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Looking for some advice

M

Mschrum

Private
Minuteman
Nov 30, 2022
29
2
York Pa
Morning guys and gals. I’m looking to get into some bench shooting. Nothing real crazy but I want to be able to shoot tight groups out to say 500 yards or so. What caliber do you recommend and am I better off finding a heavy barrel Remington 700 or similar rifle or trying to find a used custom gun somewhere ? I don’t have a huge budget for this so seeking some advice from the experts on here.
Thanks, Mike
 
First, set your budget.
This sport, like most, can get very expensive.
500 yards can be done with a .223, but if you don't reload, match ammo costs about the same as other calibers.
The .308 used to be the standard answer, but 6mm and 6.5 Creedmoor are attractive alternatives.
The .308 has long barrel life. Longer than the 6.5 and much longer than the 6mm.
The easy, least expensive answer is a howa heavy barrel in an oryx chassis with an arken scope.
 
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fdkay said:
First, set your budget.
This sport, like most, can get very expensive.
500 yards can be done with a .223, but if you don't reload, match ammo costs about the same as other calibers.
The .308 used to be the standard answer, but 6mm and 6.5 Creedmoor are attractive alternatives.
The .308 has long barrel life. Longer than the 6.5 and much longer than the 6mm.
The easy, least expensive answer is a howa heavy barrel in an oryx chassis with an arken scope.
Click to expand...
I do reload so I have that going for me. So the howa is better than a Remington?
 
Your budget will guide us to give worthwhile recommendations. Do you have a budget in mind? Do you have tools (barrel vise, torque wrench, headspace gauges, etc) and mechanical ability to assemble a rifle yourself?
 
stevieb92 said:
Your budget will guide us to give worthwhile recommendations. Do you have a budget in mind? Do you have tools (barrel vise, torque wrench, headspace gauges, etc) and mechanical ability to assemble a rifle yourself?
Click to expand...
I’m very mechanically inclined. With a little direction I do not see any reason I couldn’t assemble a rifle. I have torque wrench’s but that’s about it…. I’d say my budget is under $1000
 
With that budget in mind, buying an action, barrel, chassis and trigger are going to bust through that easily. Under $1000 I would recommend a Bergara HMR or Tikka T3X. The Bergara is a Remington 700 pattern, so aftermarket accessories are almost limitless. The Tikka has some aftermarket support, but not nearly as much as Remington and clones. As far as a cartridge, I would go with 6.5 creedmoor. Very easy to load high quality ammo and match ammo is available off the shelf too.

www.eurooptic.com

Bergara B-14 HMR 6.5 Creedmoor 22" 1:8" Bbl Rifle with Molded Mini-Chassis Stock B14S352C

Bergara B-14 HMR 6.5 Creedmoor 22" 1:8" Bbl Rifle with Molded Mini-Chassis Stock B14S352C For Sale
www.eurooptic.com www.eurooptic.com

www.eurooptic.com

Tikka T3x Varmint 6.5 Creedmoor 24.33" 1:8" Rifle JRTXH382

Flat Rate Shipping on Tikka T3x Varmint 6.5 Creedmoor 24.33" 1:8" Rifle JRTXH382
www.eurooptic.com www.eurooptic.com
 
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Newbie2020 said:
Old guy alert: I’ll echo the 223 sentiment. Even if it’s not significantly cheaper the low recoil of 223 in a heavy barrel setup is fun for a lifetime.
Click to expand...
I don’t see many heavy barrel 223 around my area. I would def consider that option thou!
 
Mschrum said:
I do reload so I have that going for me. So the howa is better than a Remington?
Click to expand...
I can't speak to the new Remington rifles, word is that they are apparently pretty good, which is refreshing.
The Howa is a well made rifle that has some benefits, the bolt is a single piece of steel (a remington bolt is three pieces) the action is a flat bottom, which some folks love. It has an integral recoil lug. The Howa has a pretty damn good two stage trigger. The remington triggers are hit and miss. I've had ones that were serviceable, I had one that was quite good and I've had ones that were trash.

There is an entire aftermarket industry dedicated to the 700 platform.
There is aftermarket support for the Howa, but it is not nearly the same.
You can get a howa barreled action and an Oryx chassis for less than 1000 bucks. The chassis is out of stock now, but you can also consider a KRG Bravo

https://www.brownells.com/gun-parts...00-308-win-24-threaded-heavy-barreled-action/
www.brownells.com

ORYX CHASSIS HOWA SHORT ACTION

ORYX CHASSIS HOWA SHORT ACTION https://www.brownells.com/gun-parts/rifle-parts/rifle-stocks-parts/oryx-chassis-howa-short-action/
www.brownells.com www.brownells.com

Another option is the Howa mini action in 6.5 grendel, again, you can buy the barreled action and a chassis and still be below 1000 bucks.
 
Mschrum said:
Morning guys and gals. I’m looking to get into some bench shooting. Nothing real crazy but I want to be able to shoot tight groups out to say 500 yards or so. What caliber do you recommend and am I better off finding a heavy barrel Remington 700 or similar rifle or trying to find a used custom gun somewhere ? I don’t have a huge budget for this so seeking some advice from the experts on here.
Thanks, Mike
Click to expand...


There are a few different calibers you could consider for bench shooting at 500 yards. Depending on your budget and what type of rifle you're looking for, I'd recommend looking into a 6mm BR or a 6.5 Creedmoor. Both calibers are known to be extremely accurate and can reach your desired distances easily.

For the rifle, you may be able to find a good used custom gun, but you can also find some really nice pre-fabricated rifles nowadays in Remington 700 or similar designs that are chambered to these calibers. With a pre-fabricated rifle, you should be able to find something within your budget that will give you the performance you're looking for.
 
I found this at my local shop. Rem 700 heavy barrel in 308. $550
 

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I’d try to find a cheap donor 700 action either a used gun, Maybe Bruno’s, Brownells or PTG has new Remington actions in stock. Screw a remage on it and enjoy. If you’re on a budget, then the Remington action is a good way to go, because there’s tons of aftermarket support, and tons of used parts available, making it easily upgraded for cheap, a working man can slowly build a decent rig over time.
 
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Mschrum said:
I found this at my local shop. Rem 700 heavy barrel in 308. $550
Click to expand...
That's not a bad start, they tend to shoot very well.
You'll want a new stock or chassis.
That is a BDL model, you can get some really decent stocks for it.
For your intended purpose, you don't need a chassis system with detachable mags.
These are really decent stocks and a huge upgrade:

Bell and Carlson: Bell and Carlson Remington Model Remington 700 BDL, M40 Style

Bell and Carlson is a leader in synthetic stock design, technology and manufacturer of the highest quality fiberglass, aramid and graphite gun stocks available.
www.bellandcarlson.com

These are awesome and have adjustability, and would be my choice, though you'll need to buy a magazine:
mdttac.com

ORYX Rifle Chassis

mdttac.com mdttac.com

You will eventually put a new trigger in it, but the adjustable one it has is usualyy pretty decent as long as you don;t go below 3 pounds.

Wish I could find a deal like that around here.
 
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Mschrum said:
I found this at my local shop. Rem 700 heavy barrel in 308. $550
Click to expand...

Looks like an SPS Varmint - should shoot 5/8 or better if it wasn't abused. Achilles heel for that rifle was the flimsy forend on the stock - with pressure, it could bind and touch the barrel, causing accuracy problems that were difficult to nail down. Dremel it out to better float it, bed it with epoxy, and keep a good skim coat all the way down the forend to stiffen her up. I've even seen guys drill the stocks and put stainless rods down them to get 'em stiff. Or do nothing and just be aware it's an issue. 2nd is the trigger - you can get the stock trigger down to around 1.6-1.7lbs. Suggest doing that first before spending more cash. Finally, with the beautifully long throat she'll likely have, you'll find you can seat long projectiles like 208 eld-m's out far enough to get much better ballistics - (my 5r load with 24" barrel and the 208 eld-m is 2640fps).
 
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Mschrum said:
I found this at my local shop. Rem 700 heavy barrel in 308. $550
Click to expand...

While it may seem this is a decent deal to start, consider the stock is junk, the trigger is sub par and the barrel isn't threaded for a muzzle device (suppressor or brake). You'll be far ahead picking up the Bergara HMR or Tikka T3X Varmint linked above. Over 10 years ago, I started down this path and bought a Rem 700 AAC-SD in 308. I replaced the stock and trigger and developed a hand load that produced .5 - .75 moa accuracy. Had the HMR or T3X been offered at that time, it would have been an easy decision to skip the Rem. There are many stories around the net of achieving these results with the HMR or T3X using factory Hornady ELD ammo in 6.5 creedmoor flavor. Just my $.02.
 
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Mschrum said:
I don’t know that I’ve ever seen one around here. Not a savage anyway.
Click to expand...
I love my Savage 110 Storm in .223. Sub-MOA groups are no problem with loads it likes and it`s a hunting rifle as opposed to a dedicated target gun. No functional issues in a couple of years and several hundred rounds. If you don`t already know, there will most likely be some posters who will denigrate all things Savage. I do recommend a 110 over the Axis II, however, although a lot of folks shoot guns from the Axis line and seem to like them.
 
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I thought for sure I’d find something in the sale/trade section on here but mostly high dollar stuff.
 
I'll generally grab my .223 over my .308 to shoot targets out to 600. It's more accurate than the .308, easier to shoot and requires less elevation to 1K with 77SMk's than the .308 shooting FGGM 175's. .223 is a savage with a factory f class barrel, .308 is a tikka with an aftermarket barrel.
 
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Need to be extra careful with Remington’s, used to be fine rifles, than corporate greed took over and they fell to the very bottom of the pack. Very old 700’s tend to be good actions but a fellow really needs to have them trued up before adding a barrel. All that could well push your budget over the top, before you do anything else. (That would donor rifle, barrel, action trued and barrel install).

So, I would recommend the Bergera. They make very good barrels and are of a Remington footprint which means lots and lots of aftermarket support. Lots of options for the future. Nothing wrong with Tikka, or Howa. Can’t really speak for Tikka from personal experience but I own a Weatherby Vanguard, which uses a Howa action and barrel and it has become my goto hunting rifle, leaving customs and more expensive rifles sitting in the safe. (We also own a CVA with a Bergera barrel and its good too).
 
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Try searching for some gun shows in your area. Most everything was priced sky high, I just saw a few Remington 700 SPS's in 308 with varmint barrel for $599 NIB and several Savage model 110's, 12's for $600-ish at a show this past weekend.
That Bergara HMR would be an excellent rifle also, I've been looking at those myself.
 
Mschrum said:
Wow !!! Have you ever bought from here before ??? Seems to good to be true ?!
Click to expand...
They are great to deal with . Calling them on the phone is the best way to communicate , they are old school . I bet they can fix you up with a nice bench gun . They know the sport and will not BS you .
 
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They are great to deal with . Calling them on the phone is the best way to communicate , they are old school . I bet they can fix you up with a nice bench gun . They know the sport and will not BS you .

Awesome ! Thank you
 
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22lr or 223 would cover you out to 500 and be challenging with wind calls , cheap on the pocket while fun to shoot what more could you ask for
 
spife7980 said:
You tell me. You gave two options, I listed only one of them.

But both. The savage action sucks dick, and the 22-250 is going to have a slow as fuck twist meaning it too sucks dick.
Click to expand...
I was curious if it was the gun or the caliber you didn’t like. But you answered my question now. I’m so confused. One person loves savage and hates howa and the next is the opposite
 
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Mschrum said:
I was curious if it was the gun or the caliber you didn’t like. But you answered my question now. I’m so confused. One person loves save and hates howa and the next is the opposite
Click to expand...
I own a low end savage, and don’t really like it at all… never owned a howa but iver heard nothing but good things about them for what it’s worth
 
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Howa is a fine rifle so I have heard, have no first hand experience though so cannot honestly compare. Do have first hand experience with a Savage 110 Storm in .223. Have enjoyed it a great deal, particularly its accuracy and precision. Have had no issues with the action, although I would recommend a larger bolt knob to facilitate the lift. As far as movement of the bolt, smooth as silk. Not really sure what`s being referred to as a " low end Savage " but I assume Axis or Axis II (? ). Do not have personal experience in shooting with the Axis line myself but they are the most prevalent hunting rifle at our range where I shoot. I`ve personally yet to encounter an Axis owner at the range who was dissatisfied with their gun. Though I`ve not shot an Axis model, I`ve handled some. For me the 110s feel much more solid.
 
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If it’s a bvss in a savage model 12 I would take that over the Howa. The 22-250 will most likely be shot out and need a new barrel. Buying a used rifle rarely works out well. Most guys that have a accurate rifle keep it. That’s why I would recommend the savage route and change the barrel yourself. Or pony up the money for a New Tikka. Everyone has a opinion on brand preference but for me it would come down to ease of barrel change. If you really want to try the cheap route a Ruger American Predator in 6.5 Creed would probably shoot decent.
 
No experience with either caliber…. But I’d say the 6.5 would be easier to spot shots, better barrel life, and more authority if you decide to take it hunting. I think there’s a reason the 6.5 is pretty popular among the PRS competitors and the 22-250 isn’t.

Just my .02
 
These are the 2 I’m looking at.
 

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Gotta do more research before shopping - if you're interested in the sport, you will commit to memory... which projectiles go with which calibers and what twist goes with each projectile, as well as roundabout velocity numbers for different sized cartridges for said projectiles. Until that's committed to memory, it's all easily searchable here. At least run ballistics for the rifles you're considering...
 
Codiekfx400 said:
That’s why I would recommend the savage route and change the barrel yourself. Or pony up the money for a New Tikka. Everyone has a opinion on brand preference but for me it would come down to ease of barrel change. If you really want to try the cheap route a Ruger American Predator in 6.5 Creed would probably shoot decent.
Click to expand...
It you can that that very same thing with every action you listed afterwards… so why would you go savage?
 
spife7980 said:
It you can that that very same thing with every action you listed afterwards… so why would you go savage?
Click to expand...
Savage barrels are easier to find a good deal on. Tikka barrels need to be cut off. Savage has a floating bolt head and accutrigger? And if those aren’t good enough reasons beating the custom rig with a savage you Frankensteined yourself with a fired piece piece of brass from someone else’s rifle for a headspace gauge is satisfying enough. I am still talking benchrest. If he’s going for prs type shooting I would recommend Tikka or Remington 700. If he could double his budget then Zermatt Origin.
 
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I forgot to add that Eric cortina did a few YouTube videos about those Rem sps tactical rifles. He goes through adding mods and how well they shoot after. Worth watching.
 
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