No Idea which way to go or what to do...

[Djstorm100]

Hey guys, figure I let the people with more experince help me out and not ones behind a counter trying to push a sale.
I have a bolt Rem 270 with a bushnell scope that I've had for 7 years that I do shoot alot

Debating to get a Ar-10 or Rem 700 .308. Want something I can shoot up to 800 yards. 1k max.

For Ar I know I want a flat top. Some have said to go with a bull barrel other have said go with a heavy barrel. Then come what twist to get. Ive been told if I stay with the .223 get the 1/7 to 1/8 but stay away from 1/9. If this for a certain length of barrel or for all barrels? then comes what brands. DPMS foregrip seemed cheaply made..atleast on their lesser expensive rifles.

I know only a .308 will get me to the distance I want unless I go up to a .300winmag or .338 (expensive!)

cliff nots
Ar-10 platform.
want: flat top, float fore grip, bipod
Don't knows: twist rate, length barrel (24,26) brands to go without hurting my pockets that bad


Rem 700 .308
Would like to get a 700p but seems like 700 SPS Varimant has the same barrel and action as the 700p just a crap stock (hints lower cost) Stock would be changed of course.

 

[MinorDamage]

Re: No Idea which way to go or what to do...

Are you new to shooting. If so, get the bolt gun. Use 10 bucks to get into the training forum and practice what the videos teach you.

Semis are hard on brass, but nothing a full length resizer can't handle.

DPMS is cheaply made? Many of the AR-15 manufacturers just stamp their name on mass manufactured lowers and uppers. So, DPMS may be the same as another big name brand. I built an AR on a DPMS lower and have had zero issues. Mine shoots just fine...actual rounds, not foam darts (WTF?).

Just my .02

Josh

 

[Djstorm100]

Re: No Idea which way to go or what to do...

It was mainly the foregrip that felt cheap.

No I'm not new to shooting. But as to what is out there and what combos worth well together...that I'm new to.

Thanks
D

 

[03bulletstopper]

Re: No Idea which way to go or what to do...

I gotta tell you that is the first time I have ever heard DPMS compared to a Nerf gun.
Buy a bolt gun and some decent glass. Then get some good instruction and as much trigger time as you can. Now you could go straight to trigger time.But odds are you would develop some bad habits that would be harder to break than if you started of with proper instruction.

 

[Djstorm100]

Re: No Idea which way to go or what to do...

I didnt mean to offend anyone, just going off what some locals have said. I know the foregrip can be easily changed.

 

[gugubica]

Re: No Idea which way to go or what to do...

D, you should run away from DPMS. I would DEFINITELY get one of the Remington 308 ARs instead, those things kick ass!













Seriously, the above is a crack at your DPMS comment.

First off, DPMS make a great weapon.

Second, if you don't understand the differences between a gas gun and a bolt gun, you need to accuire a bolt gun first. Learn to shoot it well at the distances you stated and then consider a gasser. This is not to bash you, everyone had to start somewhere. It is fairly evident from your post though that you would be better off starting with a bolt rifle.

Third, a bull barrel is a heavy barrel.

And, why are you asking about twist rates of .223s whan you are asking advice on a .308?

 

[Djstorm100]

Re: No Idea which way to go or what to do...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: gugubica</div><div class="ubbcode-body">D, you should run away from DPMS. I would DEFINITELY get one of the Remington 308 ARs instead, those things kick ass!













Seriously, the above is a crack at your DPMS comment.

First off, DPMS make a great weapon.

Second, if you don't understand the differences between a gas gun and a bolt gun, you need to accuire a bolt gun first. Learn to shoot it well at the distances you stated and then consider a gasser. This is not to bash you, everyone had to start somewhere. It is fairly evident from your post though that you would be better off starting with a bolt rifle.

Third, a bull barrel is a heavy barrel.

And, why are you asking about twist rates of .223s whan you are asking advice on a .308? </div></div>

maybe I'm looking in the wrong area or sites but it seems like DPMS cheaper from bushmaster, colt, armalite, ect?

I know how the gas guns work, by using some of the gasses that generated when the round it fired and is redirected to the bolt to push it back to eject the brass and chamber another round. I made my post sound like I don't know anything to get as much info as I can.

When I went to the local gun shop the salesman kept saying bull barrel (point to one rifle) then bull barrel and point to another rifle. He said that heavy has a taper from one chamber side to the muzzle vs bull having the same diameter through the whole rifle.

I was asking on twist rate on .223 vs .308 and how they different from one another or if they could be comparable. because on another forum this is was posted.
" If you overspin a bullet at best it hurts accuracy by exploiting the imbalances in an imperfect bullet. At worst it can cause a bullet to come apart.

A heavier bullet is longer. A longer bullet has a better ballistic coefficient. a better BC will give better long-range performance

The 1:9" twist isn't really sufficient to stabilize the longer projos, and the generally accepted "heaviest" pill you should run is 69gr in a 1:9" twist. 1:8" is good to 77gr, and 1:7" is good to 90gr. However, running a varmint bullet (40-52 gr) through a 1:7" causes overspin issues.

There are quirks in everything though, and there are guys running 77gr stuff through 1:9" with ok results."

 

[Sig685]

Re: No Idea which way to go or what to do...

The salesman definition of a bull barrel is correct.

What do you intend to do with the rifle apart from shooting at 800 yards, maybe 1k? Is this for competition or plinking?

 

[Djstorm100]

Re: No Idea which way to go or what to do...

Pinking. I would like to be able to hunt with it at 0-300yds (not even sure if I would ever go that far honestly). Competition? hmm if I get good enought... local events sure. Keep me busy and out of trouble

 

[Sig685]

Re: No Idea which way to go or what to do...

The AR-10 from ArmaLite or any of the lookalikes from other companies will cost a fair amount of money and as stated above it makes reloading ore difficult. In fact the AR-10 pretty much mangles the brass.

If this is not a concern to you, then you should certainly look for one of those as they are a lot of fun. The barrel length and contour will be dictated by what is available from the manufacturers. Armalite seems to favor 20 inch 11.25 twist barrels with a light or medium contour; DPMS has models with 24 inch 1:10 twist barrels and some with 18 inch barrels. I would suggest you look for something no shorter than 20 inch so as to take full advantage of the hot pressurized gasses.

But I would really suggest you look instead at a Rem 700 with the barrel that you want; long enough to get you easily to the distance you want, short enough to hunt with, heavy enough to provide stability over multiple shots, light enough to carry. Once you have the proper action and barrel, you can restock all you want.

My emphasis is first and foremost on the barrel; given a great barrel, I will outfit the rifle however I want it as I am building on a good foundation.

I like heavier and longer barrels with faster twists; others like shorter and lighter barrels. I don't hunt much but I enjoy shooting at longer distances.

Nobody can make up your mind for you about what you really want in a rifle. Once you decide that, then you can form a concept.

 

[scotharr]

Re: No Idea which way to go or what to do...

You said you don't want to hurt your pockets too bad: then I'd shy away from an AR-10 platform. They tend to be more expensive and troublesome than equivalent bolt actions.

Now, I'm not trying to spank you, but will need to disagree with some of your assumptions and comments:

You said "I know only a .308 will get me to the distance I want unless I go up to a .300winmag or .338 (expensive!)" I think you are mis-informed. The 308WIN is not the best long-range cartridge: it's an all-around workhorse that performs adequately at up to 1000 yards. Many SMALLER cartridges, including your 270, have better ballistics.

Also, you want to switch from a 270WIN to a 308WIN and you think that you are improving your long-range capabilities? Wrong. The 270 is a very flat-shooting cartridge with better ballistics than a 308.

"...unless I go up to a .300winmag or .338 (expensive!)" Most people competing at 600 to 1000 yards are moving DOWN in caliber away from the magnums. 243WIN, for example is a superb long-range round, as are many others. 6mm, 6.5mm, 7mm bullets are the most popular for competitions out to 1K. Beyond 1K is where the magnums excel.