New shooter's here please read.

[popeye089]

I recently read a few replies here with people asking about cost and how their less expensive rifles can perform well. Nobody here is questioning anyone. This is not an attack but please read my small reply.


Buying a MOA or "sub MOA" rifle these days isn't difficult. With new metallurgy and more consistent machining and manufacturing processes, good "out of the box" rifles are the norm more than the exception as in the years of past. When you get to the extreme of 1/2 to sub half MOA yes you are going to pay extra for that last 1/8-1/4 MOA. The reason why is because to achieve those results consistently require a true Master gunsmith like those at Gradous, Surgeon, APA, GAP, Tac OPS, etc... You are paying for that experience and attention to detail that requires that near perfection that cannot be achieved through mass production as in Remington or Savage. Yes these two make wonderful affordable everyday man rifles. But when you want to push a rifle and it's ammo to they're max effective ranges and your max abilities, or if you use your rifle in your proffesion, then that extra money can be difference between a trophy or even more precious your life.
Watch this please
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So now you have to decide what you plan on buying and why. If you are happy to have an out of box great rifle nothing is wrong with that. I have owned many. what do you plan on doing with it and also what do you expect out of it. Also on that note, some guys just like to collect wonderful rifles here and stare at them. Nothing wrong with that. It keeps a lot of gunsmiths open and accessible. Some people collect race cars, doesn't mean they can drive them like Andretti. But because of these collectors, the rest of us reap their rewards by being able to enjoy them and the innovation that fuels this sport and profession. and remember we all were beginners once upon a time, share info, don't be a gate guard

 

[popeye089]

Re: New shooter's here please read.

Now, Like I said I'm not attacking new shooter's, their gear, or claims. I just want them to understand where that extra money is going and why it costs as much as it does.

I hope everyone here understands I'm not knocking the Savage or Remington companies. If you want to spend the money on a base rifle and on reloading equipment first. If you are still deciding if shooting is for you, especially if you don't do it for a living, that's a perfectly fine way to start. That's a fine and smart way to begin. I've spent time shooting KACs, AIs,and bone stock + factory custom Remingtons. I have owned a few GAPs and now recently got lucky enough to purchase a Patriot that should be here soon (damn mail men). I've enjoyed shooting them all but the refinement and consistency in precision is all I'm stating. Remember when you pay, you're paying for guaranteed <span style="text-decoration: underline">Precision</span> not accuracy. Big difference between the two. Either way, just go freaking shoot. I know I'll be at the ranges the next few days from 7-17

But i say again.........GO SHOOT!!!!!!!

 

[Ren]

Re: New shooter's here please read.

OMG!!!!! I saw the needle move!.....



oh.. j/k...nevermind..its when he moved the guage.

Hell...Im just addicted to having nice shit, and being the mere mortal that I am, I figure im lucky to hang on to MOA at distance... 500+.

I shoot with guys that have Savages,Remingtons,Customs, we all do well pretty decent because we all shoot at distance pretty regularly, thats whats the most important...practice.

 

[leadbullet]

Re: New shooter's here please read.

couldn't agree with you more popeye, some of my shooting budies think i am crazy for dumping so much money in a custom rifle while their box stock remy or savage shoot as good as mine at 100 yds, i take them to my hidden 1000 yds range and they can't believe how poorly their rifle shoots compared to mine, needless to say that they are believers now.
I never regret money well spent, when 100 bucks for a POS is too expensive for me.
cheers.

 

[TB2Blazer]

Re: New shooter's here please read.

Wow, thats an awesome video and its good to see things like that so people like me (new to precision long range shooting) can see how these people really put a lot of pride and hard work into their products. Just goes to show that their are different products for different levels of shooters not just different prices. A gun is only as good as the shooter behind it.

 

[SMS Burly]

Re: New shooter's here please read.

Thanks popeye for the video and the description. Its amazing what good gunsmiths can do these days! one day i hope to own such a work of art!

 

[dbsinh2o]

Re: New shooter's here please read.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: attherange</div><div class="ubbcode-body">couldn't agree with you more popeye, some of my shooting budies think i am crazy for dumping so much money in a custom rifle while their box stock remy or savage shoot as good as mine at 100 yds, i take them to my hidden 1000 yds range and they can't believe how poorly their rifle shoots compared to mine, needless to say that they are believers now.
I never regret money well spent, when 100 bucks for a POS is too expensive for me.
cheers. </div></div>

Let's say you have a 1000 yard tunnel, where wind is not a factor. And let's say you have targets set up at 100 yards, 200 yards, and every 200 yards thereafter at the appropriate height to compensate for bullet drop. And let's say these targets are made from a material that would allow projectiles to pass through without affecting their trajectory.

What's the unknown factor that would cause a projectile from the less expensive firearm to print worse on successive targets as it progressed down range past 100 yards (assuming both were printing the same at this point)?

 

[dwtaylorpdx]

Re: New shooter's here please read.

Ok hip shot....
1. Repeatability in the chambering of the round.
2. Chamber tolerace (Assuming perfect ammo

3. Barrel quality, added to the above.

I think it would translate to the chart you would draw for std deviation. Assuming a top of the line gun you'd expect that if you fired enough shots (say 100) you'd develop a hole that would stop growing at some measurement, while the looser less expensive action would grow the hole slightly larger.

Well there's my completely non expert swag at how I'd assume it would work.

I know I've owned guns that would for no explainable reason toss a flyer out of the group. Usually fixed by re-barreling.

Dave

 

[dddoo7]

Re: New shooter's here please read.

Wow-- that is impressive. Do you know which builder made that video?

 

[SugarBooger]

Re: New shooter's here please read.

he says who he is and what company he's with in the first 5 seconds of the video.

at the end of the video there are titles as well.