Multicaliber ''Sniper'' rifles

[freezingduck]

for the civilian shooter like me, is there any big advantages to the multicaliber systems like the Sako M10, MSR and the new Multicaliber AX other than being multi caliber?
Will they be just as robust as a designated rifle?

I can see that the SRS is a great system, having a lot of calibers at a decent price.
Considering that the ''other rifles probably is going to cost 10.000+++ with a .308 and .338 barrel, and time will tell if other calibers like the .260 or even the systems will be availible to the public.

i keep thinking that something like the M10 will be a heavy and long .308, and a .338 with too many screws that can come loose.


maybe I am just trying to reason with myself... hehe

Which one do you belive is the best system?
I know that very few have had any experience with them.

MSR
Tactical 2
Ballista
SRS
AX Multicaliber
M10

 

[lessthanfour]

Re: Multicaliber ''Sniper'' rifles

you only have to buy one scope, think of the money you would save or if you use cheap scopes pool the other money towards a good scope

 

[USACS]

Re: Multicaliber ''Sniper'' rifles

The systems are very strong and they're being made to pass military tests, so I would worry about screws coming loose and other durability issues. Companies like AI and Sako don't put out junk.

The main advantage is that you have one single rifle that you can adapt to your needs or your mission. Shooting .300win mag is expensive and burns out the barrel fast. There is no need to shoot .300win mag at 500yd targets when a .308win will do it just fine. However, if you all of a sudden then want to start shooting at 1200yds or 1500yds, then you can swap out components and start shooting the .300win mag or the .338Lapua. Having a single rifle with multiple caliber capability makes it more cost effective than buying multiple rifles.

Some systems are more cost effective than others. I think DTA has a good hold on this cross-section, since I think they make the best overall modular multicaliber platform. If Barrett ever got around to making a .308 conversion for their MRAD, they might start to catch up.

I have not seen any pricing on the Sako M10 or AI AX, but the FN Ballista is supposed to be in the $8000+ price range. I'm sure the M10 and AX will be similar.

 

[PRDRIVER]

Re: Multicaliber ''Sniper'' rifles

I use the SRS and am very happy with it. They offer a number of factory caliber conversions and other manufacturers also offer custom caliber conversions.

The SRS shoots great and the caliber conversions return to their respective zero when swapping calibers.

It is one rifle that may get rid of a few rifles you have in your safe. It is also noticeably less expensive compared to the other rifles that the OP is looking at.

 

[VKC]

Re: Multicaliber ''Sniper'' rifles

At the ridiculous high prices that they are selling these multi-caliber rifles at, I personally would rather get multiple rifles and scopes.

There is also something to be said about having a rifle zeroed and DOPE'd, ready to go...being able to pick up a rifle and make cold-bore shots at distance.

I just use the same stock and scope reticles with multiple different rifles in different calibers.

 

[Victor Co Heather]

Re: Multicaliber ''Sniper'' rifles

While I love the idea of multi-caliber rifles, the truth is they aren't all that useful for guys like us.

Most shooters I know tend to stay with one caliber. It's too much of a PITA to change barrels, reload new ammo, get your zero and swap your dope. I've had a few multi-caliber swap guns and never shoot the extra calibers/barrels. (AIAW 338- 300 win mag anyone?) Why do I need to strap on a 300 win mag when my 338LM does everything I need?

Not to say I wouldn't buy another multicaliber setup... I need to own one of everything! : )

 

[ney1]

Re: Multicaliber ''Sniper'' rifles

Multi caliber sniper weapons if done right are very versatile and quick to change. Here is a video of our srs rifle showing return to zero capability at 600 yards.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_AYqHFslb1Q&feature=youtube_gdata_player

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[Arbiter]

Re: Multicaliber ''Sniper'' rifles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sr90</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Multi caliber sniper weapons if done right are very versatile and quick to change. Here is a video of our srs rifle showing return to zero capability at 600 yards.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_AYqHFslb1Q&feature=youtube_gdata_player

<object width="425" height="350"> <param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/_AYqHFslb1Q&feature=youtube_gdata_player"></param> <param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param> <embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/_AYqHFslb1Q&feature=youtube_gdata_player" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"> </embed></object> </div></div>

Still, one is left asking if they make sense from an economics standpoint.

If my goal is to own a .308 and a .338, then I could just buy a pair of TRGs for $5k, two scopes for $4k, and spend $1k on accessories for both. In this case $10k essentially gets me two complete rifle packages.

Alternatively I could buy a DTA SRS (apparently the least expensive switch-caliber platform that's going to be available in the immediate future) with two conversion kits for $5750, spend $2k on one scope, and another $500 on accessories. So I've spent $8250 to have one rifle that shoots two calibers, a rough savings of $1750.

We can only make guesses about the prices of the new systems, but $8k seems like a reasonable starting point. Tom Irwin's comment on the AI PSR suggests a price of about $12k, and what little I've heard on the Sako M10 seems to support a similar figure. At $12k plus a nominal $2k for scope and $500 for accessories, it's not nearly the same savings for a recreational shooter - the equivalent price of two $4750 rifles and gear, in essence.

Granting that this is a sport largely enjoyed by men and women for whom money is less of an obstacle than a slight deterrence, it's still something worth considering. At any price point conceivable, someone out there will still buy one. The question that the manufacturers have to ask is whether they'd prefer to sell one hundred rifles per year at $15,000 apiece, or a thousand for $5,000 each.

 

[ney1]

Re: Multicaliber ''Sniper'' rifles

$1750 savings sounds like a good excuse to upgrade your glass.

 

[PRDRIVER]

Re: Multicaliber ''Sniper'' rifles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sr90</div><div class="ubbcode-body">$1750 savings sounds like a good excuse to upgrade your glass.

</div></div>

I second this.

 

[biffj]

Re: Multicaliber ''Sniper'' rifles

Right now you are thinking 2 cals but down the line you may decide that the 6.5X47 is the cats ass or perhaps the next super line-drive deluxe is. In any case the possibility of changing the barrel and bolt (if necessary) makes a switch barrel type a lot more appealing. My SRS was purchased in .338 Lapua and I'm very happy with it. As of now I've got a 12.7X48 barrel for it and will soon have a .338 BR setup as well. I know a lot of guys think swapping the parts and dealing with ammo is painful but in real life its simple and easy. I can swap the barrel in the SRS in less than a minute and all the stuff for 3 different rounds fits in my hard case. The zero change is consistent for each setup so its not that big of a deal to dope out each one and keep track. Having one trigger, cheekweld and scope to deal with is nice and makes it possible to be more consistent all around. I don't know much about the other brands but for me the SRS has been exactly as advertised. I sold off a couple other rifles and haven't missed them.
On the down side the barrel extensions for the SRS are expensive but are pretty much the heart of the rifle. Thats about all I can bitch about.

Frank

 

[stefan73]

Re: Multicaliber ''Sniper'' rifles

I'm thinking about a .260 barrel for my Sako. Which would be nice. A swap barrel rifle has some flexibility depending on what you want it for IMO.

 

[mouse07410]

Re: Multicaliber ''Sniper'' rifles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Freezingduck</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Will they be just as robust as a designated rifle?</div></div>
I'd say they are at least as robust, based on my experience with DTA SRS and Rem 700 with its original stock and AICS.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Freezingduck</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I can see that the SRS is a great system, having a lot of calibers at a decent price.
Considering that the ''other rifles probably is going to cost 10.000+++ with a .308 and .338 barrel, and time will tell if other calibers like the .260 or even the systems will be availible to the public.</div></div>
260 Rem has been available for SRS since a few months ago. Ask me how I know.

 

[PRDRIVER]

Re: Multicaliber ''Sniper'' rifles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mouse07410</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
260 Rem has been available for SRS since a few months ago. Ask me how I know.

</div></div>

Me too. Being able to just purchase a barrel or conversion kit to shoot a new caliber is much nicer and typical less expensive than having to go out and buy a new gun. If you happen to shoot out a barrel, all you need to do is order a new one and install it your self, no need to send it to a gunsmith and potentially wait months for your rifle to come back.

The SRS has allowed me to get rid of a few rifles and I have not missed them either. Now if someone would just come out with a 22-250 barrel for the SRS, it would be my comp gun (.260), long range precision rifle (.338 LM), and varmint rifle (22-250).

 

[TorF]

Re: Multicaliber ''Sniper'' rifles

The best multicaliber is SIG Sauer SSG3000 in 308 or 6,5x55 with a .22lr kit. Unbeatable combination if one intend to improve basic shooting skills with ambition to be a world champion class shooter.

 

[mouse07410]

Re: Multicaliber ''Sniper'' rifles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TorF</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The best multicaliber is SIG Sauer SSG3000 in 308 or 6,5x55 with a .22lr kit. Unbeatable combination if one intend to improve basic shooting skills with ambition to be a world champion class shooter.</div></div>
Funny. It appears (based on SIG Sauer Web site and their LE/Mil catalog) that they have two "sniper rifles": Tactical 2 (shown only in their ME/Mil catalog) and SSG-3000.

<span style="font-style: italic">Tactical 2</span> is 3-caliber interchangeable: 308 Win, 300 WM, 338 Lapua. It is interesting to note, that the optics mount <span style="text-decoration: underline">directly</span> to the barrel (see the catalog above).

<span style="font-style: italic">SSG-3000</span> is available only in 308 Win (again, see the catalog).

There's no mentioning of 22LR conversion kit, except for SIG pistols. It would be nice if you could point us at a respectable source mentioning 22LR kit and caliber conversions for SSG-3000.

 

[TorF]

Re: Multicaliber ''Sniper'' rifles

Norwegian catalog with picture of the .22LR kit:

http://www.dfs.no/Documents/Skytterkonto...beskrivelse.pdf

The only differences between SSG3000 and 200STR are the stock, muzzlebrake and price.. In Norway one SSG3000 = one complete STR in 308/6.5 AND one complete STR in .22lr..

McMillan sells SSG3000 stocks to Norway..

The Blaser is not copetitive against the SSG3000 in sports shooting.

 

[6XC]

Re: Multicaliber ''Sniper'' rifles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mouse07410</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
<span style="font-style: italic">SSG-3000</span> is available only in 308 Win (again, see the catalog).

There's no mentioning of 22LR conversion kit, except for SIG pistols. It would be nice if you could point us at a respectable source mentioning 22LR kit and caliber conversions for SSG-3000. </div></div>

SSG3000 barrels work with the Sauer S202 and so does the 22LR conversion kit:
http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2008/12/sauer-202-with-22lr-conversion-kit/

But the 22LR kit is supposed to be quite expensive in the US:
http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2009/10/new-cdnn-catalog-released-some-great-deals/

Sauer 202 barrels work with the SSG3000 but, as far as I know, they will require a minor modification to be able to fit into the action.

Border Barrels, in the UK, makes drop-in barrels for the SSG3000. Border also makes a barrel extension for the Sauer:
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2771587#Post2771587

 

[mouse07410]

Re: Multicaliber ''Sniper'' rifles

Thanks for the references. They help.

But Sauer S202 is not in the Sauer product list any more, according to SIG Sauer Web site <span style="text-decoration: underline">today</span>.

Blaser (which appears to be referred to as Tactical 2 in the LE/Mil catalog) seems to support multiple calibers, from 223 Rem to 338 Lapua.

Since SSG-3000 is <span style="text-decoration: underline">not</span> a quick-barrel-change system, I don't understand what it means "SSG3000 barrels work with Sauer S202", any more than to say "Bartlein barrels (or Walther barrels, or Sauer barrels) work with S202". I'm sure you can make an S202-compatible mount for any barrel (and the same applies to any quick-change rifle system).

I see no 22LR kit for Blaser in the <span style="text-decoration: underline">current</span> CDNN catalog.

Finally, since SSG-3000 (based on its specs posted on SIG Sauer site) is <span style="text-decoration: underline">not</span> a quick-change system, I don't see how (or why) it would accept a barrel from S202...

Having said that, Blaser certainly is a nice system.

 

[newguy2k3v2]

Re: Multicaliber ''Sniper'' rifles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RMW</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mouse07410</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
260 Rem has been available for SRS since a few months ago. Ask me how I know.

</div></div>

Me too. Being able to just purchase a barrel or conversion kit to shoot a new caliber is much nicer and typical less expensive than having to go out and buy a new gun. If you happen to shoot out a barrel, all you need to do is order a new one and install it your self, no need to send it to a gunsmith and potentially wait months for your rifle to come back.

The SRS has allowed me to get rid of a few rifles and I have not missed them either. Now if someone would just come out with a 22-250 barrel for the SRS, it would be my comp gun (.260), long range precision rifle (.338 LM), and varmint rifle (22-250). </div></div>

APA and a few others will spin up any barrel you want for the DTA.

 

[pdice]

Re: Multicaliber ''Sniper'' rifles

Does anyone have a link to the SRS?

 

[PRDRIVER]

Re: Multicaliber ''Sniper'' rifles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pdice</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Does anyone have a link to the SRS? </div></div>

Desert Tactical Arms

 

[6XC]

Re: Multicaliber ''Sniper'' rifles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mouse07410</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
But Sauer S202 is not in the Sauer product list any more, according to SIG Sauer Web site <span style="text-decoration: underline">today</span>.
</div></div>

S202 is still on Sauer's German website:
http://sauer.de/models-/s-202/s202-overview.html

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mouse07410</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Since SSG-3000 is <span style="text-decoration: underline">not</span> a quick-barrel-change system
</div></div>

It is possible to switch barrels on a SSG 3000 (or 200 STR) with a few simple tools. I have done it myself by following these instructions:

http://mg-42.net/200bar.htm

(BTW I own a Sauer 200 STR.)

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mouse07410</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I see no 22LR kit for Blaser in the current CDNN catalog.
</div></div>

http://www.impactguns.com/sig-ssg3000-22lr-conversion-kit-ssg3000.aspx

Edit: But it's not in stock..

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mouse07410</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Finally, since SSG-3000 (based on its specs posted on SIG Sauer site) is <span style="text-decoration: underline">not</span> a quick-change system, I don't see how (or why) it would accept a barrel from S202...
</div></div>

From Sig Sauer's German website:
http://www.sigsauer.de/englisch/defense/rifles/ssg-3000.html
"The SSG 3000 has groundbreaking features for optimizing precision and functionality: a screw clamp connection for quick barrel exchange"

Sig has shown a folding stock version of the SSG 3000 at SHOT Show. It seems to have externally accessible screws for the switch barrel system:
http://m4carbine.net/showpost.php?s=1d0aded1953993fe70c63723632d8418&p=1216995&postcount=3

Edit:
From a Swedish or Scandinavian perspective a Sauer 200 STR (SSG3000 with a wood stock) is a sound choice. But I am not so sure that I would have bought a SSG 3000 if I had lived in the USA. You can find cheap used 200STR/SSG3000 rifles in Sweden. (I paid about $1200 for my STR and I got a lot of accessories with the gun.) New spare parts are quite inexpensive here. But the best reason for buying a 200 STR, in Sweden, is Norma's 6.5x55 Diamondline matchammunition. Excellent accuracy, flat shooting and quite inexpensive.

 

[freezingduck]

Re: Multicaliber ''Sniper'' rifles

Actually I already have a SSG 3000/200 STR in 6,5x55 and 22lr
Its a great rifle

Will the standard rifles like the TRG 22/42 and the AX line dissapear now when its going to be all about multicalibers?

 

[Northman]

Re: Multicaliber ''Sniper'' rifles

Mouse: on the link you posted it says it has a conversion kit, in small writing under Features.

It takes, 4-5 min, then you have changed caliber.