Thats what I was thinking and wanted to be sure before spending the money for another barrel. Hopefully a few people who have used both can post their results.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TallShot</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'd like to try an 18" myself. My 16 cl is a solid 1 moa, and occasional .75 gun. I'd like to think it or I can do better.
That's with factory 168's and 175's. </div></div>
Thats what I was thinking and wanted to be sure before spending the money for another barrel. Hopefully a few people who have used both can post their results.
Re: LMT MWS 18 & 20 Barrels Worth It?
My 20" barrel is sub MOA all day long. Your mileage may vary.
My 20" barrel is sub MOA all day long. Your mileage may vary.
Re: LMT MWS 18 & 20 Barrels Worth It?
OP, out of curiosity what optics are you using and do you have the stock trigger?
These two factors can affect perceived accuracy as well. I say perceived accuracy because you're getting .8 to 1.1" groups from your current setup, but that doesn't mean the barrel is the culprit. Your trigger could be the cause and/or you might be flinching, your optics could be the cause depending on how steady you are at a given magnification or the maximum magnification they provide.
I have an LMT MRPCQB in 5.56 with a 16" barrel but the longest barrel they make is an 18" and I just don't see the reason to move up 2".
The other posters here have a valid point in that by increasing your barrel length you don't necessarily increase "accuracy" but you increase velocity. And based on your original post it seems that your desire is for better accuracy more than higher velocity. With this in mind, you might want to try a few other options, especially in the trigger area. As an example, years ago I had just purchased a Winchester M70 in .308 and was getting just over 1" groups at 100yds with reloads, I then took my rifle to my gunsmith (Mark Chanlynn - awesome guy) and he worked on my stock trigger and got it down to about 3 - 3.5lbs. The next time I was at the range my groups had dropped to under MOA averaging about .65 - .75" and this from a "factory" rifle with a sporter barrel.
OP, out of curiosity what optics are you using and do you have the stock trigger?
These two factors can affect perceived accuracy as well. I say perceived accuracy because you're getting .8 to 1.1" groups from your current setup, but that doesn't mean the barrel is the culprit. Your trigger could be the cause and/or you might be flinching, your optics could be the cause depending on how steady you are at a given magnification or the maximum magnification they provide.
I have an LMT MRPCQB in 5.56 with a 16" barrel but the longest barrel they make is an 18" and I just don't see the reason to move up 2".
The other posters here have a valid point in that by increasing your barrel length you don't necessarily increase "accuracy" but you increase velocity. And based on your original post it seems that your desire is for better accuracy more than higher velocity. With this in mind, you might want to try a few other options, especially in the trigger area. As an example, years ago I had just purchased a Winchester M70 in .308 and was getting just over 1" groups at 100yds with reloads, I then took my rifle to my gunsmith (Mark Chanlynn - awesome guy) and he worked on my stock trigger and got it down to about 3 - 3.5lbs. The next time I was at the range my groups had dropped to under MOA averaging about .65 - .75" and this from a "factory" rifle with a sporter barrel.
Re: LMT MWS 18 & 20 Barrels Worth It?
My personal experience has always been that trigger and optic making the biggest difference in accuracy.
My personal experience has always been that trigger and optic making the biggest difference in accuracy.
Re: LMT MWS 18 & 20 Barrels Worth It?
I own a LMT MWS 20" stainless, and I totally agree. You won't see any increased accuracy with a longer barrel. I have to think though, that a SS barrel will be slightly more accurate than a chrome lined due to the imperfections in chrome plating. There have been awesome reports of sub moa accuracy with some cl guns though. If I had a choice I would trade for a shorter ss barrel. The 20" is way heavy.
I own a LMT MWS 20" stainless, and I totally agree. You won't see any increased accuracy with a longer barrel. I have to think though, that a SS barrel will be slightly more accurate than a chrome lined due to the imperfections in chrome plating. There have been awesome reports of sub moa accuracy with some cl guns though. If I had a choice I would trade for a shorter ss barrel. The 20" is way heavy.
Re: LMT MWS 18 & 20 Barrels Worth It?
Bump
Bump
Re: LMT MWS 18 & 20 Barrels Worth It?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BORG_888</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My personal experience has always been that trigger and optic making the biggest difference in accuracy. </div></div>
Can you explain a little more on optics and accuracy?
I have a 2.5-10x and average around 1-1.2" groups at 100yds.
Will a higher power glass allow me a more precise hold for tighter groups, or will it have more shakiness and mirage.
Thanks
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BORG_888</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My personal experience has always been that trigger and optic making the biggest difference in accuracy. </div></div>
Can you explain a little more on optics and accuracy?
I have a 2.5-10x and average around 1-1.2" groups at 100yds.
Will a higher power glass allow me a more precise hold for tighter groups, or will it have more shakiness and mirage.
Thanks
Re: LMT MWS 18 & 20 Barrels Worth It?
Trigger is the biggest limiting factor with my MWS. However, I did replace the 16" CB with a 18" SS, and did see a very slight increase in accuracy. Either way, it's a minute of man rifle on the battlefield.
Trigger is the biggest limiting factor with my MWS. However, I did replace the 16" CB with a 18" SS, and did see a very slight increase in accuracy. Either way, it's a minute of man rifle on the battlefield.
Re: LMT MWS 18 & 20 Barrels Worth It?
I have a 20" CL LMT MWS. It is a heavy bitch, but it drives tacks. Very much sub-moa type gun / barrel. Very happy with it. Not sure how much more FPS you'll get over a 16", but if you're going over 500yards and NOT dragging it thru the woods 24/7 (bench rifle / target practice type stuff), then the 20" might be worth it.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dacam</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I own a LMT MWS 20" stainless, and I totally agree. You won't see any increased accuracy with a longer barrel. I have to think though, that a SS barrel will be slightly more accurate than a chrome lined due to the imperfections in chrome plating. There have been awesome reports of sub moa accuracy with some cl guns though. If I had a choice I would trade for a shorter ss barrel. The 20" is way heavy. </div></div>
I have a 20" CL LMT MWS. It is a heavy bitch, but it drives tacks. Very much sub-moa type gun / barrel. Very happy with it. Not sure how much more FPS you'll get over a 16", but if you're going over 500yards and NOT dragging it thru the woods 24/7 (bench rifle / target practice type stuff), then the 20" might be worth it.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dacam</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I own a LMT MWS 20" stainless, and I totally agree. You won't see any increased accuracy with a longer barrel. I have to think though, that a SS barrel will be slightly more accurate than a chrome lined due to the imperfections in chrome plating. There have been awesome reports of sub moa accuracy with some cl guns though. If I had a choice I would trade for a shorter ss barrel. The 20" is way heavy. </div></div>
Re: LMT MWS 18 & 20 Barrels Worth It?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dacam</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BORG_888</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My personal experience has always been that trigger and optic making the biggest difference in accuracy. </div></div>
Can you explain a little more on optics and accuracy?
I have a 2.5-10x and average around 1-1.2" groups at 100yds.
Will a higher power glass allow me a more precise hold for tighter groups, or will it have more shakiness and mirage.
Thanks</div></div>
Well if you are trying to center your reticle in a 1/8 inch diamond verses a 1 inch diamond, you are aiming at a more precise target. 14(+) power allows you to align your shots more precisely than a 4 power scope.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dacam</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BORG_888</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My personal experience has always been that trigger and optic making the biggest difference in accuracy. </div></div>
Can you explain a little more on optics and accuracy?
I have a 2.5-10x and average around 1-1.2" groups at 100yds.
Will a higher power glass allow me a more precise hold for tighter groups, or will it have more shakiness and mirage.
Thanks</div></div>
Well if you are trying to center your reticle in a 1/8 inch diamond verses a 1 inch diamond, you are aiming at a more precise target. 14(+) power allows you to align your shots more precisely than a 4 power scope.
Re: LMT MWS 18 & 20 Barrels Worth It?
Just my observations. I have an 18" SS and a 20" CL. The SS can be more accurate, but with a much more limited choice in ammo. The CL shoots better overall with a variety of ammo, and I believe most of the time I am the weak link in the system. The CL will also outlast 2 SS barrels. I shoot 147 grain '80s milsurp ammo in my CL sub 1.5", that to me is impressive.
Just my observations. I have an 18" SS and a 20" CL. The SS can be more accurate, but with a much more limited choice in ammo. The CL shoots better overall with a variety of ammo, and I believe most of the time I am the weak link in the system. The CL will also outlast 2 SS barrels. I shoot 147 grain '80s milsurp ammo in my CL sub 1.5", that to me is impressive.
Re: LMT MWS 18 & 20 Barrels Worth It?
Little bit of an update here. Staying with the 16" CL barrel on my LMT MWS.
Went back and read everything I could find here on SH on the LMT MWS and shooting gas guns which took a couple of weeks. Then really thought through about how I am shooting this rifle.
Changed my position behind the gun in prone and off a bench, and my cheek weld and worked a lot on trigger control and breathing and added a bipod [Atlas] instead of shooting off my ruck.
So my largest group over this past weekend was just under an inch at .96 and three others all came were slightly under 3/4 of an inch. Same ammo (Black Hills 168gr) same conditions but better understanding and application of what you can learn here. Thanks for a great forum.
Little bit of an update here. Staying with the 16" CL barrel on my LMT MWS.
Went back and read everything I could find here on SH on the LMT MWS and shooting gas guns which took a couple of weeks. Then really thought through about how I am shooting this rifle.
Changed my position behind the gun in prone and off a bench, and my cheek weld and worked a lot on trigger control and breathing and added a bipod [Atlas] instead of shooting off my ruck.
So my largest group over this past weekend was just under an inch at .96 and three others all came were slightly under 3/4 of an inch. Same ammo (Black Hills 168gr) same conditions but better understanding and application of what you can learn here. Thanks for a great forum.
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