Looking for Silhouette rifle suggestions

[SMH]

I am a 4-H shooting sports coach with experience in many forms of competition but Silhouette is not one of them. I've never shot nor even seen it.
I want to get my better shooters started on rimfire Silhouette in preparation for a National qualifier being held in the fall.

One of my students was just disqualified in 3P at our State shoot because it was determined that it "wasn't fair" that he was using my Anschutz 2013AL while most of the other kids shot "Walmart rifles". (The 2013 rifle was legal under 4-H and NRA rules!) The winning kid shot his prone over a kneeling role and second place fired from a magazine but apparently these ACTUAL rule infractions were overlooked.
Assuming that this student doesn't quite (he was understandably very upset) I want to have him (and others) ready for 3P and Silhouette. (I expect him to be shooting the Anschutz for 3P after I have a discussion with those in charge)

So...
What would you suggest for a silhouette rifle?
I am leaning towards a semiauto unless there is a compelling reason not to.
I have heard reference to Clark, Volquartson, Tac Sol, etc. Are there others that I should consider?
Do any of these companies have a rifle particularly better suited to rimfire silhouette than the others?

Scope options (on hand) would include a Leupold 6.5-20x40 EFRTD, NF 2.5-10x32 MOARZS or NF 5.5-22x50 MOARZS

Thank you.

 

[g2gjoe]

Volquartsen's are bug Eye precise. Tactical solutions or not.
I've never used Clark products, but you may consider kidd. As for optics, Leopold will do all you need them to do and then more at that range. Also consider the Leopold fixed power competition scopes.

 

[ivanthesane]

Check out Ruger model 1237

Supposed to be very accurate.

 

[Diablo]

Anschutz 1712, a bolt action repeater (magazine fed), good accuracy, very good trigger, "sporter".

Check on "steelchickens" which is a silhouette site/forum.

How much are you asking for your Anschutz position rifle (not that I need another--but it would probably sell pretty quickly)?

A few competitors are using the Biathlon Fortner/Anschutz for silhouette, but that would be much more expensive.

The Russian Ishmash biathlon rifle might be a good choice, but it seems most of those have been bought up.

Or, put the 2013 barreled action in a more conventional stock.

Some may suggest the Anschutz 14XX series rifles (64 action instead of the 54) which would be less expensive than the 17XX series rifles.

 

[SMH]

G2G-Is it a common consensus that Volquartson is superior to Tac Solutions?

ivan-The 10/22 1237 looks like a great "bang for the buck" (I found some excellent reviews) and might be the perfect option if we have several shooters to outfit but I will also want at least one higher dollar more exotic option.

Diablo-The Anschutz 1712 would be top on my bolt gun list and I nearly purchased one a few years ago, but I assume a semi auto would be more advantageous in the hands of a semi skilled shooter due to the time limits?
I hadn't considered sporterizing the 2013. I don't know if there are any readily available stocks for that action but I think the single shot would be tough on the kids under time limits. (I should time the kids under a silhouette course of fire to see how they do with a single shot) I'm also not sure if the 2.75 OUNCE trigger is legal.
I'm really not interested in selling it as I compete in a winter league with it but the current version (slightly different aluminum stock than mine) is $3950 without sights from Champion's Choice. (ouch!) I may have the 2013 and several other nice items for sale when I start putting kids through college but it will be while before I have to worry about that!

 

[g2gjoe]

I don't know if it's a common consensus that tactical solutions are not accurate. I only know from my own experience. I've put together quite a few 10\22's, Browning Buck Marks, and a couple Ruger pistols. I've used everything from whistle pig barrels to Volquartsen, Kidd, Magnum research, tactical solutions, and on and on and on. In my own experience, tactical solutions are less accurate than factory barrels. But they do have their place, great for Jack rabbit hunting out in the sagebrush. Accurate enough and superlight. But nowhere near bench rest quality.

 

[Only10x]

Ive been shooting silhouette for about 4 years now, 1712 with a Leupold x30 which can be shot in both hunter and standard class. I don't know if the NRA has made a semi auto class (doubt it) but maybe so I can't comment on which semi auto set up would work 'best'.
I do however suggest you keep the kids you coach on a bolt action especially if they're going on to NRA or International small bore for the simple reason that they get to value that shot. 10x is better than 10 and tenths of a point can be the difference between gold and silver in International SB.
+1 for the Steelchickens forum, many entry level shooters are steered towards the CZ and the Ruger American .22, they're no Anschutz but they'll get your kids to learn the fundamentals of offhand shooting without breaking the bank.

 

[TOP PREDATOR]

at the higher tiers "factory" rifles Anschutz, Cooper, Kimbers.

a lot of custom stuff is out there too.

at the middle are usually your CZ's, a sako every now and then, 77/22. IMO the CZ is probably the best all around rifle for hunting or standard for the $.

nothing really wrong with going with a savage, ruger american, marlin xt, generally considered in the lower tier of rifles, though i've seen a few AAA scores shot with them.

i just got a ruger american compact for hunting class to fart around with, so far it's really not that much of a slouch, 2nd time out with it and shooting AA scores, and very affordable to outfit a group of kids.

mostly dominated by bolt actions, optics are usually a leopold, weaver T36 or T16, something with a target dot is usually the norm.

check out the silhouette rules on equipment,
http://compete.nra.org/documents/pdf/compete/RuleBooks/Sil-r/sil-r-book.pdf
that may help you decide further on what rifle division to get outfitted with (Standard division- gucci rifles / Hunting division - more mundane rifles). whatever is more similar in weight and configuration to your current stuff is like is probably what you want to go with. generally you can use a hunting rifle and standard, but rarely a standard setup in hunting. your biggest battle to decide is barrel taper, weight, trigger poundage, and stock configuration.

keep in mind too it's all offhand, those heavy barreled / stocked rifle tire out the arms pretty quick.

don't worry about the 2.5 minutes and a bolt, you'll see once you pace yourself there's more than enough time. also an extra magazine or two if you go mag fed comes in handy

warning - once you knock over your first animal, and here that "ping" you get addicted real quick

a couple other links
The Steel Target, Rifle Shooting Sport of NRA Rifle Silhouette
Welcome to the Steelchickens Frontpage
Silhouette Shooting - RimfireCentral.com Forums
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJjiqOqA950

 

[SMH]

Thank you for all of the great information! (Please keep it coming)

I will keep the kids shooting iron sight match rifles for 3P and 4P but I am open to bolt or auto for Silhouette.

It sounds like the Anschutz 1712 is the gold standard for Silhouette and that there aren't many semiautos in the game.
I am currently pricing and hunting down 1712s and Volquartson semiautos as those are my current top picks in each action type.

Is each 5 animal string limited to 5 shots? Or is it any number of shots in the given time limit? (I'm assuming it is 1rd/animal but I didn't see it clearly stated in the rules)

 

[nervous]

Thank you for all of the great information! (Please keep it coming)

I will keep the kids shooting iron sight match rifles for 3P and 4P but I am open to bolt or auto for Silhouette.

It sounds like the Anschutz 1712 is the gold standard for Silhouette and that there aren't many semiautos in the game.
I am currently pricing and hunting down 1712s and Volquartson semiautos as those are my current top picks in each action type.

Is each 5 animal string limited to 5 shots? Or is it any number of shots in the given time limit? (I'm assuming it is 1rd/animal but I didn't see it clearly stated in the rules)

1 target, 1 Shot!

 

[Only10x]

(2) 5- shot strings per animal at 40, 60, 77 and 100 meters in 2:30 with a :15 prep period.

 

[TOP PREDATOR]

^

10 animals at a distance (chicken 40, pig 60, turkey 77 and ram 100 meters or (43.6, 65.6, 84.3, 109.3 yards in American)

every animal gets shot at only once, from left to right. if you miss, you move on to your next animal.

there are 5 animals to be shot first, then the second bank of 5 animals for a total of 10 animals / shots per distance.

my range commands script i use, copied ans pasted (an alibi is a misfeed, misfire, FTE, or any problem with the rifle or ammo that needs attention - like a mulligan in golf, however once the problem is addressed, they still have to fire their round(s) from where the alibi occurred) :

<<<<Competitors, after you are called to the line, you will be commanded to come to the ready. You will have 15 seconds to load your rifles in a safe manner and prepare to fire.

Once the command to fire is given you will have 2 ½ minutes to clear your 1[SUP]st[/SUP] bank of 5 animals FROM LEFT TO RIGHT.

At the end of the 2 ½ minutes a cease fire will be called, and any alibis will be addressed. 1 ALIBI PER COMPETITOR PER MATCH.

You will be commanded to open your action, and make your unloaded rifle and line safe. A break of approximately 30 seconds will be allowed to reload your magazine and prepare for your 2nd bank of animals.

The process will resume and when finished and all competitors rifles and line is made safe, you will be commanded to go to your second animal.

1. Relay # ____, come to the line.

2. Relay #____, for your FIRST bank of five animals, (pause)

READY!

(15 seconds to load)

FIRE!

(2 ½ minutes)

CEASE FIRE!

ANY ALIBIS?

ACTIONS OPEN, MAKE RIFLE AND THE LINE SAFE!


1. Relay # ____, come to the line.

2. Relay #____, for your SECOND bank of five animals, (pause)

READY!

(15 seconds to load)

FIRE!

(2 ½ minutes)

CEASE FIRE!

ANY ALIBIS?

ACTIONS OPEN, MAKE RIFLE AND THE LINE SAFE!

(IF MORE THAN ONE RELAY, RESET TARGETS, SECOND RELAY GETS CALLED TO THE LINE, REPEAT PROCEDURE, call second relay to remove equipment, and call first relay back to the line)

If one relay – once line is safe, COMPETITORS REPORT TO YOUR SECOND ANIMAL!>>>

 

[NewsShooter]

I'd look at the Kidd's over the Volquartsens, don't see much love for the Volquartsens on rimfire central. Probably more of a cost benefit ratio. I know the 10/22's with GM barrels I built for my nephews for Christmas will shoot sub moa at 50 yards shooting with a bipod and rear bag with CCI SV. I shot test targets to include in the cases with the rifles, both shot tight groups, not one hole but not far off it at 50 yards. I haven't shot groups at 100 yards with them but the boys, 10 & 13 were able to knock over the rimfire steel at all distances easily. But again they were shooting prone with a bipod and rear bag. Even had them running timed chaos drills which they loved, the first time they shot on the steel range.

 

[JG26_Irish]

ivan-The 10/22 1237 looks like a great "bang for the buck" (I found some excellent reviews) and might be the perfect option if we have several shooters to outfit but I will also want at least one higher dollar more exotic option.

Diablo-The Anschutz 1712 would be top on my bolt gun list and I nearly purchased one a few years ago, but I assume a semi auto would be more advantageous in the hands of a semi skilled shooter due to the time limits?

With a single shot bolt one can easily average one shot per 30seconds without rushing. When I shoot a 25 rd course of fire in ARA or IR50/50 I will complete all 25 rds plus 5-10 sighters/foulers in 12-13 min. Total rds usually about 35. Time per rd=22sec per shot. To shoot off hand with a single shot, it helps to have a belt mounted cartridge dispenser. For silhouette, a 5 shot repeater is better for lots of reasons.

Irish

 

[SMH]

Great information! Thank you!
I couldn't find an Anschutz 1712 in stock so in a moment of weakness I ordered a Volquartsen. (I will add the Anschutz later)
I hope to have it in hand by this weekend. (snake flute with removable forward blow comp in a high gloss blue laminate Stocky's Eliminator stock)

If the weather cooperates, I will immediately test it out against my Anschutz 2013. (no I don't expect it to beat the 2013)
I am limited in my ammo selection but I know I have adequate supplies of Remington Eley Match Xtra Plus, Aquila Super Extra, CCI mini mags and probably a few others.
It sounds like the KID trigger would be the way to go (I prefer 2 stage triggers) but I will cross that bridge another time. (my 4-Hers will be shooting it more than I do anyway)

The Anschutz 2013 averaged in the .5s and .6s at 100 with a cherished lot of yellow box Remington Eley, around .75 with Tenex, Midas and similar and 1-1 1/4 with most others. My 10/22T groups about double the 2013 so I expect the Volquartsen to be on the Anschutz side of splitting the difference. (If not, I will be very disappointed and it will probably be for sale!)

Thanks again for the education and the insights.

 

[SMH]

Update-
I received the Volquartsen and it is absolutely beautiful. (Stainless snake flute with forward comp in a blue laminate silhouette stock)

I slapped a Leupold 6.5-20 Target Dot on it and started to zero it in.
I fired multiple 5 shot groups with each of 10 different ammo choices.
I expected tighter groups at 100 yards, unfortunately, I was shooting at 50.

I noticed that the barrel was not free floated. This was my bad as I had the barreled action ordered in a Stocky's Eliminator instead of a Volquartsen stock. I also noticed that the compensator was slightly loose. I removed ~.05 from the stock to fix the free float issue and tightened down the comp. With high hopes I tried more groups and didn't see a bit of difference. The RWS target averaged 1.1 inches for 3 consecutive 5 shot groups, Rem Eley Match Extra Plus averaged 1.0 inches and the Fed GM Ultra Match went .9.

I was frustrated but I was also reasonably certain that it was a rifle not a shooter/ammo/conditions issue. (There was a slight variable breeze but not enough that I felt it was significantly affecting group size) I took the Leupold off of the Volquartsen and placed it on my Anschutz 2013 and fired some groups. Rem Eley went .37 for 3 x 5 round groups. RWS Target went .35 and a single group (low on ammo) of Fed GM UM went .29.

Reliability was acceptable in my opinion for a a new semi-auto firing a variety of ammo. I had 1 failure to feed and 1 "double" in ~250 rounds. I did notice a bulged case that might have been part of the "double". Apparently it doubled slightly out of battery?

I will speak to Volquartsen on Monday and I assume I will be hand delivering the rifle to them at my first opportunity.
I am confident that they will find the problem and hopefully it will impress me the next time I shoot it.

I did remove the little foam pad that was stuck in the end of the stock to create a truly free floated barrel.
Was this a mistake? Should I put it back and shoot again before returning the rifle?
I welcome any suggestions, theories or comments on how to make this thing shoot.