Range Report Need help understanding and reading conditions

[2Shots]

Can anybody help me or lead me to an article on this site that can help me learn about understanding temp, pressure, barometric conditions that all effect bullet flight at the current place and conditions I am shooting. I have been trying to sharpen and practice 1000 yard shots in different conditions. I use bullet flight software that gets local weather conditions, I know not at the exact spot but close. I shot last week in summer conditions, wind was 8 to 10 mph. Had a wind hold of 1 to 1.4 mil, data for drop was close so lots of hits. Shot last night, basically no wind, heavy hot air and data didn't work, had only a few hits. This shouldn't be that hard. To give you what I'm using. I know how to precision load, not new to shooting but new to long range. Any help out there? I will be shooting a match later this month out of town that will have long shots, really want to understand more.

Match rifle and barrel.
260 running 142smk at 2700fps
NF F1 mlr2
USO rail level

 

[Lindy]

Re: Need help understanding and reading conditions

If you really want precision at longer ranges, allowing the app to get the local conditions may not be optimum. You might want to get a Kestrel or similar instrument. Temperature and barometric pressure are key - humidity is a minor factor.

You also may want to make sure your application is properly set up for the conditions you either get or input yourself. This might be useful reading:

Barometric Pressure and Ballistic Software

 

[2Shots]

Re: Need help understanding and reading conditions

Thanks lindy, I'll read it. I did talk to kestrel at the shot show. They make a blue tooth version now, but it doesn't talk to my iphone, figures.

 

[Lindy]

Re: Need help understanding and reading conditions

A person, in a post just now deleted said,

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">it is hard</div></div>

And here are some reasons why, especially at longer distances: Sources of Ballistic Program Inaccuracies

A female of my acquaintance said, "If it's not hard, what good is it?"

 

[melody]

Re: Need help understanding and reading conditions

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lindy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A person, in a post just now deleted said,

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">it is hard</div></div>

A female of my acquaintance said, "If it's not hard, what good is it?" </div></div>

Sorry Lindy, I deleted my post ten minutes into realizing I was probably too snarky. Forgive me, I HAVE NOT slept well these last 6 months.

In keeping with your friends comment... I too love things that are hard. The challenge is always welcome because I know when I overcome it, I'm going to be very satisfied.

 

[azimutha]

Re: Need help understanding and reading conditions

I would never rely on the app pulling in local conditions because those are going to be for the nearest weather station, which might be miles away and differ in both altitude and weather. I'm a little puzzled why your results were so different. It doesn't seem like the conditions were all that far apart. "Summer conditions" and "hot, heavy air" are not like zeroing in winter then shooting four months later. And, even then, I can go from 30F, 24.00 standard pressure and 0% humidity to 90F, 24.90, 100% humidity and see only a .1-.2 mil change in drop @ 500 yards. That's less than 4".

Are you zeroing @ 100 yards/meters? One nice thing about that is that it won't really matter what the conditions are on the range at the time. Then just make sure you really have the correct inputs for your app. Could be the BC is bogus. The biggest problem is not knowing the difference between standard and corrected pressure and how pressure interacts with altitude in a ballistics app. If you are using standard pressure, always leave altitude set to zero. (That is the uncorrected pressure).

 

[notquiteright]

Re: Need help understanding and reading conditions

Melody is onto something.

You can have all the proper tools but lack of experience can work against a proper outcome. Might I suggest some training with someone experienced at 1000 yard shooting?

Did you learn to drive in rush hour traffic by yourself?

You dont mention the shooting set-up. I like instant feedback like steel targets or a hoist and paste system where a spotter disc is placed in the impact hole. It can be VERY frustrating to attempt LR without a shot to shot understanding of your impacts. Having an experienced shooter to help spot for you is a great help learning LR. A LR coach is one of the best tools a beginner could use.

As an aside I used the 260 briefly and my wife for a few years. I want to say we pushed the pill out at 2800+.

Good Luck

 

[2Shots]

Re: Need help understanding and reading conditions

I went from my regular rifle range where I checked my zero, verified my fps and then drove about 1 mile to the long range spot. Thought I would have perfect absolute data for the given conditions. But no, kinda ticked me off. I shoot all the time, probably two or three times a week practice. I am a stickler about my loads and my variables, I can usually figure out whats going on, just not smart enough on the longer stuff. Always more to learn! We did decide we were flying higher than our dope. There were three of us and we all had the same problem.

 

[2Shots]

Re: Need help understanding and reading conditions

You are right, this is nothing more than a steel target in a dead flat field, we have no feedback at all. I have pushed the 142's to 2900 or so, just don't see a real need to push that hard on a daily basis, of course when you just shoot 500 it isn;t necessary.Maybe I will bump it up! I do also have a 7wsm built that does make it easier, but more powder, expensive brass etc. Hopefully I will learn more at this range i'm going too. Thanks

 

[Lindy]

Re: Need help understanding and reading conditions

Melody -

No problem - that's why I didn't identify the person who posted the comment. Here's hoping you sleep better soon - life with sleep deprivation is not a lot of fun. BTDT.

 

[2Shots]

Re: Need help understanding and reading conditions

I have read your article Lindy about Inaccuracies, your knowledge makes my head hurt. I haven't tracked this new NF, I have my old but not this one for vertical track and scope click accuracy. I have and have read Bryan Litz's book and am using G7BC. We laser checked our distance to target. I will check my scope next trip to the range. And I know, more practice! Thanks guys for the help.

 

[melody]

Re: Need help understanding and reading conditions

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 2shots</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I will check my scope next trip to the range. </div></div>

haven't read the article Lindy referred to you...

but in my experience during a private lesson using the LTR I purchased from the sniper school's operator... my training instructor mounted my scope base and rings...and we took FOREVER to zero the rifle...

I was accused of trying to get it "perfect" by an instructor who'd trained me before and was gonna stop by during the lesson...

it was a good thing he did stop by... turns out my scope WAS NOT LEVEL!!!

But that was ONLY discovered by a second instructor. He was intuitive and had long developed that skill so his instincts were amazing on getting students the proper fit for their weapons... there was trial and error involved...but his years of experience training shooters made it take only a few adjustments from his first estimate of "where" it would be comfortable for my eye relief based on my comfort fit for the cheek-to-stock weld.

just a thought...
have no idea what was or wasn't going well for ya...

 

[mark5pt56]

Re: Need help understanding and reading conditions

I know it may time consuming, but lacking a spotter or someone marking from the pit-use a large paper target with a good aiming point, shoot three, calling your shots and go to the target at each range to mark and record them with an analysis of the called shots, etc. With a good scope and shoot n see's you might get to 600 to save a trip, that way you can see each shot.

With the wind, record the hold for each shot so you can see the result, real important for the shifting wind and calls. I've found that if you run JBM with 5-6 different DA's, you won't see a big difference until past 600 or so in regards to elevation changes.

Hope that helps some.

Mark