Police Search Baltimore County House Over BB Gun in Virtual Class

[PatMiles]

"I FELT VIOLATED"|Police Search Baltimore County House Over BB Gun in Virtual Class

BALTIMORE (WBFF) - A Baltimore County family is warning other parents after they say police were called to their house over something that happened during a virtual school lesson. The incident is raising concerns over privacy and safety in the era of online learning. As a Navy veteran with four...

foxbaltimore.com

BALTIMORE (WBFF) - A Baltimore County family is warning other parents after they say police were called to their house over something that happened during a virtual school lesson. The incident is raising concerns over privacy and safety in the era of online learning.

As a Navy veteran with four years of active duty, Courtney Lancaster has extensive knowledge of guns, how to use them and how to store them.

Her 11-year-old son, who owns BB guns, is a boy scout in fifth grade at Seneca Elementary School.

“He's just a very intellectual child, but he's all boy as well. He loves to be outside and play and ride his bikes and that sort of thing,” Courtney told Project Baltimore.


In his pursuit of becoming an Eagle Scout, Courtney says her son has learned how to shoot a BB gun and an airsoft gun. He’s also taken three levels of archery lessons. His mother says he stores his bow and guns on this wall in his bedroom. It’s never been a problem until June 1, when police pulled up outside her house.

"I FELT VIOLATED"|Police Search Baltimore County House Over BB Gun in Virtual Class


“I had no idea what to think. I've never been in any legal trouble whatsoever. I've never had any negative encounter with law enforcement,” said Courtney. “I had no idea. I really didn't know what to think.”

Courtney says she was home with her son who’s been doing virtual learning since schools shut down in March.








Police Search Baltimore County House Over BB Gun in Virtual Class (WBFF)


“So, I answered the door. The police officer was, he was very nice. He explained to me that he was coming to address an issue with my son's school,” Courtney told Project Baltimore. “And then explained to me that he was here to search for weapons, in my home. And I consented to let him in. And then I, unfortunately, stood there and watched police officers enter my 11-year-old son's bedroom.”

Courtney was told someone had seen the guns in her son’s bedroom during a Google Meet class on his laptop.

“I thought, this is outrageous. This is despicable,” she said. “I had no idea what in the world could this be over? BB guns never even once entered my mind. How many 11-year-old boys have BB guns?”

According to emails Courtney later exchanged with a school administrator, a screenshot was taken during the online class. The principal of Seneca Elementary was notified. Courtney says she was told the school safety officer then called police.

“I felt violated as a parent, for my child, who's standing there with police officers in his room, just to see the fear on his face,” she said.

Courtney says the police officers were in her home for about 20 minutes and found no violations. No laws were broken and no dangers present. They left without any further action, but Courtney wasn’t done.

Since that day, she has written school administrators, the superintendent and the school board, demanding answers. She says the principal initially compared bringing a weapon to a virtual class to bringing a gun to school.

"I FELT VIOLATED"|Police Search Baltimore County House Over BB Gun in Virtual Class


She was also told she could not see the screenshot of her son’s bedroom, because it’s not part of his student record.

“It's absolutely scary to think about,” Courtney said. “Who are on these calls? Who do we have viewing your children and subsequently taking these screenshots that can be sent anywhere or used for any purpose?”

Project Baltimore reached out to Baltimore County Schools requesting an interview. We received this statement, “Our longstanding policy is to not debate individual circumstances through the media. There are multiple ways for families to share concerns with us. In general terms, the safety of students and staff is our chief concern, whether we are meeting in classrooms or via continuity of learning.”

"I FELT VIOLATED"|Police Search Baltimore County House Over BB Gun in Virtual Class


Courtney says she understands the safety concerns, but no one called her first before involving police.

“There's no more trust. There have just been a series of lies and just no cooperation,” she said.

Now, she worries about the future of virtual learning without clear policies in place.

“So, what are the parameters? Where are the lines drawn? If my son is sitting at the kitchen island next to a butcher block, does that constitute a weapon? It's not allowed at school, right? So, would my home then be searched because he's sitting next to a butcher block,” Courtney said. “I feel like parents need to be made aware of what the implications are, what the expectations are.”

 

[Jscb1b]

Jesus jumped up fucking Christ!

 

[GBMaryland]

Her absolute first mistake was letting him in the house without a warrant.

Her second mistake was not having a lawyer present.

An officer can attempt to play the game of I thought there was an immediate danger… But if they had time to go through all of that structure with the school they also had time to go get a warant.

 

[Blue Sky Country]

1. Sue the school.

2. Do NOT EVER consent to a search without a fucking warrant.

3. Sue the school. Yes I said that twice.

Society is REALLY becoming a fucking cesspool of cuckoldry now. Candace Owens is right. We SHOULD balkanize and give the liberal pussies their own shithole of a country. However, I do not agree with that country being taken from the USA's own territory though... Maybe some war torn region in the Middle East or Africa should be suffice...

ETA: And the boy's mother had voiced yet another grave concern about this mass sharing and storage of digital information pertaining to "online learning" and "virtual classrooms". If anyone can have access to this data, imagine just how many perverts and closeted pedophiles out there, perhaps working in the school system or law enforcement, can be watching, downloading and sharing content from these "classes" right now as we speak?

 

[FatBoy]

When will enough people be fed up with this kind of bullshit to enact change?

I agree with @Blue Sky Country that they should sue the shit out of every agency involved, from the school all the way up to the mayors office for allowing (mandating) the police to act like this. And the police chief should be gone for allowing their officers to be used for this shit.

I'd also get the lawyer to file an information request with the court to get the name of the "whistleblower" so I could sue that fucker as well. No way they should be protected. Does the little bastard who "SWATS" someone get protection? I see very little difference, this just didn't go south.

 

[Maser]

Dumb bitch consented to a search!

 

[kenny1773]

This is police top priority in the time of riots and looting?

fucking wow

 

[Ravenworks]

Dumb bitch consented to a search!

Game over.
She should have stepped outside and secured her home.

 

[Maser]

So was it the actual BB gun or the airsoft gun that spooked the school? The airsoft clearly has a visible orange muzzle.

 

[softcock]

So was it the actual BB gun or the airsoft gun that spooked the school? The airsoft clearly has a visible orange muzzle.

-
BB gun, Airsoft?.. not even relevant to the situation. With the school, State, 'teachers union' passing legal judgment threw the 2-way lens on the child who is sitting on private property far away from brick and mortar public school and other school children.
So basically what the State is saying is ... they 'own' responsibility of your children over the child's parents, even if he/she and parents are inside there own private property . States overwatch threw the camera, there arm now legally reaches into your private home .
-

 

[GBMaryland]

ETA: And the boy's mother had voiced yet another grave concern about this mass sharing and storage of digital information pertaining to "online learning" and "virtual classrooms". If anyone can have access to this data, imagine just how many perverts and closeted pedophiles out there, perhaps working in the school system or law enforcement, can be watching, downloading and sharing content from these "classes" right now as we speak?

So yesterday I am on a video chat with my sons teacher… We are using some form of Google classroom and at some point she opens another application so that we can do this particular lesson.

My son is autistic and his teachers a special education teacher and the only thing they can do is one on one kind of work.

The school system is using this other site and I had to login to that site in order to be able to use the service.

As I attempt to do it google pops up and basically tells me that this third-party site will have access to pretty much everything I have in Google.

So the school system is willing and more than happy to allow a third-party site to have access to all of the information stored in your Google account!

“School system trust it so it must be OK.”

I responded “ You’ve got to be shitting me right? It actually says that they will have access to everything in my Google account. On what planet do you think that’s OK? For what reason would they conceivably need access to my entire account and everything in it such as my email and any pictures?“

That didn’t get any response… And I logged into it with an empty dummy account.

I agree 100% that she needs to sue the school system. I also think that she will be completely successful in doing so, and then that will totally screw the whole concept of remote learning for sometime.

 

[GBMaryland]

This is police top priority in the time of riots and looting?

fucking wow

There are so many possible issues here it’s not even funny.

I know that many guns require that red or orange endpeice.

So it begs the question did the police officer ever see the actual footage to be able to make a determination in the first place?

Did they rely on the school system to tell them what they were looking for? In other words did they not do their part of the job and listen to some bozo that doesn’t know a goddamn thing about firearms?

I mean there are so many possible fuck ups here.... so many lawsuits that are possible… The state is looking at losing a lot of money from this and Baltimore is a shit show anyway

… And if it was a firearms emergency why didn’t they respond with the Maryland State police firearms retrieval unit? Those are the guys who go and get guns for people who have been convicted of felonies…

 

[Blue Sky Country]

So yesterday I am on a video chat with my sons teacher… We are using some form of Google classroom and at some point she opens another application so that we can do this particular lesson.

My son is autistic and his teachers a special education teacher and the only thing they can do is one on one kind of work.

The school system is using this other site and I had to login to that site in order to be able to use the service.

As I attempt to do it google pops up and basically tells me that this third-party site will have access to pretty much everything I have in Google.

So the school system is willing and more than happy to allow a third-party site to have access to all of the information stored in your Google account!

“School system trust it so it must be OK.”

I responded “ You’ve got to be shitting me right? It actually says that they will have access to everything in my Google account. On what planet do you think that’s OK? For what reason would they conceivably need access to my entire account and everything in it such as my email and any pictures?“

That didn’t get any response… And I logged into it with an empty dummy account.

I agree 100% that she needs to sue the school system. I also think that she will be completely successful in doing so, and then that will totally screw the whole concept of remote learning for sometime.

Yeah this is pure, steaming shit right here...

Bypass that shit. Set up another Google account with an email address that is specific to a certain purpose, like your son's education, or your own work related things. Do NOT use that account and associated email for anything else other than what it is set up for. Anything personal and family belongs on a separate account with a separate email that is not known by anyone else. I have operated in this fashion for years, since I had to use email accounts to sign into various programs in high school. Everything separate. And do not use any character or number strings in your separate email addresses that may appear similar to the other ones.

 

[DarnYankeeUSMC]

Lawsuits?? These people don't give a rats ass about them. It's taxpayers money not theirs. There's no personal responsibility for them.

 

[seanh]

Okay, this is how you start putting an end to this crap...free porn and rubber dicks.

So years ago, whenever people were being douchebags to a certain point where they refused to listen to reason, I helped educate them properly. Mailbox porn. Got me a few hardcore porn mags, flip to the back with all the free porn advertisements and had little fun. I get the name and address of the offender and simply provided it. There was gay por, interracial porn, midget porn, dildos Etc.

Send it to everybody on the school board, police chief, officer that showed up. The people you don't have to worry about will likely say thank you. The rest of the snowflakes, well that's just funny

 

[Blue Sky Country]

Lawsuits?? These people don't give a rats ass about them. It's taxpayers money not theirs. There's no personal responsibility for them.

That may change soon, and we can "thank" George Floyd for that...

People WILL become a lot more careful when they are held personally liable for any fuckups they make. Lawsuits that take from the defendant's own financial assets is what we need to establish a sense of accountability again.

 

[GBMaryland]

My suspicion is that there is almost no way they didn’t see that it was a toy gun. What she shows in her sons bedroom is clearly an airsoft toy...

So what this is going to mean is that they went after her with no good probable cause. And there is no excuse for not knowing that those firearms were clearly not real. The BB gun even had a front red sight.... and I’ve never seen one with the front blade that looks like that; that is clearly a non-modern firearm, let alone the stock had red Ryder on it

 

[Alphatreedog]

Okay, this is how you start putting an end to this crap...free porn and rubber dicks.

So years ago, whenever people were being douchebags to a certain point where they refused to listen to reason, I helped educate them properly. Mailbox porn. Got me a few hardcore porn mags, flip to the back with all the free porn advertisements and had little fun. I get the name and address of the offender and simply provided it. There was gay por, interracial porn, midget porn, dildos Etc.

Send it to everybody on the school board, police chief, officer that showed up. The people you don't have to worry about will likely say thank you. The rest of the snowflakes, well that's just funny

How do I get you my address ? Askin for a friend .

 

[Son of Dorn]

So was it the actual BB gun or the airsoft gun that spooked the school? The airsoft clearly has a visible orange muzzle.

The airsoft gun, because it's an evil Assault Rifle Forty-Sixteen, of course.

But it's probably more that the busybodies at the school are appalled that a child would have any kind of evil shooty-things, especially in his ROOM! Why, heaven forbid, it might go off all on its own and shoot the other classmates through the internet! Bet they'd get him in trouble if he had props of blasters (airsoft or otherwise) from Star Wars, or an airsoft version of the Pulse Rifle from Aliens (I have one; it's a Thompson SMG with dressing on it like the original props, heavy and inaccurate but a fun toy), or Halo cosplay guns or what-have-you. Maybe even if he'd had a damn Nerf gun painted over to look like metal instead of bright-spanking-orange-and-blue plastic.

Doesn't really matter which of the guns it was, the school shouldn't be allowed to send the police into someone's home like that. What's next, sending the police over fears of hate speech and racism because a kid with an interest in WWII has visible tank models with Wehrmacht crosses and airplanes with swastikas on their tails in his bedroom? Never mind that he has an American plane hanging not two feet away, that one swastika means he and his family might support racism.

 

[Foul Mike]

1984. did you read it when younger and is it not now coming full circle?

No warrant, No entry, and sue the shit out of ALL involved.

And, IMHO, the Police, with everything else going on, just stepped on their dicks again or shot a toe or 2 off.

 

[Bender]

How do I get you my address ? Askin for a friend .

Hot feathers monthly on its way

 

[Foul Mike]

In Denver there is a big push to remove Denver PD school resource Officers from all of the schools now and they are going to do it.

And in the case of the OP, who do they call? The Police.

You can't have it both ways.

 

[Steel+Killer]

Just when I was starting to feel sorry for LE....Its when they do shit like this is when your like fuck-em.

The correct response when the school called them because they saw a gun hanging on the wall should have been......

"What crime do you see on the video at the boys house?"

"A gun hanging on the wall you say?"

"LOL LOL ok call us back when you see an actual crime nothing we can do have a good day"

"Oh and by the way is US history taught at your school?"

"It is......Do us both a favor please go look up this thing called the second amendment because it seems you guys aren't familiar with a subject you claim to teach could have saved us both some time from this phone call today."

 

[GBMaryland]

Keep in mind that many states have storage laws... And I believe Maryland was one of those states that you have to have your guns locked up if you’re not in your immediate control.

 

[Steel+Killer]

Keep in mind that many states have storage laws... And I believe Maryland was one of those states that you have to have your guns locked up if you’re not in your immediate control.

They still didn't know if it was a firearm, air gun, or a toy gun just as if they had seen white powder laid out on a table it didn't / wouldn't warrant a phone call to the police.

 

[GBMaryland]

I think a white powder on a table with a creditcard and mirror would get you a warrant or be acceptable for probable cause.

Guns are a different, protected, dealio.

 

[kl3309]

"What crime do you see on the video at the boys house?"

Md. CRIMINAL LAW Code Ann. § 4-104

§ 4-104. Child's access to firearms

(a) Definitions. --
(1) In this section the following words have the meanings indicated.
(2) "Ammunition" means a cartridge, shell, or other device containing explosive or incendiary material designed and intended for use in a firearm.
(3) "Child" means an individual under the age of 16 years.
(4)
(i) "Firearm" means a handgun, rifle, shotgun, short-barreled rifle, or short-barreled shotgun, as those terms are defined in § 4-201 of this title, or any other firearm.
(ii) "Firearm" does not include an antique firearm as defined in § 4-201 of this title.
(b) Exceptions. -- This section does not apply if:
(1) the child's access to a firearm is supervised by an individual at least 18 years old;
(2) the child's access to a firearm was obtained as a result of an unlawful entry;
(3) the firearm is in the possession or control of a law enforcement officer while the officer is engaged in official duties; or
(4) the child has a certificate of firearm and hunter safety issued under § 10-301.1 of the Natural Resources Article.
(c) Prohibited. -- A person may not store or leave a loaded firearm in a location where the person knew or should have known that an unsupervised child would gain access to the firearm.
(d) Penalty. -- A person who violates this section is guilty of a misdemeanor and on conviction is subject to a fine not exceeding $ 1,000.
(e) Effect of violation. --
(1) A violation of this section may not:
(i) be considered evidence of negligence;
(ii) be considered evidence of contributory negligence;
(iii) limit liability of a party or an insurer; or
(iv) diminish recovery for damages arising out of the ownership, maintenance, or operation of a firearm or ammunition.
(2) A party, witness, or lawyer may not refer to a violation of this section during a trial of a civil action that involves property damage, personal injury, or death.

And remember, since you're an otherwise law-abiding citizen, you are guilty until the charge can't be proven by the state.

 

[Steel+Killer]

Point taken on the white powder on a table with a creditcard and mirror, but even in a state like Maryland I don't think they could have gotten a judge to sign a search warrant because there was a gun hanging on the wall in the background in a video lesson.

 

[GBMaryland]

I agree

 

[Deleted member 113831]

This likely isn't the officers fault.

For all of you who don't understand how shit actually works, let me break it down for you.

Because of dumb ass lawsuits...and legitimate lawsuits as well, street cops have very little officer discretion.

This means that almost every single aspect of what they do is covered by some fucked up micro managing policy. A cop literally , in many departments, can't leave his car to take a shit without calling in to dispatch to update his status.

So, here is what most likely happened...

Dumbass teacher sees toy...dumbass teacher calls cops...dispatcher doesn't see picture, dispatcher has no authority to make a decision anyway... Dispatcher is bound by policy to put out the call... Cop gets call of unsecured weapon and never sees any picture... Cop must respond to call by policy... Cop never sees picture... Cop shows up at address... Cop tells resident what was reported... Cop asks if he can verify that what resident says is true... Resident says yes, and it is verified as true...Cop leaves and goes on with the rest of his day.

Resident goes on social media and tells everyone about the jack booted thugs spying on her kids and sending cops to her house to inspect her children's toys.

Fucktards on Snipers Hide work themselves into a frothing frenzy...again...over emerging police state...


All actions set in motion by one cocksucking, busy body, school employee who has nothing better to do.

 

[ken226]

So, here is what most likely happened...

Dumbass teacher sees toy...dumbass teacher calls cops...dispatcher doesn't see picture, dispatcher has no authority to make a decision anyway... Dispatcher is bound by policy to put out the call... Cop gets call of unsecured weapon and never sees any picture... Cop must respond to call by policy... Cop never sees picture... Cop shows up at address... Cop tells resident what was reported... Cop asks if he can verify that what resident says is true... Resident says yes, and it is verified as true...Cop leaves and goes on with the rest of his day.

Resident goes on social media and tells everyone about the jack booted thugs spying on her kids and sending cops to her house to inspect her children's toys.

Fucktards on Snipers Hide work themselves into a frothing frenzy...again...over emerging police state...

That's pretty much my takeway as well.



So, I read through the link posted, and it became pretty clear what happened.

The police responded as policy likely requires when the dispatcher put it out on the radio.

I imagine they arrived, looked around, then Cop A looked at cop B and says "uh, there went 30 seconds of my life I'll never get back. Let's go get lunch".

Most everyone involved in this, from the teachers to the mom, and including the bear pit, would do well with less time on the internet and more outside actually doing something.

 

[Steel+Killer]

Or maybe it could have gone like.......

Hello mam we are here because we got a report of your child having a gun on his bedroom wall we just want to let you know if its a firearm it needs to be secured if its a bb gun or toy sorry for bothering you have a good day.

Oh yea thanks for stopping by that is just his bb gun on the wall.

LOL we figured as much we just had to check it out once again mam sorry for bothering you have a great day.

But what the fuck do I know I am just some fucktard on SH that still believes in the US Constitution.

 

[GBMaryland]

I believe you.

The issue is more with how things are working from a privacy standpoint with the school system, as well as how the fucktards at the school system deal with the issues.

There was also a school resource office involved, who, since he couldn't get a job as a real police officer, ended up at the school. THAT person is likely the winner that couldn't tell the difference between orange tipped airsoft gun / red ryder BB gun, and actual firearms. ...and more than likely didn't care as it was more important to cover his ass.

Then there is the mother in this story, who, frankly, doesn't know her legal butt from a hole in the ground. It's odd to me that she didn't ask if they had a warrant... It's further odd to me that she didn't understand that they were coming to investigate her / arrest her!

I understand you guys have limited options. That wasn't the real issue here. The issue was the school and the idiot mother.

(I also have a bit of an issue with leaving toy guns in plain view in a Baltimore suburb... seems a great way to ensure your house gets broken into.)

I'm not sure the jack-booted thug police officer motif has any place in this conversation... as all the guy did was exploit her lack of an understanding of her rights... which is what police officers do as a matter of routine. You only get told your rights if you're getting arrested... otherwise you need to know them.

 

[Keel Haul]

 

[Sean the Nailer]

This likely isn't the officers fault.

For all of you who don't understand how shit actually works, let me break it down for you.

Because of dumb ass lawsuits...and legitimate lawsuits as well, street cops have very little officer discretion.

This means that almost every single aspect of what they do is covered by some fucked up micro managing policy. A cop literally , in many departments, can't leave his car to take a shit without calling in to dispatch to update his status.

So, here is what most likely happened...

Dumbass teacher sees toy...dumbass teacher calls cops...dispatcher doesn't see picture, dispatcher has no authority to make a decision anyway... Dispatcher is bound by policy to put out the call... Cop gets call of unsecured weapon and never sees any picture... Cop must respond to call by policy... Cop never sees picture... Cop shows up at address... Cop tells resident what was reported... Cop asks if he can verify that what resident says is true... Resident says yes, and it is verified as true...Cop leaves and goes on with the rest of his day.

Resident goes on social media and tells everyone about the jack booted thugs spying on her kids and sending cops to her house to inspect her children's toys.

Fucktards on Snipers Hide work themselves into a frothing frenzy...again...over emerging police state...


All actions set in motion by one cocksucking, busy body, school employee who has nothing better to do.

The key point to make here, to repeat it, and to stress the importance of the difference is:

The JACK-BOOTED-THUGS in this story are the snapperhead/snapperheads that were paying more attention to the background of the child, than the educating of the child to begin with. And those involved in the decision to 'call it in'.

The dispatcher, and the Police Officers (LEO's) whom knocked on the door and did their due-diligence were definitely fine, upstanding members of society. That, Thank God, worked AS IT SHOULD HAVE.

But back to those 'Jack-Booted-Thugs'.... the same ones whom are proponents for burning books and all that which entails..... they TRULY need to be dealt with. Swiftly, assuredly, and "precedent-setting'ly" for all others to see and learn.

 

[Deleted member 113831]

Or maybe it could have gone like.......

Hello mam we are here because we got a report of your child having a gun on his bedroom wall we just want to let you know if its a firearm it needs to be secured if its a bb gun or toy sorry for bothering you have a good day.

Oh yea thanks for stopping by that is just his bb gun on the wall.

LOL we figured as much we just had to check it out once again mam sorry for bothering you have a great day.

But what the fuck do I know I am just some fucktard on SH that still believes in the US Constitution.

I guess you didn't get the part about policy and officer discretion.

If the police were in the business of taking people's word, then the jails would be a lot emptier and investigations could be wrapped up in a day with a few interviews over the phone.

...And you are absolutely correct, you are a fucktard on snipers hide that has no idea of how shit actually works.

I'll bet you drive your vehicle according to your highschool drivers ed manual as well.

 

[LawnMM]

This shouldn't surprise anyone, it's why revolvers are reloaded with magazines on TV. The lefties are so afraid of guns they lack the will to attain even a basic understanding.

Therefore, everything gun shaped is evil, scary, dangerous, and requires the police!

 

[Jscb1b]

But I thought we were defunding the police.

 

[Foul Mike]

Skookum, I feel your pain, I really do.
From nothing other than The Hide, I do feel that YOU, as well as many other people like YOU, and my Son, who is my dog in this fight, are doing as well as you can with this shit show going on now.
I have posted long and hard about LE Officers doing the right thing about who they have in their ranks, but I will stand behind the ones with experience as long as they are at least trying to do the right things.. They need to have the cuffs off to Police their own ranks.
That has not happened, as much as the Ranks and file, and guys and gals, on the street wanted it done, now, it is being done for them and not in a good way because they failed to do it themselves but they did have the opportunity to do it themselves but what they had to say was boffed into the wind??? Isn't this diversity hiring and lowering Standards working out well for you LEs on the streets? Especially someone like you that has some experience?
Feel free to PM me, I would like to know where you work and how long you have been doing it??? FM

 

[Steel+Killer]

I guess you didn't get the part about policy and officer discretion.

If the police were in the business of taking people's word, then the jails would be a lot emptier and investigations could be wrapped up in a day with a few interviews over the phone.

...And you are absolutely correct, you are a fucktard on snipers hide that has no idea of how shit actually works.

I'll bet you drive your vehicle according to your highschool drivers ed manual as well.

Ok great they had to follow the Kings orders and go out and investigate I acknowledged that, but because you are to stupid to get it I will clarify it for you again. They didn't have to go in her house they could have simply asked her and been on their way, we aren't talking about some child abuse accusation here, we are talking about a kid having a gun on his bedroom wall (which in certain parts of the US where common sense still exist is perfectly legal)

Ha Ha Your a fucking sheep that probably couldn't wipe his own ass without directions.

It is dumb fucks like you who think we need all these "what if" laws .

Enjoy your nanny state sheep!

 

[Deleted member 113831]

Skookum, I feel your pain, I really do.
From nothing other than The Hide, I do feel that YOU, as well as many other people like YOU, and my Son, who is my dog in this fight, are doing as well as you can with this shit show going on now.
I have posted long and hard about LE Officers doing the right thing about who they have in their ranks, but I will stand behind the ones with experience as long as they are at least trying to do the right things.. They need to have the cuffs off to Police their own ranks.
That has not happened, as much as the Ranks and file, and guys and gals, on the street wanted it done, now, it is being done for them and not in a good way because they failed to do it themselves but they did have the opportunity to do it themselves but what they had to say was boffed into the wind??? Isn't this diversity hiring and lowering Standards working out well for you LEs on the streets? Especially someone like you that has some experience?
Feel free to PM me, I would like to know where you work and how long you have been doing it??? FM

Several problems facing LEO's:

1) Desk crawling cocksuckers get elected and promoted with No real concern or talent for actual effective policing.

Think about the Vietnam War when targets were being approved personally by the Whitehouse and Rules of Engagement were constantly changing and always inadequate leaving the ground pounding troops exposed to both the enemy and to liability later. Same thing happened during the Obama administration...

Who would want to do that job? Of those who had that job, how many wanted to keep doing it? What kind of leadership got promoted during that time?

Well, the same thing has happened in law enforcement at all levels.

2) Social media will keep all the bad shit preserved forever, while anything good will die.

When was the last time anyone went to youtube to find a video of a hero cop?...but any fucked up video is shared millions of times and will still be a hater's favorite 5 years from now. It might even get retitled and reused to throw fuel on a completely unrelated dumpster fire of an incident.

Here is an experiment for you to try:
Go on google and type in "Cop Saves..."

Notice how many hits you get...how many are singular non-duplicated...how many are local affiliates rather than national news.

Then type in "Cop kills.." or "Police violate"...see many times the same stories are duplicated and how many are national news.

I could stay in 7 more years, but I'm getting out in 2. The day I'm eligible I'm out, and a whole shit ton of good veteran LEO's I talk to are saying the same. So, we shall see how bad it gets after that.

 

[Deleted member 113831]

Ok great they had to follow the Kings orders and go out and investigate I acknowledged that, but because you are to stupid to get it I will clarify it for you again. They didn't have to go in her house they could have simply asked her and been on their way, we aren't talking about some child abuse accusation here, we are talking about a kid having a gun on his bedroom wall (which in certain parts of the US where common sense still exist is perfectly legal)

Ha Ha Your a fucking sheep that probably couldn't wipe his own ass without directions.

It is dumb fucks like you who think we need all these "what if" laws .

Enjoy your nanny state sheep!

So, in other words, no matter how ignorant someone with actual knowledge and experience makes you look...you are going to insist on proving that is by no means the end.

 

[Steel+Killer]

So, in other words, no matter how ignorant someone with actual knowledge and experience makes you look...you are going to insist on proving that is by no means the end.

Was it or was it not up to the officers that showed up at the house discretion to enter her home or simply ask a couple questions and be on their way?
If your answer is they had no choice, but to enter her home because that is what their policy mandates then why did they show up without a warrant signed by a judge? I guess they figure most people are going to be sheep and let them in without one, but their are some people that still believe in the 4th amendment.

For the record I am not anti Law Enforcement I think you have to have LE in a modern civilized society to keep law and order, but you don't violate the US Constitution for any reason. Just because some crooked ass politician passed a law that doesn't make it right!

 

[FatBoy]

I think were saying the same thing. It's the policy that is driving this ignorant shit going on these days. The problem is, the police officers are the face of these policies. They are essentially the store front, with the people turning out the product safe in the back insulated from the crap policy they turn out. Then, when policy get someone killed or someone rights shit on the policy makers blame the police. I wouldn't be a peace officer these days. You're facing people pissed about your enforcing of laws some asswipe enacted and then get no backup from said asswipe when shit goes wrong as a result of enforcing these policies.



I'm not sure what the answer is, but I am sure it's going to get worse before it gets better.

 

[ken226]

In reading that link, she said "they were nice". There was no mention of the police entering forcibly. She obviously permitted them entry. Permitted means allowed, or with permission. I saw no mention of force, or coercion. The article says that she said that the police said "we're here to search". How accurate is this she-said / they said? So what was her reply? Come in, or no you can't come in? Big difference.

Are you guys implying that they somehow tricked her into giving permission? If so, how? Be specific in this particular circumstance. Don't guess.

So, it seams that some here are saying, even when permitted entry by the homeowner, the police shouldn't be allowed inside?

Sure, the school officials involved here are morons. But some of you guys really expect the police to ignore a callout? Or to not look around and see what's going on?

If the police did nothing but ask a question from the front porch, and the following day the kid shoots up a school, how many of you would be calling for those cops to be fired or worse?

A question for Palmettopride. So, by the police showing up, being permitted entry, looking around and then leaving, exactly which amendment to the bill of rights was violated?

Just curious. Trying to follow the logic I'm seeing on display by members here. Or, perhaps some are just seeing what they want to see.

 

[W54/XM-388]

In reading that link, she said "they were nice". There was no mention of the police entering forcibly. She obviously permitted them entry. Permitted means allowed, or with permission.
So, it seams that some here are saying, even when permitted entry by the homeowner, the police shouldn't be allowed inside?

Generally speaking little good comes from "letting" the police into your house. ALWAYS say No, but be prepared to get out of the way if they say they are coming in permission or not. It's better usually to try to stay alive and see if you can get redress in civil court or in local politics.

Depending on the situation, you may not even want to open the door unless they have a warrant, just talk to them through the door (preferably from an angle not square up to the door), or step outside and close the door behind you and lock it then talk to them.

Same goes for searching your vehicle or a lot of other things. Always say NO but don't make that the hill you die on if they decide to go on without your permission.

Saying NO very clearly to both entry to your home or to looking in your vehicle can save you a huge amount of trouble later on.

 

[ken226]

Sure. I understand that's the opinion of many, and perhaps what I would do as well.

But we're talking about this specific event, not hypotheticals or our opinions about what she should have done.

Specifically, in this case, what did the police do wrong? Entering when permitted?

So, I understand that you guys think she should have said no. But what -did- she do? Is the implication that the cops were in the wrong here for wanting to look around, even with permission?

 

[Steel+Killer]

A question for Palmettopride. So, by the police showing up, being permitted entry, looking around and then leaving, exactly which amendment to the bill of rights was violated?

You know what I stand corrected in this case there was no violation of the 4th amendment because the homeowner gave them permission to search her home, but if she hadn't then her 4th amendment rights would have been violated with or with out a search warrant IMO. In this case she shouldn't have given them permission to search her home and then go on a rant about how her rights were violated.

If the police did nothing but ask a question from the front porch, and the following day the kid shoots up a school, how many of you would be calling for those cops to be fired or worse.

Ha Ha we can "what if" the shit out of every everyday life scenario there is.

What if she saw the cops coming up and put a BB gun on the wall instead of a actual firearm and then when the cops left she gave her son a real firearm?

What if he stole her car keys and took her car for a joyride and plowed over a crowd?

What if the son was a deranged lunatic and poured gasoline all over the neighbors house and burned them alive?

What if the next time you take a piss you get your dick caught in your zipper?

I know why don't no one be allowed to leave their house because what if something bad happens to them.......LOL

 

[ken226]

"LOL"

I never said "what if". Your not quoting that from anything I posted. That was a "how many?" question. I would no more start a sentence with "what if" than I would "I know". When a person begins a sentence with either of those expressions, it's a strong indicator that something stupid will soon follow.

To answer my own question quoted above, I can only guess, but probably alot more than zero.

As a general rule, when asked a 'what if' question, I try to answer literally. For example, in your question#1 above, my stupid answer to an even stupider question would be: she would probably have a pretty happy kid.

 

[deersniper]

This is police top priority in the time of riots and looting?

fucking wow

Lol. Priority is always keeping the tax slave in line along with fleecing them now and then.

They could give 2 shits about real crime unless it involves .gov or a police officers property.