MORE INPUT PLEASE on my .223 loads

[BgBmBoo]

Hi gang.

Ok...a few more questions from the newbie reloading. I followed the advice of the last few of you who gave me some input and now have a few more questions.

Ok...I have been working on a load for my .223 bolt gun (Tikka T3 Lite 1:8 barrel). I use it for coyote hunting with some paper punching but not much. Yes....I know I can use heavy bullets but again...main thing is hunting.

So...please look at the pics below. The top two are of my loads and the info is:

Black Hills fired brass FL sized and trimmed.
CCI primers
Ramshot TAC powder
50gr Hornady Vmax bullets
Seating depth is 1.8985 ogive (any longer and they wont fit the mag)

Al shooting done from the prone with bi-pod and rear bag.

1st pic is using 24.8gn load

2nd pic is using 26.1gn load.

I tried groups above and below these loads and these were the best.

3rd pic is factory Black Hills 50gr Vmax

My 1st question is since the two groups are pretty much the same...do you go for the hotter of the two? And if so..why? I mean the coyote is not going to know the 100fps difference. I would like less wear and tear and the rifle, but would like YOUR input on a lighter load vs hotter one.

Next question....the Black Hills ammo is very short (COAL 2.220 or something) so would it be better for me to seat the bullets closer to the Black Hills or leave them out closer to the lands like I am doing now? As you see....the BH factory ammo shoots almost half the size groups then my loads.

Thanks again guys,Stan

 

[BgBmBoo]

Re: MORE INPUT PLEASE on my .223 loads

Anyone???

 

[jasonk]

Re: MORE INPUT PLEASE on my .223 loads

Know anyone with a chrono, I'd compare the BH speed to your two loads. Every gun is different and likes different seating depths. How do the loads in between those shoot, like 25.5? I'd stick with 26 grains and start seating a little deeper to get closer to the BH load, see if the groups tighten up.

Also, look up "ladder test".

J

 

[Joeyhotfizzle]

Re: MORE INPUT PLEASE on my .223 loads

Since both loads shoot the same I would go with the less hotter of the two. Better brass life and less powder used. Unless you want more velocity to buck the wind or less drop at further distances then go with the hotter load.

Have you tested both loads at 200 yards or further? I would do that and figure out which one will shoot better at longer ranges.

Oh yeah nice shooting BTW.

 

[308sako]

Re: MORE INPUT PLEASE on my .223 loads

.

 

[Queequeg]

Re: MORE INPUT PLEASE on my .223 loads

I'd love to see a bigger sample size before making a conclusion. Obviously you're getting close to where you want to be relative to the BHA VMAX round. Clearly your rifle loves the 50 grain VMAX!

The Lowlight target you used for that first photo provides a great test board for my loads. I load 25 of each sample and fire 5 at each 1" circle. I feel it gives me a pretty good idea of what the load is capable of.

As to which velocity is preferred, I'd prefer the faster if it is equally accurate.

 

[Larry Burchfield]

Re: MORE INPUT PLEASE on my .223 loads

Looks to me like the wind got you if the group is spread like that. The lest wind will do numbers to the .223 bullets. I shoot Horndy 52gr hpbt match bullets in my 700VS Remington and 25.5grs of IMR4895 but you powder will work just as well.
It also looks like you might need to try changing the seating depth. It may like them in the lands and it may like to jump to the lands.
larryj

 

[Halfnutz]

Re: MORE INPUT PLEASE on my .223 loads

Try seating them back a little at a time .005 to .01 until you get to the BH length. See what effect that has.
You have a pretty wide spread between charge wieghts (1.3). Have you already ran the wieghts in between, say in .3 to .4 grain increments?
If you are going to chase a near 1/2 MOA factory group, I think a chronograph would be alot of help.

As mentioned above what you have now should have no problem kill'n Yotes.

 

[chuff]

Re: MORE INPUT PLEASE on my .223 loads

You could always try a different bullet/powder combo. I have a 1:9 twist in my 223 and it doesn't care for anything lighter than 55 gr. and doesn't like the VMax in any weight. I settled on the 55 grain Nosler B. Tips with AA 2230. I'm not saying that will work for you too but changing up your powder/bullet combo might be worth a shot.

It looks to me like you're in good shape with that load, though. I'm not sure what you're really hoping to change about it. The first handload group in particular is very tight without those two shots outside the group. Also, like others have said your spread is much more horizontal than it is vertical which points more to the shooter than the load. Honestly it looks to me like it's a rifle driving issue rather than a load issue. No offense meant at all - we all put shots outside the group and your shooting is just fine. If it were me, though, I'd be calling that load good and looking to improve my use of it. Get that POI over where the POA is and go kill some yotes.

As far as overall length goes I generally seat a hunting load to maximum magazine length for starters and fine tune it from there if I need to.

 

[jasonk]

Re: MORE INPUT PLEASE on my .223 loads

What's your COAL compared to the BH? How much longer are you than they are?

 

[BgBmBoo]

Re: MORE INPUT PLEASE on my .223 loads

COAL is 2.280 on MY loads and the factory BH is 2.250.

I have tried some different powders...BenchMark, N-133,and some Sierra Blitz King bullets, but did not spend much time on them. Found a good load for my AR using BenchMark and the BK bullets.

Thanks for all the input,Stan

 

[jasonk]

Re: MORE INPUT PLEASE on my .223 loads

I would still stick with 26.1 and try 2.27, 2.26 and 2.25 lengths and see what happens.

 

[Brians708]

Re: MORE INPUT PLEASE on my .223 loads

BBB,
After reviewing the advice offered it looks like you are hell bent on your own .300" Loads. I can respect that. As mentioned the Crono is the right tool to answer 1/2 of the questions.

I will add this:
1) You note you are using once fired BH brass. Is that stamped BH or is it BH re-man's where they use LC brass?
2) Is the last group from BH "NEW" or is it re-man?
3) If the once fired's you are using to load were fired in your chamber, I say neck size only on them....It will make the brass last longer and trim a few more Pewbs off the group....

 

[Queequeg]

Re: MORE INPUT PLEASE on my .223 loads

Is it possible there are distractions in your reloading regimen? Perhaps a young beauty popping her pretty head into the proceedings every once in a while at key moments?

Got to stay focused man

 

[BgBmBoo]

Re: MORE INPUT PLEASE on my .223 loads

LOL...no...I load when she is at work...then UN-load when she gets home!

Brian...the last group is from FACTORY Black Hills RED BOX ammo...so NEW.

I am not hell bent on any length...just been told over and over it is better to have the bullet closer to the lands.

The brass I am using is from NEW Black Hills (again...red box ammo) That I have shot through my different .223's...and says BH Match .223 on the head.

I just loaded up some more tonight and if the wind stops blowing 15+ mph by morning I hope to get out and try them out and see what happens.
Will post results.

Take care,Stan

 

[Queequeg]

Re: MORE INPUT PLEASE on my .223 loads

It seemed like a distinct possibility is all...

 

[Larry Burchfield]

Re: MORE INPUT PLEASE on my .223 loads

Stan
At what range do you shoot and how much wind do you have? Also do you use wind flags?
larryj

 

[Brians708]

Re: MORE INPUT PLEASE on my .223 loads

Cool, I have used the BH Match brass as well with good results. I just want to clear up if there was some LC in the mix which as I am sure you have read up on, will change pressures given the beefy brass.

Anyway, Try to keep your form fired brass from this weapon separate and use it in some tests, ( Neck Sized) unless you score some .300" groups today......

 

[Brians708]

Re: MORE INPUT PLEASE on my .223 loads

Howd it shoot?