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Optic Opinions

Art02

Private
Minuteman
Jan 9, 2023
13
4
Dallas
Hey yall,
I am finishing a bolt build using a Defiance ruckus, with a 24 inch proof 6.5 prc barrel and I am now deciding on an optic. I am going to use this build to shoot hogs, coyotes, deer and hopefully an elk. Hunting will be the main focus but I also plan on using the rifle for some target, nothing prs but some home rifle courses. I was looking at the NX8 4-32 and NX8 2.5-20. I like the range that the 2.5-20 offers but I heard the eye box was finicky. I am going to put my mk5hd 3.6-18 while I am shopping for a replacement. I prefer FFP and illumination. Any thoughts are appreciated. My budget is 2k. Thank yall.
 
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You LE/Mil/Vet? Just wondering for pricing.
 
Check out the Burris Pro. It's under your price range at Liberty Optics. Everything you want for mentioned specs and a 5.5-30 power range. Very good glass. Also for hunting the speed dial can be marked ahead of time for your data so one less thing to worry about after ranging.

Another would be the Tract Toric ELR. Under your price range and an excellent reticle. Also very good glass.

I was going to mention the new Zeiss LEP S3 4-25x50 but it's a hair over your price range.
 
Keep your MK5 until you can hit the next price tier. Only thing wrong with the MK5 is the FOV imho. I was shopping for similar and wound up with a S&B 3-20 Ultra short. Wish it was 5-10 oz lighter, but otherwise love it.

Burris doesn't make the 3.3-18 in a Pro, sadly - but if you wanted more magnification, agree the Pro 5.5-30 is a best value optic. G3 is my other go to for value, but way too heavy for your build.

edit: Stenier tx6i might essentially be a Burris Pro in different mag ranges - heavy though.
 
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I bought the Steiner T6Xi 3-18x56 specifically for my Defiance AntiX with 20" Proof barrel in 6.5 PRC, I can't tell you much because the rifle isn't built yet (still have about 6 months wait time for the Defiance action) but I already bought the scope for it as I wanted 56mm but with a low end mag, I'll be doing more rigorous review of the scope later. Talk to Scott at Liberty Optics and he can probably get you under your price, illuminated MSR2 is the route I went and pretty happy with that.
 
I bought the Steiner T6Xi 3-18x56 specifically for my Defiance AntiX with 20" Proof barrel in 6.5 PRC, I can't tell you much because the rifle isn't built yet (still have about 6 months wait time for the Defiance action) but I already bought the scope for it as I wanted 56mm but with a low end mag, I'll be doing more rigorous review of the scope later. Talk to Scott at Liberty Optics and he can probably get you under your price, illuminated MSR2 is the route I went and pretty happy with that.
I got lucky and found a lefty ruckus with the exact setup I was looking for, pure luck and stubbornness while searching, never used a steiner before, what makes it better than the mk5hd, the fov?
 
Keep your MK5 until you can hit the next price tier. Only thing wrong with the MK5 is the FOV imho. I was shopping for similar and wound up with a S&B 3-20 Ultra short. Wish it was 5-10 oz lighter, but otherwise love it.

Burris doesn't make the 3.3-18 in a Pro, sadly - but if you wanted more magnification, agree the Pro 5.5-30 is a best value optic. G3 is my other go to for value, but way too heavy for your build.

edit: Stenier tx6i might essentially be a Burris Pro in different mag ranges - heavy though.
Would love a S&B but I am worried about diminishing returns, the price of the optic alone is more expensive than my entire build so far, hearing a lot of burris but just worried cus of the price
 
Would love a S&B but I am worried about diminishing returns, the price of the optic alone is more expensive than my entire build so far, hearing a lot of burris but just worried cus of the price

Have had plenty of S&Bs and wouldn't spend the money they ask now.

What about the Burris price worries you?
 
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Check out the Burris Pro. It's under your price range at Liberty Optics. Everything you want for mentioned specs and a 5.5-30 power range. Very good glass. Also for hunting the speed dial can be marked ahead of time for your data so one less thing to worry about after ranging.

Another would be the Tract Toric ELR. Under your price range and an excellent reticle. Also very good glass.

I was going to mention the new Zeiss LEP S3 4-25x50 but it's a hair over your price range.
a lot of people have been saying burris, I do not know anything about them but the price does worry me, seems almost too good to be true. The Zeiss however seems pretty baller and I am a little flexable on budget
 
Have had plenty of S&Bs and wouldn't spend the money they ask now.

What about the Burris price worries you?
honestly, didnt even know burris made high quality optics, thats a lack of research on my part. I am looking at it right now, it seems pretty awesome but at the same price as the Zeiss, seems hard to compete with it. What about the burris do you like so much?
 
a lot of people have been saying burris, I do not know anything about them but the price does worry me, seems almost too good to be true. The Zeiss however seems pretty baller and I am a little flexable on budget
honestly, didnt even know burris made high quality optics, thats a lack of research on my part. I am looking at it right now, it seems pretty awesome but at the same price as the Zeiss, seems hard to compete with it. What about the burris do you like so much?

It's not too good to be true. The Pro is a steal at Liberty Optics prices. Just got my second one. Pretty much mentioned all I like. The glass, the elevation knob and reticle. It's a nice package and Burris stepped up their game. The price is about $300 less than the Zeiss if you go through Liberty but the Zeiss is a nice package if you can swing it also. I will be buying a 6-36 to put on my .22 soon but the 4-25 would be perfect for a match rifle.
 
It's not too good to be true. The Pro is a steal at Liberty Optics prices. Just got my second one. Pretty much mentioned all I like. The glass, the elevation knob and reticle. It's a nice package and Burris stepped up their game. The price is about $300 less than the Zeiss if you go through Liberty but the Zeiss is a nice package if you can swing it also. I will be buying a 6-36 to put on my .22 soon but the 4-25 would be perfect for a match rifle.
hey fair enough, I will add it to the list of perspective optics, not to be too specific but since I am new to this, do you have any thoughts on the NX8 series? Just curious, I am trying to find pros and cons for each optic on my list
 
hey fair enough, I will add it to the list of perspective optics, not to be too specific but since I am new to this, do you have any thoughts on the NX8 series? Just curious, I am trying to find pros and cons for each optic on my list

Never used an NX8. Sorry.
 
Keep in mind the Zeiss S3 is a Japanese OEM whereas the S5 is Zeiss Germany. Not saying the S3 is bad, but don’t get too caught up in the name, Burris XTR Pro and Steiner T6Xi are assembled here in the US at the Greeley plant.
 
NX8 2.5-20x50 is a nice optic, but it is finicky as you say. 5x/6x scopes that are longer are going to be more forgiving. You don’t need high magnification to shoot far.
 
I've gotten a little time behind a T6Xi, and I have to admit I really like it.

When I first saw the specs on it I also assumed it was going to be very similar to the Pro, but they are as unlike as they are like.

There's definitely some shared design, but Steiner still sends over glass for it from Germany whereas Pro glass is from Japan. Fit and feel is different, the Steiner turrets are very Steiner'ish. More similar to the T7 than to the Pro.

I think they are pretty unique optics considering such a shared background.
 
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I’d like to get some hands on the Steiner to try the knobs. Is it only a dual turn with the numbers changing?

How is the glass compared as far as clarity from the Burris Pro to Steiner?
 
Glass on them are pretty damn good Rob. i got one in to do a Demo for a SRT/SWAT team with 7 other scopes and taped them all up to hide what they were. I didn’t go above 2500ish (LEO/MIL cost) because of their budget and them having to buy x amount of scopes At one time. They picked the Steiner without knowing what brand it was.
They did put forth a requirement last minute that they would rather the elevation/windage locking and had that not been the case, they might have picked
The Leica PRS. But they picked the Steiner. Surprised me. Their pick, and the difference in-quality of the T6XI over the old T5X.
 
I have also heard some good things about Burris.

But all the other recommendations here are also good and definitely worth looking into, pun definitely intended.
 
It's not too good to be true. The Pro is a steal at Liberty Optics prices. Just got my second one. Pretty much mentioned all I like. The glass, the elevation knob and reticle. It's a nice package and Burris stepped up their game. The price is about $300 less than the Zeiss if you go through Liberty but the Zeiss is a nice package if you can swing it also. I will be buying a 6-36 to put on my .22 soon but the 4-25 would be perfect for a match rifle.
It amazes me that anyone would question Burris quality. Out of all the optics in its price range, I think Burris is about the only company that’s not had a lot QC issues, sure the xtr2 glass kinda sucked but it still worked, and the internals are absolutely bomb proof. The RT6 is several years old, and it’s still a top contender in its price range.
 
am going to use this build to shoot hogs, coyotes, deer and hopefully an elk. Hunting will be the main focus
2.5-20 all day every day
4-32 or 4-16x42 would be good alternatives

I have a bunch of 2.5-20s. Superb hunting scopes.

The 2.5 is really nice for the closer shots
 
I know nothing about Khales optics other than the price tag, are they really worth the squeeze?

Whether it's worth it or not is only something you can decide.

There's a lot of threads about Khales here that you can read. They aren't necessarily best in any one category (except perhaps tracking reliability and reticle selection, but all around it's a great scope.

I have 3 K624i's and I'm not left wanting anything more. I really like them. You can find the K624's used for easily under $2k. A used K318 is probably around $2k. A K525 will be more.
 
I’d like to get some hands on the Steiner to try the knobs. Is it only a dual turn with the numbers changing?

How is the glass compared as far as clarity from the Burris Pro to Steiner?
I REALLY like the turrets on the T6Xi. They are 12mil with the numerical indicator switching over to the teens when you pass zero. They are also locking for folks that like that.

The glass reminds me more of the Razor than the XTR. Less bright, but good color. Blues really pop. Clarity is a wash between the Pro and T6Xi. Its very close. It's a nice scope.
 
Would love a S&B but I am worried about diminishing returns, the price of the optic alone is more expensive than my entire build so far, hearing a lot of burris but just worried cus of the price

What you get with Burris XTR3 over MK5 HD is FOV - glass is a wash to me. Burris brighter, MK5 more contrast, clarity equivalent (I'm sure the Pro is better still). FOV is night and day, though. After experiencing it, I would never buy another optic with poor FOV (older kahles included). In fact, I'd take lesser glass for better FOV.

As far as the S&B, I wanted a mid-power optic, great FOV, and have always wanted an MSR2 ret. Found one with DTII+ bells and whistles and said screw it. Nothing really beats the 3-20 ultra short once you start comparing. Very surprised the segment hasn't exploded with options. Would've loved a 2-20 March WA if they made one... thought about the 1.5-15, but wanted a little more mag on the high side. Anyway, S&B is not a value purchase.

If weight isn't a concern, I'd try the Steiner... All of the options will beat the NX8's. Look through your MK5 next to an NX8 past 500 yards and you will see the difference. NX8, and all Nightforce stuff, is approx ~1K overpriced after owning one and looking through others compared to my stuff.
 
What you get with Burris XTR3 over MK5 HD is FOV - glass is a wash to me. Burris brighter, MK5 more contrast, clarity equivalent (I'm sure the Pro is better still). FOV is night and day, though. After experiencing it, I would never buy another optic with poor FOV (older kahles included). In fact, I'd take lesser glass for better FOV.

I'm well into double digits at MK5/XTRIII comparisons. That's pretty much verbatim what I've found to be true.

I ran into a couple buddies at the range this morning. We're all getting ready to shoot the PRS Pro Series match here in Idaho next weekend. We compared their two MK5s to both of my Pros. The Pro is noticeably better glass. Clarity, especially in mirage like today, is clearly superior in the Pro. Everyone was pretty much in agreement on it..

After getting used to XTR FOV and edge to edge glass sight picture, I dont like looking through the MK5 or the ATACR. Its a tunnel..
 
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Here’s my attempt at muddying the waters even more for you lol.

I picked up a US made XTR3 3.3-18 and was very impressed with it. The glass was bright and sharp. The turrets were nice and crisp with solid detents and almost no play. But like an idiot I noticed the reticle would shift when changing directions in magnification and I sent it back to Burris before realizing this was normal for FFP optics. They decided to replace it with a new illuminated version (which I was pissed about because I bought the one I did because I wanted a US made scope, but that’s beside the point).

The replacement scope (still a 3.3-18) was definitely not as nice as the first. The glass was bright, but lost some of its sharpness up at 17-18x.

The best way I can describe the turrets is they felt like the detents were half as deep as they should be, had a thick application of a heavy grease, had too much resistance to turn, and had a little play between clicks. All this made a very mushy feeling turret that wasn’t going away after a few range sessions. After some reading, I decided to remove all of the excess factory applied “grease” from the main o-ring. This exponentially improved the feel of the turrets, though to me they still weren’t quite what I prefer. They felt like a lighter click, verses the thunk that the first scope had.

The XTR3 has good FOV (more on this later), a forgiving eye box, and nice depth of field. It tracks reliably, and is overall a very good scope, especially in it’s price range. I feel it handily beats out basically everything else in that $1000-$1500 range.

For comparison, I recently picked up an NX8 4-32. I had looked through one on a buddy’s rifle about a year ago and remember being relatively impressed. My current example is everything I had hoped it would be. The glass is as good or better than a Razor AMG that I had, and maintains its sharpness all the way up to 32x (provided it’s focused properly). The turrets are not the loudest, but they are definitive with almost no play. Interestingly the FOV in the middle of the mag range (10-20x ish, which is where I spend most of my time) is damn close to the XTR3. For instance, with both set to 18x, the XTR3 had about 22.7 Mils of FOV, the NX8 is right at 22 Mils. It’s close enough that I’ll never notice it.

The downside to the NX8 is that above 24x a few things happen. The eye box gets pretty tight (as expected from an 8x erector), the image starts to darken enough to notice, and the depth of field/parallax/focus gets pretty shallow, especially under 3-400ish yards. That said, I almost never shoot that high up, so it’s a non-issue for me. This scope is also very good at having zero parallax and being in focus at the same time, so when taking a shot on an animal, as long as you get the image crisp, then parallax will be zeroed out enough to not worry about.

So in conclusion, as far as the XTR3 goes, based on my sample size of 2, I feel the QC is not high enough to say it’s always at the same level as the mk5’s, NX8’s, etc. Are a lot of the XTR3s there? Possibly. Are all of them? Nope. Do they beat out comparably priced optics? Easily. Is it worth the extra cost to go with the next tier of optic? I’d say which one you choose depends on how neurotic you are about specific aspects of performance. Are you a hunter? Are you a competitor? Do you obsess over pure resolving power? FOV? Depth of field? Does it inspire confidence?

Personally, I’m keeping the NX8 on my hunting rifle. At the same time, for the price, it wouldn’t be my first choice on a PRS gun.

I have no experience with the XTR Pro, but based on what I’ve read, it sounds like it’s a step, or more, above the standard XTR3. It’s also in that next price bracket, so I would expect it to consistently perform with or above it’s peers.
 
Hey yall,
I am finishing a bolt build using a Defiance ruckus, with a 24 inch proof 6.5 prc barrel and I am now deciding on an optic. I am going to use this build to shoot hogs, coyotes, deer and hopefully an elk. Hunting will be the main focus but I also plan on using the rifle for some target, nothing prs but some home rifle courses. I was looking at the NX8 4-32 and NX8 2.5-20. I like the range that the 2.5-20 offers but I heard the eye box was finicky. I am going to put my mk5hd 3.6-18 while I am shopping for a replacement. I prefer FFP and illumination. Any thoughts are appreciated. My budget is 2k. Thank yall.
I'd take the advice about an XTR over an NX8 for sure.
I had a 4-32 and it was a huge let down, my mk5 5-25 killed it, even the 3.6-18 mk5 was easier to get behind and had better glass.
I recently spent some time behind another NX8 4-32 and got a refresher on the poor glass quality, I focused on a variety of targets out to 1200 yards and just couldn't get a clear sharp image.

I feel NF is stuck where they were 20 years ago, and rely on their reputation as one of the first long range scope makers to sell scopes that are honestly being outdone by competitors in the $1000 range.
 
Hey yall,
I am finishing a bolt build using a Defiance ruckus, with a 24 inch proof 6.5 prc barrel and I am now deciding on an optic. I am going to use this build to shoot hogs, coyotes, deer and hopefully an elk. Hunting will be the main focus but I also plan on using the rifle for some target, nothing prs but some home rifle courses. I was looking at the NX8 4-32 and NX8 2.5-20. I like the range that the 2.5-20 offers but I heard the eye box was finicky. I am going to put my mk5hd 3.6-18 while I am shopping for a replacement. I prefer FFP and illumination. Any thoughts are appreciated. My budget is 2k. Thank yall.

If this rifle was not being used for hunting, I'd seriously suggest you get in contact with Scott at liberty optics @LibertyOptics this weekend (or at the latest by Monday) and ask what he could do for you on the Vortex Razor III 6-36 x56 scope.

That being said as others mentioned above, Scott has several other brands and lots of options from Vortex and Steiner and Burris on super sale until Tuesday.
I'd say you'd be well served going out checking a few models then asking him for a price & / or suggestions.

You might just be really surprised how much scope your money gets you.