Lol this is gold! Cortina and YouTube experts.
- Thread starter Steel head
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his parents should of named him ford then his surname would make sense 
so id love to just roast this kid problem is when i first started reloading the snug fit was the thing to do...even eric says the same thing...but things change...i like my rounds like a hot dog down a hallway now because as said in the video ease of chambering and extraction and ive noticed NO difference in accuracy.
but on the other hand this kid is a fuckin retard saying the top shooters in the world are reloading wrong and have been for years as he stands with a factory i dont know WTF kinda rifle in his hand claiming he shoots in the worst conditions....LMFAO....this kid has not been outta his moms back yard in several years id be willing to bet....id love to go to the range with this kid sometime just to see how well he and his equipment work.
but on the other hand this kid is a fuckin retard saying the top shooters in the world are reloading wrong and have been for years as he stands with a factory i dont know WTF kinda rifle in his hand claiming he shoots in the worst conditions....LMFAO....this kid has not been outta his moms back yard in several years id be willing to bet....id love to go to the range with this kid sometime just to see how well he and his equipment work.
Interesting. Some time ago, I came across Mr. Eagle eye's video and shook my head at a number of his comments. Glad Erik took this on in a non demeaning way. Mr. Eagle Eye was getting the variance because he didn't lock his die down.
Didn't like Mr. Eagle Eye's conceited attitude (@19:45) that his opinion was the end all, only truth. He never showed the "proof" as he said he would. Never showed any targets. Would have liked to see some targets.
Didn't like Mr. Eagle Eye's conceited attitude (@19:45) that his opinion was the end all, only truth. He never showed the "proof" as he said he would. Never showed any targets. Would have liked to see some targets.
Aaaand that's why I no longer help people to learn to reload.......
Too many questions (in a "are you sure that's right" question sense) based on what they saw in random youtube videos.
Too many questions (in a "are you sure that's right" question sense) based on what they saw in random youtube videos.
This.
It seems that every time someone comes to me with a reloading issue and questions as to what I would do, they then cock their head and say “Really?”, like I must be nuts. “But, I saw Joe Dickwad on UT and he does thus and so.”
You asked, I answered. I’m not telling you what to do, I’m telling you what I would do.
Most people are just looking for confirmation of what they think is right in their mind.
And once they find that confirmation, they rarely actually test the logic.
And once they find that confirmation, they rarely actually test the logic.
Watched that twice and enjoyed every min..
Frank should that type of video
Frank should that type of video
Starting to sound like an echo chamber in here fellas.
Guys have been doing it both ways forever and guess what? Both work.
We bump shoulder because our fancy actions run smoother the same way a guy runs Amsoil in his trans. It just makes us feel better.
For fucks sake, Cortina stressing about galling his lugs and greasing them every 20 shots?
Thats a dead give away son.
Guys have been doing it both ways forever and guess what? Both work.
We bump shoulder because our fancy actions run smoother the same way a guy runs Amsoil in his trans. It just makes us feel better.
For fucks sake, Cortina stressing about galling his lugs and greasing them every 20 shots?
Thats a dead give away son.
One way works all the time every time.
The other way ends up with sticky bolt and extraction issues at some point.
And a FL size fixes it.
Cortina claiming it causes clickers is bullshit.
The claim his floating die is causing 30 thou swings in his bump is a laughable observation too.
If combined with inconsistent lubrication and/or inconsistent brass hardness it absolutely can.
That the guy in the vid can achieve .03 in variance speaks volumes about the problems he’s having.
And this post proves you either didn’t pay attention to the video or have no clue what you’re talking about.
It’s already tight and causing small click when you use this method.
Not to mention, this is the kind of shit that keeps some top manufacturers or shooters from posting here.
Random keyboard assholes saying they are full of shit instead of responsibly disagreeing.
Random keyboard assholes saying they are full of shit instead of responsibly disagreeing.
D
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Exactly. The same thing has happened on many different forums. The uninitiated or inexperienced are the loudest voices. The don't have any standing, so they make up for it in volume.
Shortly, anyone who has paid their dues asks themselves,"Why am I putting up with this shit?", and they just stop posting...at least in the reloading sections.
Absolutely. And make no mistake, many of them read the forums.
I don’t blame them. Many times I’ve attempted to share a lot of the loading practices they use and have shown me. But people start losing their minds and it just isn’t worth the headache.
Wait until some of them find out Erik and many others don’t use group shooting to find a powder charge. Just a chrono and shooting into the berm.
Exactly... and they're going to try the Satterlee method with inconsistent or even poor reloading techniques, over a cheap chrono and cry foul when it doesn't work. Exactly like the eagle eye dude and his crazy variance in shoulder bump. I don't think I could try and get that much variance, and I'm by no means an expert precision reloader.
D
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Funny you should mention that.
I remember seeing you post that back a long time ago. I had been coming around to that notion myself in my process. What brought it around to me was two things: A) I got my magnetospeed B) I realized that just about any load could be tuned with seating depth. (EC said the same thing in one of his recent videos.)
So I figured,"Why don't I just find the area where the powder charge is burning clean, is within pressure limits, and leaves me just enough headroom for hot days? Then I can tune it with seating depth and be done."
I still do a very short test at distance with 4 successive loads within that sweet spot to see if one prints higher from point of aim than the others. I believe positive compensation is a real thing, and I want any benefit I can get from it.
I’ll be honest and didn’t watch the whole thing. 19+ minutes of cringing just isn’t in my schedule right now. As far as his “proof”, he sounds like certain trolls that come here and state something blatantly false as being true and then demand proof from anyone that tells them they are full of malarkey.
What would be your reasoning behind 30thou variance? Because that shit is not normal... I've reloaded for almost 10 years and have never gotten that much variance in anything I've reloaded....and yes I've measured... because you know, "feel" is not a measurement lol.
Thats akin to some jackwagon putting head bolts in and using the "feel" method instead of properly torquing them to spec. You ever take off lugnuts from a shitty car shop? Having to crank up my impact gun to take off 2 lug nuts, but only needing a standard socket wrench to take off the other 2-3 is what "feel" measurement gets you.
Theres a difference between floating a die and having it so loose it visibly moves up and down.
With the Eagle Eye dude... I personally think he means well. I didn't feel he came off like a know it all or an asshole... but I think he wants to be good a reloading, and he wants to educate people and help them....but he's trying REALLY hard to be different, without putting in the effort and hard work it takes to come up with "something different".
Theres no replacement for experience and logic lol
exact same impression i got from the kid.
Wow David...kick someone out of a thread and threaten a month ban for being an “asshole”, disagreeing, and having a different opinion?How about you come down off your high horse a bit there bud....
I happen to know DiaBando personally and he’s a good dude. Occasionally get to shoot with you and Erik as well, whom the latter I have learned a lot from and respect. But threatening a ban is horse schit.
I happen to know DiaBando personally and he’s a good dude. Occasionally get to shoot with you and Erik as well, whom the latter I have learned a lot from and respect. But threatening a ban is horse schit.
Yep. There’s ways to disagree and there’s ways to disagree while being an asshole.
He chose the wrong way. Shit happens.
I’m assuming he’s also a man and can speak for himself without needing someone to speak for him. It’s one thread, on the internet. Don’t take things so personally.
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Or that they don’t touch their primer pockets at all.
It's not 30k. Its 3k. He either misread his caliper, or made a decimal error in writing it down. Look at the format of the numbers on his digital caliper.
If you didn't look closely, or know how to read that tool, it wouldn't be hard to read the above as "00.015 in".
Well that would make a lot more sense, but I was going off the paper Eagle Eye wrote all his numbers down on, and what Erik was critiquing.
I understand a simple misread here and there, but to write down multiple numbers in the hundredth decimal when it should be the thousandth seems off? I think thats where some of the critiquing comes from. His process, and in this case, transferring measured numbers to paper, seem amateur at best. I'm not machinist but understanding that key difference in decimal places is supremely important in this game.
Again... I think his head and his intent is in the right place, but he just seems too confident and too excited about "something different" when he most likely does not have the experience OR expertise to tread his own path educating people on things. It's one thing to be quiet and do it your own way....its another to put info out to a following. Misinformation can turn new shooters/loaders away.
https://www.snipershide.com/shooting/attachments/img_5201-jpg.7407304/
If those are truly his results, then he really needs to learn how to properly use a sizing die. That’s horrendous! The max spread I can recall having across 100 cases was 0.003” total. All that he is showing here is that he does not truly know what he is doing.
If those are truly his results, then he really needs to learn how to properly use a sizing die. That’s horrendous! The max spread I can recall having across 100 cases was 0.003” total. All that he is showing here is that he does not truly know what he is doing.
I saw this video a while back. I always assumed he forgot a zero in a couple of them.
After watching the video and reading the comments I'd like to mention one thing. Most people and their calipers cannot measure consistently with a Hornady comparator to within +-.001. I eventually realized that my calipers and comparators were not consistent or repeatable. I finally went out to the lathe and made myself a cartridge specific micrometer type gauge that can resolve shoulder bump to within .0002" and it is repeatable. What I found was my sizing die is actually much much more consistent than what I thought when I was using calipers and a comparator. I have found that after annealing and then sizing I rarely ever have a piece of brass .0005" longer or shorter than the average. I bet the standard deviation on my sizing bump is less than .0002". I'm using a cheap press, good lube, and a Forester full length die.
Funny to hear you say that. At one point I didn't trust some measurements. Ended up making a fixture and setting up a mitutoyo 0to 1 that would fit. I set it up on one of my granite plates right next to a vertical and shook my head ... then re did it to fit the vertical...
then realized they were more consistent than I thought. Went back to calipers, but a dedicated 1 piece attachment I turned out. Then pretty sure it got turned into something for a customer when I was in a hurry 1 day.
Eagle shoots lots, practices lots, experiments plenty and comes to his own conclusions... Is he perfect, NO, must we take what all he posts to youtube as gospel, NO... But what I like about him is he takes off the shelf rifles and equipment and makes them shoot quite well... He does very well with what he can afford and he shares his results... I'll keep watching his videos... And insulting name-calling of this kid isn't necessary....
you keep watching his videos and learning from him...as a matter of fact go watch a couple of his videos now and watch him slap the trigger like a craigs list hooker then come back here in a year and start a tread why your gun wont shoot....i could go on but lets just stop there....like has been stated here i think he means well but for him to say the top shooters in the world have been reloading wrong...and his way is better? when his fundamentals are not in check and as i said ive yet to see him shoot a group under about a 1/2"...i think he has potential but he needs to work on some things.
Do you know him personally?
I understand where you're coming from, but theres only been a few name calls here. MOST of the comments have been understanding but critical of both his methods and the words he uses to explain and educate.
Here is the problems I see with his video:
1.) He uses absolutes while giving an explanation on something that is KNOWN to have more than one method that works. The quote, "only fools deal in absolutes", comes to mind. He says things like, "This is wrong!"; "This WILL cause problems"; "This WILL give you inconsistency"... etc. etc. When you reach out on a limb and attempt to educate people using words and phrases like that, you immediately put yourself into a category of critique open to the best in the world. He chose to put himself out in that manner, and will be judged accordingly....in this case, he was judged by a WORLD CLASS shooter of more than one discipline. "he shoots lots" is not a credential.
2.) He did not provide proof of anything. The measurements he showed were either wrong in measurement, wrong in their translation, or a combo of the two. He also was talking about precision rifle and his example was 7.62x39???
3.) He comes off very well informed with some of what he says...which I like. Its obvious he reads, and understands a lot of this. This makes him seem VERY educated on the topic, ESPECIALLY with new reloaders and shooters. He then goes on to give no other options than his own. My biggest problem is this can seriously misinform new shooters and reloaders. Hes blatantly not giving the whole story, and in my opinion, that is a huge disservice to novice shooters and reloaders.
4.) This isn't daycare... thick skin is required on this forum. If you're going to talk the talk, be ready to be scrutinized for the reasons I outlined above
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My lee classic turret can easily hold .002 or better.
One thou being the norm.
One thing as a degenerate neck sizer I’ve learned is when brass starts getting tight I absolutely see an impact on my ES, a negative impact.
Not sure why but I’m guessing the slight brass expansion moderates the start of the burn in a way tight brass does not.
Also the base expansion and work hardening if not kept in check absolutely will give you issues.
Except he is stating it’s gospel. He literally says he is right and everyone else is wrong.
The press I'm using that I talked about holding .0002" on headspace bump is a Lee classic turret press. I have come to believe that if the brass is kept in a consistent condition and the resizing die is set up correctly then the press doesn't matter much.
Confirmation Bias is hardwired in our brains - we all have this as a feature, not a bug. That's why if you work in a scientific field you've been hammered into being aware of Confirmation Bias (among other cognitive biases) , and take great pains to control for it in research.
If you want to see Confirmation Bias run amok, just peruse the Bear Pit.
I'm an old coot.
Don't have the full 20 minutes plus to listen to this.
I'm gonna listen to Erik because he's led me to some solid techniques and gear that have helped me a lot.
I'm invested in Erik. I've purchased powder scales and tricklers and such that I've seen him use. My 1/2 plus/minus MOA tells me Erik's stuff is good.
THANKS, Erik....... Keep teaching me.
I have watched the video and I’ll say this , anyone who has reloaded a lot of ammo has made mistakes along the way . Who hasn’t forgot to lock down their dies every now and again ? I certainly have . Now in regards to bumping back the shoulder 0.002 or doing it the way Eagle Eye illustrates both methods work just fine , handloaders have been doing it the way Eagle Eye does it for donkeys years before cartridge bump back gauges came along . Each to their own . One thinks this way is best , another thinks the other way is better . This we know Kenny at Eagle Eye Shooting builds some very accurate rifles , he has recently built two PRS rifles for Youtubers X-Ring and Isyour6covered , one in Hornady 6mm ARC and one in 6mm Creedmore that shoot .3 of an inch @ 100 yards . If anyone wants an accurate rifle built go to DP Gunworks ( Desert Precision Gunworks) you won’t be disappointed folks .
