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Old Iron - Bad Photographer

RollingThunder51

Gunny Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Feb 15, 2009
1,571
1
U.S.A.
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I have really enjoyed watching the development of the Stealth Recon Scout (SRS) here on SH. A really different rifle coming out of design and into production is rare and when it does, it’s a time for celebration. It brings back some good memories and made me crack the vault in search of an old friend.

I’ve been around bullpups since I first came across a TKB-022PM5. Whereas the SRS variant serves a very different purpose, I can’t but think what Korobov would have thought seeing the SRS. I do not ever remember seeing a bolt action project and that is what makes this one so interesting and special. What will be equally interesting is seeing what happens next. I, for one, will be watching.

I thought I’d throw up another interesting U.S. bullpup here as a reference point of interest. It rarely gets a chance to be seen these days, what am I saying, it rarely got seen ever. It shares some similarities; it is in 7.62X51, was constructed for medium range personnel intervention and made it way through the system all the way up to a formal review by Fort Bragg. It did not make the cut and, in many ways, faded away.

Who is this man?
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Readers here stand a better chance of answering that question than anywhere else on the web, and with good reason. It seems that 50% of the threads here appear to touch on his work one way of another. He is, of course, Gale McMillan of McMillan stocks. Gale in his prime, at his height, surrounded by his products. I have had this picture hanging behind my desk for so long I can’t remember where I got it, but it remains a favorite and I thought I would share it. In his hands is one of his most interesting and creative pieces. When asked to hold one of his rifles for this publicity shot, he didn’t hesitate, he chose this rifle, the AWC G2. Here we see one of the final, and undoubtedly the most creative, iterations of the venerable M14 whose stock would be attended to by the master himself.

From 1956 to when this photo was taken, there are those here at SH that perhaps came to know the M-14 by many names. Not long after Lt. Col. Frank Conway (Ret) first mounted a commercial Weaver K6 on to two M14s it began. The XM21, M-14E1, M14E2, USAMTU and a number of others came into being. Even today, the M-14 can be found fielded in the M-14SD SEM or M14ALCS or perhaps Gale’s own M-2A.

The work on Gale’s bullpup started as an effort between Gale and the Israelis. Having been given a huge amount of surplus M-14s, the Israelis had decided to find away to use at least some of them for a new Sniper rifle program designated the Sirkis M-36. The designers set about to build a fiberglass stocked bullpup version that set the M-14’s receiver close to the butt. Gales was the consultant that designed and delivered the stock components. The project went on to become the TCI/TEI M89SR, Gales stock was dropped. The program sparked the interest of Lynn McWilliams of AWC Systems, another name that SH readers will recognize. The year was 1990 and Gale once again stepped forward with a revised design and together, Lynn and Gale brought two new rifles to Fort Bragg for review. The rifles differed in their purpose, one a heavy barreled medium to long range tactical rifle (22” barrel), the other a lighter version (18.5” barrel). As one might imagine the stocks were all hand laid and magnificent. Lynn had worked out the scope mount, modifications to the operating rod and the trigger. Lynn also selected a modified brake designed from the HK91 for all G2A’s and a special compensator on the full auto version, the GFA. The trigger is a 1:1 ratio transfer through a flexible steel cable that completely matches the trigger pull of the standard 2-stage M-14 trigger, “take up” being able to be completely addressed from nada to normal. Anything the could/should be done to the trigger was done. By today’s standards it would be best described as period correct for a precision gas gun.

AWC also provided a suppressor made entirely of 304 and measured 1.5”X10.” A two point contact to assure concentricity was provided by having the unit slip over the barrel . Decibel measurements revealed that this suppressor drop the signature from 167 to 139 dB, a solid 28 dB drop for its day. Dry system, that was all there was.

Other variants of the G2 were to follow. Some things remained consistent. The rifles always sported the superb Krieger National Match barrel, perhaps the greatest of all M-14 barrel makers. Krieger takes full advantage of the single point cut method by fully contouring the externals of the barrel before beginning the internals. Unlike the M-14 GI contract NM barrels that are all broach cut in a single pass, only Krieger was left to deliver the ultimate barrel. Many passes to cut one groove, the best that could be had, some stay its still the case. Point or Broach, that debate still rages and should not take us off track here. What was of special concern was the raised nature of the optical platform. People, this was before the readily available scopes that we almost take for granted today. U.S. Optics vs. Leopold vs. S&B vs. Premier vs. NighForce, my goodness, what an embarrassment of riches. The grey hairs (or no hair) stare in wonder and amusement as the debate rages between the magnificent options that can be had today! When the AWC G2 was around there was only one or two scope in the whole world that could take the abuse the G2’s produced. Swarovski 6X42 or the robust 1.5 Cobra. Good scopes that could take the unusual G forces of being perched up on the G2’s mount, well, they just weren’t growing on trees then.

Here are some shots for you all. This is the final variant produced and the last one out of the shop. It is the only Panzer grey G2AA produced. Purchased right from Lynn. The very last of Gale’s stocks went into the last ten units, two in white, four in what would become dark woodland, three in black and one in Panzer Grey. Old iron. Bad photographer.

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I would imagine that many here are now asking “well, how does it shoot?” or better yet “What happened at Fort Bragg?” Fair enough. The G2A with the final scope mount system seen above is a 1 MOA rifle. It was capable of more, but not in the way we judge rifles today. It seems that every one else I have ever met that still has one claims .5 MOA or better, I must not be doing my part. I’ll stick with 1 MOA and remember that back when Gorbachev was being put under house arrest and Marion Barry was being re-elected, that was considered fine accuracy for a .308 gas rifle that stood 36” tall and weighed 10 pounds. It was also expensive, with AWC charging the military and police a, back then, astonishing $2,800 a copy. If you wanted better performance, and Fort Bragg did, you did what one does today, you went with a bolt gun and got to ½ MOA at 1,000 meters. Nuff said. Still, if its just you and you’ll need to scramble through doorways and hallways to engage multiple targets at 400 meters that know your coming? I was just told “Nah! That’s what JDAM is for!”




P.S. – Now if you close that CAR stock down and your 7.62 22” barreled rifle is still shorter than that, well you just might be an AWC G2A.

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Interested in building your own M-14 based bullpup?

http://www.shortrifles.com/

Endless photos of the world’s most interesting bullpups, enjoy this link:

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?t=112162

Let the beatings begin!
 
Re: Old Iron - Bad Photographer

Wow! What a fantastic post. I really appreciate you taking the time to do it with all of the photos and links. What an interesting rifle. I learned quite a bit from this. Thanks again.

How does it shoot?
 
Re: Old Iron - Bad Photographer

Thanks, you never know with this crowd!

How does it shoot, well lets just say if it wasn't so rare, I would be putting a KX3 on as there is nothing like having an M-14 cycle at your right ear and then bark at your nose! It is my son's favorite rig, but he grew up on ARTII scoped FNLARs.
 
Re: Old Iron - Bad Photographer

Cool post. Thanks! I bought a MSAR STG last year and am still loving it.
 
Re: Old Iron - Bad Photographer


Thats a magnificent post!

It would be amazing if McMillan would offer that stock / rifle system again! That is an amazing combination of the 7.62x51 cartridge combined with a Bullpup stock plus a very reliable and apparently accurate semi-auto rifle.

If it wasn't for today's economy, I think that a re-introduction of that rifle would sell extremely well these days.

Lots of "WOW" factor built into that guy!
 
Re: Old Iron - Bad Photographer

Thanks everyone, much appreciated. These write ups take alot of time, but are a pleasure to do when somebody actually enjoys them.

ranger1183, know that the Seals are reviewing this one right now.

http://www.shortrifles.com/

There are at least three (3) significant revisions to that which you see on the site now, primarily focusing on the mag release, location of the rear pistol grip and the configuration of the trigger gaurd. It is going to be rebranded as well, but I'll leave that up to the designer of this variant to come on board and report, something that I expect him to do shortly.
 
Re: Old Iron - Bad Photographer

AWC built the guns in several configurations. Heavy and light barrels, semi and full auto. I think all the full auto receivers/guns were supplied by customers. AWC sold complete G2’s and they would convert your M1A to G2 configuration.

McMillan has been asked within the last few years to produce the G2 stocks, the response was NO, never, the molds were destroyed.

There were at least 3 evolutions of the scope mounts. The mounts were prone to breakage due to recoil. The recoil was also very hard on scopes under heavy use as well. The Cobra 1X(?) was reported to be one of the few to hold up to the 7.62.

The G2A in the photo (top gun) is the last version mount AWC produced, the same as the original thread. It was for an Army contract. 5 or 6 years ago Judy McWilliams asked if I would send my G2A to AWC to copy so they could quote a new request from the military. They had sold all of the G2’s they had produced. AWC did not even have a scope mount to copy.

The heavy barrel version had a “Hyper-Tune” system to allow the user to tension the barrel with a special socket/torque wrench to improve accuracy. The flash hider is a close copy of the HK G3 with a slot cut across the opening. The socket had been modified by installing a small drill rod inside to fit the slot. The flash hider was about 3-4” long with an angle shoulder mated to the barrel. This is the second point of alignment for the suppressor. AWC installed this system on several M1A series rifles they built. See the last photo of a M26.

The suppressor in the photos is a model G2. According to Judy this is one of 2 released from a Navy contract to the public. The suppressor will fit both rifles.

Somewhere in the files I have a lot of paperwork, AWC brochures, and magazine articles on the G2’s.

I sold my G2’s and moved to LaFrance M14K's with a M60 gas system (much softer shooting 7.62, even in F/A). The LOP/stock fit on the G2 for me was very uncomfortable. The trigger system failed on one of my guns. I felt it was fragile for hard use. It was just a wire from the front trigger to the rear.

Somewhere in MD is a spare stock that belongs to me. Guy sold me a rifle and spare stock. He shipped the rifle but not the stock. His x-wife had him arrested and went to jail. Never got the stock, guess I am luck to have the rifle. I still have a spare OP-rod and safety for the G2.

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M26
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M14K
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Re: Old Iron - Bad Photographer

jrhtx,

Very interesting and that is a fine La France. You sound like the kind of person that keeps all the docs, but just in case. From about the same time Tim was selling K's with "twin tube" gas pigs. First time I stumbled across him was for his work on doubling up extractors on S&W 76's long before SD or SureFire.

Enjoy

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<span style="font-weight: bold">17 years ago.</span>


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Re: Old Iron - Bad Photographer

I'm speechless, this thread confirms my thoughts and experiences...its one of the best threads written to date...when my son was dying 20 odd years ago, I had to sell everything, needless to say, I know what my next build will be!!!! Thankyou!!!