Surfing Snipershide for sometime now soaking up info like a sponge. I just purchased my first Nightforce optic which has prompted me to register and post my first thread. My Atacr is fresh off the UPS truck just a few hours ago. I noticed right away the index lines on the magnification ring do not match the index line on the scope tube when set on the extreme ends of the adjustment range. It is off by approx 1/16" maybe a bit more. I have already spoken to Mark at Nightforce and he has stated this is a normal occurence for many Nightforce scopes. The reason being tolerance stacking and that the magnification ring is calibrated to the subtensions of the reticle after the index lines have been etched onto the ring. True 5x and 25x is at the stopping points on either end of the rotation range despite not lining up. He pointed out the fact the dot indicating 12.5 power can possibly cause issues when ranging with the reticle because of this. I could test on a paper target to find true 12.5x. I would like to know if any Nightforce owners have also noticed this on their Atacr or other Nightforce optics. Mark suggested I send the scope back to Nightforce, but parts would have to be swapped to get the lines to match and there is a good chance the same problem would occur with the swapped parts. I have got to say im a little bit disapointed and this does bother me. I sure would not be happy to send back a brand new expensive scope to be cracked open when I havent even even shot with it. I could send it back to Midway but Ive already been through optic hell with Opticsplanet.com for the last month with two other scopes (story for another day).
Rifle Scopes Nightforce Atacr question
- Thread starter PullMyTrigger
- Start date
Congrats on your new toy.
I've had a look through an ATACR and the glass is very very good.
If I were in your shoes I'd calibrate it myself, like you said.
Mark the mag ring with paint or nail polish, something that's tough but removable with the right chemicals.
I've had a look through an ATACR and the glass is very very good.
If I were in your shoes I'd calibrate it myself, like you said.
Mark the mag ring with paint or nail polish, something that's tough but removable with the right chemicals.
It wouldn't bother me. If you could see yourself using 12.5 then throw a ruler up. I do recommend making sure your turrets and reticle match up though.
Good luck
Good luck
Nightforce indexed the magnification ring. That's why its off a smidge. Call Nightforce @ 208.476.9814 they might be able to explain it better than I can.
Welcome to the hide. Next time you need something, get with one of the vendors. They/We will get you straight.
Welcome to the hide. Next time you need something, get with one of the vendors. They/We will get you straight.
Thanks for the warm welcome Chris. I did in fact call Nightforce before posting. Sounds like you may be familar with what I describe? Basically explained to me that there is a titanium ring inside the rotating ocular/mag ring. When assembled there is some tolerance stacking which can sometimes lead to the lines being off when the ring is calibrated to the reticle subtensions. Was made to sound like it was a compromise for a more rugged scope design. I could not find an atacr locally to lay hands on before ordering. I have looked at several NXS models and have not seen any where the lines do not match up. I do use a laser rangefinder, but I also range with the reticle manually to maintain competency without a laser. I will most likely never range at 12.5x. If I did I would prefer the index lines to be calibrated where they should be without having to do testing to mark my own lines on the ring. Im thinking about returning the Nightforce and picking up a Kahles 624i or being patient and waiting for the Vortex Gen 2 Razors to be released.
It would still be appreciated if any Nightforce owners can verify that they have similar observations of misaligned index lines. Thanks.
It would still be appreciated if any Nightforce owners can verify that they have similar observations of misaligned index lines. Thanks.
No that it matters but it just occured to me that Mark mentioned something about the screw in the mag ring having something to do with it. Maybe I shouldnt have called while dealing with work distractions in parralel.
Mine is the exact same ill get out tomorrow with the ruler and see what it has to say. If its been calibrated by NF though I assume it should be good to go and its off by a hair on 25x on the short end and goes past 5x by the smallest of margins. This scope is brand spakin new unboxed it yesterday other than the lines being a touch and I mean a touch off I cant complain and if it is perfect when measured it shouldn't be an issue.
One of the issues that is common on Second Focal Plane scopes is that the calibration mark is rarely true...........except on a Nightforce. Every Nightforce that wears an inspection label on the top of the objective bell has gone through a lengthy and rigorous QC test. IF it fails any point, it is corrected. You can take a NF to the bank that it will be true.
One of the QC tests is to ensure that the calibrated power is true by using a sophisticated collimator (think something like a Tasco boresighter but on a much larger more precise scale). This does not matter on a first focal plane scope. We are able to properly calibrate the power zoom ring on second focal plane models and as a result, sometimes the lines do not match up 100%. Our allowance is line thickness. If it is off by more than the line thickness, then it is corrected to match.
Competitor brands are rarely calibrated and therefore the lines usually match up, but also require the end user to verify the reticles true magnification which often results in a severe mismatch.
I have two ATACR's that do not match up perfectly, but they are close enough as to not bother me in the least, but to each their own. What concerns me is that when I roll the mag over til it stops, is that it is true. When someone shells out $2400 for a riflescope they often expect zero defects and rightfully so. But sometimes explaining the reality of a situation can help alleviate concerns. I am positive that we would do everything within reason to make it right if it is an issue for you. Our Customer Service Team is world class!
One of the QC tests is to ensure that the calibrated power is true by using a sophisticated collimator (think something like a Tasco boresighter but on a much larger more precise scale). This does not matter on a first focal plane scope. We are able to properly calibrate the power zoom ring on second focal plane models and as a result, sometimes the lines do not match up 100%. Our allowance is line thickness. If it is off by more than the line thickness, then it is corrected to match.
Competitor brands are rarely calibrated and therefore the lines usually match up, but also require the end user to verify the reticles true magnification which often results in a severe mismatch.
I have two ATACR's that do not match up perfectly, but they are close enough as to not bother me in the least, but to each their own. What concerns me is that when I roll the mag over til it stops, is that it is true. When someone shells out $2400 for a riflescope they often expect zero defects and rightfully so. But sometimes explaining the reality of a situation can help alleviate concerns. I am positive that we would do everything within reason to make it right if it is an issue for you. Our Customer Service Team is world class!
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Thanks for chiming in. I knew you could explain it better.
00bullit thank you for taking the time to repsond to my post. You have without a doubt helped to alleviate my concerns and put my mind at ease. I believe the lines are off a bit more than line thickness. I will double check the minute I get home from work today. I havent really had time to review forum rules yet to see if it is allowable to post pics up for a new member like myself. If I can I will get some pics asap. Thank you!
You mentioned a couple of the larger vendors, you got a little taste of "its just a job" or "herp, derp, I don't give a shit" service.
Deal with guys like Chris, or any of the Hides vendors exclusively. Very knowledgeable regarding their products, they have (usually) the hard to get/speciality scopes, etc.
Shit bags don't last long around here.
Relax about the NF, it's fine. Shoot your rifle/scope ammo combo to see what your individual rifle will actually produce.
If there is a problem, NF is GTG.
Deal with guys like Chris, or any of the Hides vendors exclusively. Very knowledgeable regarding their products, they have (usually) the hard to get/speciality scopes, etc.
Shit bags don't last long around here.
Relax about the NF, it's fine. Shoot your rifle/scope ammo combo to see what your individual rifle will actually produce.
If there is a problem, NF is GTG.
I mentioned Opticsplanet.com sucks. The month long ordeal finally ended today actually. I bought a Bushnell XRS for $1829 plus a 10% off coupon. They sent me a damaged scope the first time around and a open box XRS complete with finger smudges, hard water stains on the tube(wtf?), and turret scratches from the zero stop being messed with. I should know better, price is to good to be true then it probably is. They took their sweet ass time refunding my money. Lesson learned. As far as Midway...ordered thousands of dollars of merchandise from them and always great customer service. Thats why I ordered my atacr from them because I felt trust was already established. I will be sure to try a hide' vendor next go around. I will be building a hunting rifle in the very near future before the 2014 deer season begins.
I know what my rifle will do. It already has 800+ rounds down the tube. Atacr is replacing a 6-24 Vortex Viper PST FFP. I will be clamping the atacr down tonight inside of its new Badger 20 moa unimount and hopefully getting it zeroed this weekend.
Thanks to all that replied. You were of much help.
00, are you saying (for instance) on my 3.5-15 the calibration is proper when the magnification is turned up to the stop, or when the 15 hashmark is lined up with the witness mark on the tube? Mine is off about a half line width with the ring against the stop.
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It is true when you roll it to the stop.
I just ordered an ATACR yesterday and will check out this issue when it arrives. This scope will be replacing the NXS 3.5-15 F1 currently on my long range rifle. I never considered the importance of the magnification marks before because the NXS is FFP and, as such, ranging is accurate regardless of power setting. You've raised a valid concern as I can foresee the situation where it would advantageous to range at 1/2 power and with a 25x SFP scope the 12.5 mark would be critical. The explanation of stacking and final calibration makes sense as to why the factory marks might be off. If I find this to be the case, I'll used a tiny scribe scratch and paint over with white fingernail polish to mark the actual 12.5 spot. I've used this technic to indicate commonly used parallax settings on the side turret of my NXS and it works well. Will follow up when my new ATACR is delivered and I have time to test it. Thanks for pointing this out.
The NXS line is not FFP, maybe you're thinking F1.
Yes, the ATACR will be replacing the NXS 3.5-15x F1 currently on my long range rifle. The trusted old F1 will look funny on the MSR in 6.8 SPC that I just built for hunting but that's where it's going until I can afford a new NXS Compact 2.5-10x42. The new ATACR should deliver today. I'll let you know what I find out regarding the mag marks.
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