Rifle Scopes MPVO with tree reticle that is usable at low power?

[ClangClang]

Right up front - I realize this may be an impossible request. But I don't know everything that's out there so I'm posting up in case I learn about something new. I'm looking for a first focal plane MPVO (2-20 or anything in between) to go on a 6mm ARC gas gun to be used at tactical matches with targets from 10 to 750 yards. I've already tried a Vortex 1-10 and didn't love the fixed parallax. It's clearly optimized for usage on the low end rather than the high end. I'm hoping to find something optimized for the high end but still usable at the low end. When I look at the reticles (Tremor 3, MIL-XT, SKMR3, etc) in all the "common" choices (MK5, NX8, etc) they are all completely invisible at bottom magnification. I'm hoping to find something with just a decent red dot at minimum mag to hose paper targets at 10 yards that also has a decent mil based christsmas tree reticle when zoomed in for engaging steel at 600-900 yards.

So, are there any options out there that sound like they might fit the bill? I'm hoping to not use an offset micro RDS if possible.

 

[TheOE800]

I've already tried a Vortex 1-10 and didn't love the fixed parallax. It's clearly optimized for usage on the low end rather than the high end.

Call Vortex and ask if they’ll adjust it to 300 yards.

You have/had the March 1-10 right? They have a 1.5-15x launching with the same reticles.

 

[beetroot]

What exactly are you looking for?
You wont get a tree that is usable on less than 4x, the subtensions are just too close together ant the lines so thin that it just doesn't work.

For a reticle to be usedul at lower magnification (less than 3x) you want the main stadia lines to be at least .05mil thick in my opinion. You can get away with thinner lines in good light, or a high contrast target, or if shooting a big target at close range (by bracketing with the thicker outer stadia) but .05mil or thicker on the centre cross is the way to go if you can find a reticle that size.

The new March 1.5-15 mentioned above would be near perfect for what you want.
The dual focal plane has a nice bold SFP duplex reticle with a bright dot for use at lower magnification for point and shoot type scenarios, then as you zoom in you get your FFP tree reticle for your holds.

 

[Cutout]

I think FFP reticles have become more universally popular than they are universally useful. Everybody seems to want FFP LPVOs and MPVOs, so that is what the market is currently offering. But personally, I think that SFP still has a place and that place is LPVOs and MPVOs. Obviously there are other opinions that may be more valid, but let me attempt to justify mine: A quick reticle at low power, an accurate reticle at high power, with the compromise of not being able to use holdovers in the mid range. I don't know about you guys, but I don't spend a lot of time in the mid range. I'm usually on one end of my magnification or the other (2.5x or 10x). I guess FFP goes hand-in-hand with the high zoom ratio trend. If 20x is your top end, maybe you don't want to treat your throw lever like a light switch like I do. Again, personal preference, but I question whether the juice is worth the squeeze to have such a high zoom ratio on an LPVO or MPVO.

TL;DR - generic "everybody should be like me and run my optic" soapbox rant

I'm not an operator, a competition shooter, or an optical engineer. Just some guy on the internet with an opinion.

 

[ClangClang]

What exactly are you looking for?
You wont get a tree that is usable on less than 4x, the subtensions are just too close together ant the lines so thin that it just doesn't work.

For a reticle to be usedul at lower magnification (less than 3x) you want the main stadia lines to be at least .05mil thick in my opinion. You can get away with thinner lines in good light, or a high contrast target, or if shooting a big target at close range (by bracketing with the thicker outer stadia) but .05mil or thicker on the centre cross is the way to go if you can find a reticle that size.

Great question, I should have specified better. I'm hoping for a tree reticle that has some sort of glowing red "donut of death" at low power. Just a red dot is all I need. I'm not looking to be able to see the actual stadia.

 

[steve123]

Try the Athlon Helos G2 DMR 2-12x42 in mil. It is a WAY better scope than I thought it would be so I have two of them now. Loaded with features and a circle of death dot reticle that is easily seen at 2x even though its a FFP scope. I have absolutely no complaints with these scopes.

I've shot at less than 10Y all the way out to 1122Y with this scope. One is mounted on my 6mmFatRat which sends 95gr SMK at 2870 fps. I can pound steel almost as good as the more powerful bolt guns.

 

[ClangClang]

Call Vortex and ask if they’ll adjust it to 300 yards.

You have/had the March 1-10 right? They have a 1.5-15x launching with the same reticles.

Interesting. Didn't know that Vortex offered custom parallax settings. I'll consider that.

Never owned the March 1-10, just started a thread about it. This 1.5-15 does look interesting though. I'm checking it out.

 

[beetroot]

Great question, I should have specified better. I'm hoping for a tree reticle that has some sort of glowing red "donut of death" at low power. Just a red dot is all I need. I'm not looking to be able to see the actual stadia.

The Dual focal plane March is exactly what you are looking for, not sure if the price is what you want though.
The Razor G3 1-10 would be your next best bet but you have already tried that.

The Athlon Helos 2-12 is quite a good scope for the money but if you are wantign high end glass then you'll be disapointed.
I had one for a few months and sold it on, I liked many things about it but I don't think the reticle is as visibile on 2x as it should be based on the reticle design, and the illumination lighting up the whole reticle is a bit of a mis step IMO.

If you are willing to wait Delta have released a new 3.5-21x44 scope, there aren't many details out yet but they are saying it'll be available mid year.
I have their 4.5-30 and the reticle is pretty good (compared to most high magnifcation scopes) for use on 4.5x, I don't know what reticle they are putting in this scope but it very well could be a good option for your use.

 

[ClangClang]

The Dual focal plane March is exactly what you are looking for, not sure if the price is what you want though.
The Razor G3 1-10 would be your next best bet but you have already tried that.

The Athlon Helos 2-12 is quite a good scope for the money but if you are wantign high end glass then you'll be disapointed.
I had one for a few months and sold it on, I liked many things about it but I don't think the reticle is as visibile on 2x as it should be based on the reticle design, and the illumination lighting up the whole reticle is a bit of a mis step IMO.

If you are willing to wait Delta have released a new 3.5-21x44 scope, there aren't many details out yet but they are saying it'll be available mid year.
I have their 4.5-30 and the reticle is pretty good (compared to most high magnifcation scopes) for use on 4.5x, I don't know what reticle they are putting in this scope but it very well could be a good option for your use.

You are right that the new DFP March really does appear to be the closest thing on the market to what I'm looking for. Now just to think about exactly how financially irresponsible I want to be. Or, I could sell off the SR-25 and Razor 1-10 which I haven't shot in over a year and easily fund it, and pocket a couple grand on top. Decisions, decisions.

Looks like the new March scopes (1-10 DFP and 1.5-15 DFP) are both already listed on EuroOptic (with a very small discount available for first responders) and allegedly they'll start accepting orders in another couple weeks, sometime in March (coincidence? lol).

 

[ClangClang]

Try the Athlon Helos G2 DMR 2-12x42 in mil. It is a WAY better scope than I thought it would be so I have two of them now. Loaded with features and a circle of death dot reticle that is easily seen at 2x even though its a FFP scope. I have absolutely no complaints with these scopes

I've shot at less than 10Y all the way out to 1122Y with this scope. One is mounted on my 6mmFatRat which sends 95gr SMK at 2870 fps. I can pound steel almost as good as the more powerful bolt guns.

@steve123 thanks for the recommendation, I'll look into it!

 

[Riverlife87]

Mk5 2-10 but it only has tmr for now

 

[steve123]

@steve123 thanks for the recommendation, I'll look into it!

You're welcome.

I also have a March DF 1-10 compact and its on my 16" 223. I wanted to use the rifle close up for 3 gun, for self defense, and far away so this optic made the most sense for me on this upper.
The daylight center dot is nice.
So is the side focus.
DF is neat too.
Kinda need 1x and 10x is a bonus.

But I prefer 12x on the AHG2 2-12 for long range and tend to use it more. 12x seems like its substantially more than 10x for whatever reason??? Also some don't like the .3 mil center dot but I like that a lot. My 6mmFatRat puts groups just less than the size of the dot so inside 300Y when holding windage in normal winds the bullet will hit inside it somewhere. By 400Y I hold just off the edge of the dot.

 

[AwkwardlySocial]

Mk5 2-10 but it only has tmr for now

Has anyone heard any rumors about the Mk5 2-10 getting a Tremor3 or similar?

 

[Taylorbok]

Check out Apex Optics they have a 1-10 or 3-15 that sound like they might fit what you are looking for. Or maybe I misunderstood what you want

 

[Glassaholic]

You are right that the new DFP March really does appear to be the closest thing on the market to what I'm looking for. Now just to think about exactly how financially irresponsible I want to be. Or, I could sell off the SR-25 and Razor 1-10 which I haven't shot in over a year and easily fund it, and pocket a couple grand on top. Decisions, decisions.

Looks like the new March scopes (1-10 DFP and 1.5-15 DFP) are both already listed on EuroOptic (with a very small discount available for first responders) and allegedly they'll start accepting orders in another couple weeks, sometime in March (coincidence? lol).

Send @MOUNTIC a note, he used to carry some March 4.5-28's and 1.5-15's, not sure if he still does, but have to be ordered from factory so usually about 2 months sometimes less depending on how busy they are, they are a boutique manufacturer and make each scope by hand so you usually don't find them in stock.