New Lapua brass - need to do anything before firing?

[TeaRex]

Hey,

I have a 6.5x55 build on the way and just got my reloading components and dies today (forster bump die and micrometer seater). I am going to be using new, unfired Lapua brass. I have heard some people say that I need to use an expander mandrel (which I don't have) on the necks first before firing. Is this really necessary?

I'm sure that plenty of people will say that it can't hurt, and it might remove some fraction of an inch from the groups or runout or whatever, so why not do it? But I've been racking up a good bill recently between the new rifle build and the new dies / components and would prefer not to buy an extra tool if I don't need it.

I was hoping to just check and see of the brass fits the chamber, and if does, then just load and fire without any other prep. Bump shoulder back when necessary.

Thanks in advance.

 

[woodman0663]

With new unfired brass I always run at least part way into my sizer die so that the expander ball in the die irons out any irregularities in the neck of the brass. You should be able to feel when the expander ball has entered the neck and then passes thru the neck on the up stroke of the ram. Once I am at this point I just lower the ram and the neck is round and ready to load. You could, after doing this, run a few pieces of the unloaded brass into the chamber to verify that it chambers. Since it is new brass, it should chamber with no problems,

 

[bh-ltr]

Depends. How much brass did you buy and are you willing to "plink" for that long.

I recently went to a shooting class with 300 rounds of new just loaded up Lapua brass. I shot ok. Then I went to the alumni version of the class with the same brass reloaded. The whole thing shot WAY more consistent on the next go around. Now I have 600 rounds of Lapua in my standard cycle and I just picked up another 300 rounds. I've recently placed an order for the expander mandrel and die. I've not gotten mine yet but here is what you're going to need:
Sinclair Generation II Expander Dies | Sinclair Intl
and
Sinclair Expander Mandrel - oversized | Sinclair Intl

And here is a quick article writeup that I read through before making my decision to get these components:
Expander Mandrels and Neck Tension within AccurateShooter.com

I'll also say that an employee of Lapua said on this very forum that they recommend it. I still yet was like meh its not that bad and its all pretty consistent I'll just load it up and collect new zero and velocity data on the brass as it sits. Turns out when you're talking hundreds of rounds it becomes kinda onerous to shoot those up while shooting poorly and blaming the ammo and not being able to use that as good training time.

~Brett

 

[oldfatguy]

Pretty much dealer's choice on new Lapua brass. Some simply load & shoot, some do the full prep routine; primer pocket uniforming, full length sizing, length trim, neck turning, weight sorting. The flash holes are drilled so they don't have a burr to remove.

Depends on how much time you want to spend seeking perfection and how bad your OCD is.



OFG

 

[bh-ltr]

Well there is no reason to full length size it won't do anything. Pretty much the same is true with primer pocket uniforming but it may do a little on some. I usually do a length trim and chamfer/deburr on the neck (which just means running the new brass through my giraud trimmer and only takes a couple minutes). And weight sorting is something I don't do yet but thats because I find it a little over the top for tactical accuracy.

~Brett

 

[scudzuki]

Neck size it.
I have 200 each new Lapua cases in .223, .260, and .308.
I have not had any headspace issues but after the first 20 .260 cases I loaded with inconsistent neck tension, I neck sized all of the unfired brass.

Joe

 

[Twoboxer]

I have 100 Lapua 223 and examined 10 at random. Identical and proper length to the shoulder, and 1.750 +/- .05 OAL. Bullet seating looked identical to my own resized cases, so I decided all they would need was chanfering before fire-forming them in my bolt action.

During reloading, I found one shell did have it's neck pinched in, presumably in transit. So I resized the neck.

I didn't see the benefit of doing anything else.

 

[Joop]

I am currently loading in new 6.5x55 Lapua brass, as well. This is the first time I've done it for this caliber, but have used Lapua brass in other calibers in the past. The starting loads I'm putting together seem to seat a little on the tighter side, which isn't unusual, but nothing drastic. Since I'll be fire-forming these cases and using them to zero a new rifle anyway, I'm not too concerned. I've never used an mandrel on any new brass, spare those with deformed mouths, and never had any issues. YMMV.

 

[Pinecone]

I have just started loading some new Lapua .308 brass. The necks are very tight, IIRC around .302"

I ran them over an expander to get them a bit less tight.

 

[lightman]

I always prep new brass. Even Norma and Lapua. I full length resize, just to get the case mouth straight. Then I trim, deburr, uniform the primer pocket, and deburr the flash hole. And yes, even the best cases sometimes have a burr. Thats just me, I can't show any proof that this extra work will show up with better scores, or group sizes. The primer pocket work only takes seconds, and is a one time deal. I trim because I want my cases to start out the same length. Lightman

 

[TeaRex]

Thanks to everyone for their responss, and happy 4th!

It looks like the consensus was to size the necks, just to make sure the tension is consistent and not too high. Ive got 200 pieces, so that would be a little bit too much plinking for nothing.

So, what is the difference between the expander/neck sizing portion of my forster dies(or really any dies) and the expander mandrel mentioned above?

Thanks.

 

[nesikabay]

Hey,

I have a 6.5x55 build on the way and just got my reloading components and dies today (forster bump die and micrometer seater). I am going to be using new, unfired Lapua brass. I have heard some people say that I need to use an expander mandrel (which I don't have) on the necks first before firing. Is this really necessary?

I'm sure that plenty of people will say that it can't hurt, and it might remove some fraction of an inch from the groups or runout or whatever, so why not do it? But I've been racking up a good bill recently between the new rifle build and the new dies / components and would prefer not to buy an extra tool if I don't need it.

I was hoping to just check and see of the brass fits the chamber, and if does, then just load and fire without any other prep. Bump shoulder back when necessary.

Thanks in advance.

A primer,bullet and powder will help

 

[bh-ltr]

Thanks to everyone for their responss, and happy 4th!

It looks like the consensus was to size the necks, just to make sure the tension is consistent and not too high. Ive got 200 pieces, so that would be a little bit too much plinking for nothing.

So, what is the difference between the expander/neck sizing portion of my forster dies(or really any dies) and the expander mandrel mentioned above?

Thanks.

If you have an expander in your sizing die then you can use that to get similar results as the expansion mandrels. You'll probably have slightly higher runout but it doesn't sound like that will be all that important to you.

~Brett

 

[bh-ltr]

Just got my mandrel die setup in the mail today. After measuring a few rounds neck ID I'm getting an average .30367". After running them through the mandrel die they are .306".

For reference fired brass from my rifle comes back at .315" and after running them through my redding collet neck sizing die they come back as .3055".

Thus when I previously just loaded new Lapua brass I had just over .004" of neck tension. My reloads after that have .0025" of neck tension. I'll also add that the standard deviations on the reloaded brass is a lot smaller than that of the Lapua brass out of the box. I don't have numbers to back that up but in doing the measurements and punching them into a calculator just to get an average if I had also calculated std deviations the sized brass was a lot more consistent than the virgin brass.

I think that this is going to solve my issue of virgin loaded lapua brass not shooting as well until the second firing. The procedure that I'm going to do for virgin brass is to mandrel expand, then run it in the tumbler to take the lube off, then trim and chamfer on the giraud, then load. I won't know for sure that this is going to be better till my next time shooting long range but I've got high confidence that this batch of 300 virgin cases are going to be much more pleasurable to shoot for the first go around than my other 600 in current circulation were.

~Brett

 

[Layton]

Thanks to this thread I now have a mandrel die setup on the way for 300 pieces of new Lapua brass. I'm waiting on a 6.5x55 as well and 300 is just too much for plinking. Thanks for feeding my ocd guys.

L

 

[bluto77]

It sounds like as long as a guy is willing to accept results that will be inconsistent with his fire formed brass, there are no other problems just loading up virgin brass with no case prep and plinking away to get fire formed brass. I was planning on only trimming the virgin lapua brass, loading, and shooting. I have some bullets that I know I won't be using on a regular basis, along with primers and powder that I bought just because they were available, but now that i have my varget, h4350, fed and cci primers, and bullets I know the rifles like, I was going to use the first round of loading as "practice" since it will be my first time anyway. I figured there would be more run-out than usual my first time around, so why worry about it. I get to practice loading and get my brass fire formed at the same time.

Is there anything wrong with that logic?

 

[Layton]

I just went the mandrel route on 300 pieces of Lapua brass and have finished the first firing. I'll start on my second this weekend so I'll have results to compare against. I also have another 200 pieces of unfired so this will tell me if it's even worth messing with anymore.

L

 

[dieselgeek]

I always prep new brass. Even Norma and Lapua. I full length resize, just to get the case mouth straight. Then I trim, deburr, uniform the primer pocket, and deburr the flash hole. And yes, even the best cases sometimes have a burr. Thats just me, I can't show any proof that this extra work will show up with better scores, or group sizes. The primer pocket work only takes seconds, and is a one time deal. I trim because I want my cases to start out the same length. Lightman

Isn't Norma like Nosler? Nosler is visibly good to go. I don't waste my time with doing anything other than loading it.

 

[smschulz]

Depends. How much brass did you buy and are you willing to "plink" for that long.

I recently went to a shooting class with 300 rounds of new just loaded up Lapua brass. I shot ok. Then I went to the alumni version of the class with the same brass reloaded. The whole thing shot WAY more consistent on the next go around. Now I have 600 rounds of Lapua in my standard cycle and I just picked up another 300 rounds. I've recently placed an order for the expander mandrel and die. I've not gotten mine yet but here is what you're going to need:
Sinclair Generation II Expander Dies | Sinclair Intl
and
Sinclair Expander Mandrel - oversized | Sinclair Intl

And here is a quick article writeup that I read through before making my decision to get these components:
Expander Mandrels and Neck Tension within AccurateShooter.com

I'll also say that an employee of Lapua said on this very forum that they recommend it. I still yet was like meh its not that bad and its all pretty consistent I'll just load it up and collect new zero and velocity data on the brass as it sits. Turns out when you're talking hundreds of rounds it becomes kinda onerous to shoot those up while shooting poorly and blaming the ammo and not being able to use that as good training time.

~Brett

^^^^ This is what I use too on new brass. ^^^^

 

[Pinecone]

For reference, I loaded up several hundred rounds of new Lapua brass (chamfered the mouth is all), with Graf's "seconds" 175 gr (probably SMK) bullets over 43.5 grs of Varget.

Went to Dan Newberry's Bang Steel class and made first round hits out to 1040 yards. 1200 yards took a few rounds to hit with very shifty winds (180 degree change in direction at mid range versus firing point and target).

Works for me.