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Powder unavailability

cuirc

Sergeant of the Hide
Full Member
Minuteman
  • Nov 8, 2023
    230
    90
    Poughkeepsie n. y.
    John Quirk

    [email protected]



    This is an open letter to the Powder Manufacturers.

    A number of powders have been out of stock for an unacceptable period of time. Some popular IMR powders like 4895, 7828, have been unavailable approaching six months others like
    ( I am told) 4955 even longer.

    What is going on? If you look for instance at Powder Valley and sort on IMR powders you will find most are out of stock. Is Hodgeon Powder Company purposely not manufacturing these in favor of their own? Well Hodgeon they aren’t the same!!

    Assuming I am wrong in my insinuation, Hodgeon should make a public statement in the various discipline publications; stating the reason for their delay and a timetable for reintroduction of these important powders
     
    John Quirk

    [email protected]



    This is an open letter to the Powder Manufacturers.

    A number of powders have been out of stock for an unacceptable period of time. Some popular IMR powders like 4895, 7828, have been unavailable approaching six months others like
    ( I am told) 4955 even longer.

    What is going on? If you look for instance at Powder Valley and sort on IMR powders you will find most are out of stock. Is Hodgeon Powder Company purposely not manufacturing these in favor of their own? Well Hodgeon they aren’t the same!!

    Assuming I am wrong in my insinuation, Hodgeon should make a public statement in the various discipline publications; stating the reason for their delay and a timetable for reintroduction of these important powders

    Hodgdon (learn how to spell) doesn't give a shit about your demands.

    Your ignorance is magnificent.
     
    Hodgdon (learn how to spell) doesn't give a shit about your demands.

    Your ignorance is magnificent.
    Hi Gunny: Hodgdon; I cut and pasted this from the internet perhaps you should send them a note too! Hodgdon. But actually you are right. Like I told the chairman of the board of the company I worked for for 31 years, I have a handicap I cant spell. If I could I would have been a History teacher I got a masters in Nuclear engineering because I can't spell. Please don't pick on the handicapped. Furthermore thank God for spell check.
    I don't know why you are not concerned about the powder shortage don't you like to shoot (I doubt it) or maybe your too rich to give a shit what is available and what it costs well fuck o I do.
    Pleasure talking, writing, to you lets do it again, you sound like a nice person
     
    John Quirk

    [email protected]



    This is an open letter to the Powder Manufacturers.

    A number of powders have been out of stock for an unacceptable period of time. Some popular IMR powders like 4895, 7828, have been unavailable approaching six months others like
    ( I am told) 4955 even longer.

    What is going on? If you look for instance at Powder Valley and sort on IMR powders you will find most are out of stock. Is Hodgeon Powder Company purposely not manufacturing these in favor of their own? Well Hodgeon they aren’t the same!!

    Assuming I am wrong in my insinuation, Hodgeon should make a public statement in the various discipline publications; stating the reason for their delay and a timetable for reintroduction of these important powders
    You do realize that all of the IMR Enduron line has been discontinued don't you?
     
    Folks who have taken the time to reply to my call in the wilderness.
    I thought my letter would find some support among re-loaders who are frustrated about the problem getting powder. I guess I just kicked over a nest hornets of Powder Maker Lovers.
    If any of you good people out there think I am right; join in an write a letter too.
     
    I would love to hear your complaints more about powder that has been discontinued for years now. Hodgdon is cleaning up their line of powders and several powders that are redundant will be discontinued. Other powders are just plain hard to find right now like Retumbo.
     
    Thank You for your considered reply I treat people the way they treat me fuck off your self I bet you could bend over and give your self some pleasure.
     
    Brownells, Midway and PV all have at least 90 different smokeless powders in stock. Including powder that's traditionally hard to find, like Varget, H4350 and Retumbo. And with a 10 second search, I found IMR 4955 in stock at two different retailers.

    And Hodgdon has made public statements about the shortage of powder.
     
    Brownells, Midway and PV all have at least 90 different smokeless powders in stock. Including powder that's traditionally hard to find, like Varget, H4350 and Retumbo. And with a 10 second search, I found IMR 4955 in stock at two different retailers.

    And Hodgdon has made public statements about the shortage of powder.
    Thanks Which ones I need some
     
    I would love to hear your complaints more about powder that has been discontinued for years now. Hodgdon is cleaning up their line of powders and several powders that are redundant will be discontinued. Other powders are just plain hard to find right now like Retumbo.
    I hope they clean up the reloading manuals too it would would be nice if they put that out in a good distribution and told us when they will be finished and what powders will be left with adequate reloading data!
     
    • Like
    Reactions: simonp
    Hi Gunny: Hodgdon; I cut and pasted this from the internet perhaps you should send them a note too! Hodgdon. But actually you are right. Like I told the chairman of the board of the company I worked for for 31 years, I have a handicap I cant spell. If I could I would have been a History teacher I got a masters in Nuclear engineering because I can't spell. Please don't pick on the handicapped. Furthermore thank God for spell check.
    I don't know why you are not concerned about the powder shortage don't you like to shoot (I doubt it) or maybe your too rich to give a shit what is available and what it costs well fuck o I do.
    Pleasure talking, writing, to you lets do it again, you sound like a nice person
    P. S. Think I made this comment to the wrong AH Your ass hole is magnificent I have a broom stick that would fit.
     
    John Quirk

    [email protected]



    This is an open letter to the Powder Manufacturers.

    A number of powders have been out of stock for an unacceptable period of time. Some popular IMR powders like 4895, 7828, have been unavailable approaching six months others like
    ( I am told) 4955 even longer.

    What is going on? If you look for instance at Powder Valley and sort on IMR powders you will find most are out of stock. Is Hodgeon Powder Company purposely not manufacturing these in favor of their own? Well Hodgeon they aren’t the same!!

    Assuming I am wrong in my insinuation, Hodgeon should make a public statement in the various discipline publications; stating the reason for their delay and a timetable for reintroduction of these important powders
    To put it plainly to all.... nothing is going to get any better anytime soon and I'll spell it out for you right now...as I'm done with this being beaten to death or blaming powder or ammo makers or bullet makers or primer makers etc... for not making enough stuff.

    Or people on conspiracy stuff and saying the gov't is hoarding/buying up all the ammo so we can't get anything. No truth to it at all and in fact the gov't is out of ammo and powder at times... the stuff simply cannot be made fast enough.

    Also some powders take longer to make.... the powders that have a lower usage.... are not getting made so they can focus on the higher volume/needs type powders etc...that have a higher priority/usage rating... call it what you want.

    Since the year of Covid and riots in 2020 demand for ammo and even for us reloaders.... the industry pretty much has not caught up and will not catch up per se... don't forget in 2020 and 2021 alone there where 13.2 million first time gun buyers/owners... if those 13.2m owners each wanted 100 rounds of even just 9mm ammo.... that comes to 1.32b rounds of ammo if I did my math right.... and no one in the industry could've predicted what was going to happen and have been prepared for it...even if they started ramping up it wouldn't have been enough... so is everyone still tracking here?

    Then the war in Ukraine happened.... unless you are unaware we are shipping everything from 5.56 ammo to tank ammunition to howitzer ammo over there.....

    Then.... the fight in Israel/Gaza happened.....

    Then..... one of three yes only three! Manufacturing plants on this planet that makes nitrocellulose which goes into powder blows up....don't believe me.... read the article...and this is a short one you can look up others....


    So with that plant being offline.... 1/3 of the worlds production is gone right now. The word on the street is at least two more years....

    Oh...by the way a normal 105mm round uses 30# of nitrocellulose in it and our artillery supply for rounds was low before the war in Ukraine even started!

    What I'm hearing is that ammo makers for this year are not going to get all the powder they want.... next year as well. I know places already couldn't get certain types of powder as of last year.

    So I say the trickle down effect goes like this.... military is going to get priority, and then the ammo makers are next on the priority list...anything left over that is available and when it's available will go to us reloaders.

    To top all of this off... I've never seen the amount of emergency requests for ammunition test barrels that I've been seeing since 2020 and there has been no let up.

    So we all need to get a grip on what the reality is.... and it's not good!

    Oh and don't forget all the do gooders over here blocking manufacturing because they say it effects the climate! Not just for powder but for iron, copper and other minerals as well.... so we are relying more and more on imports!

    Happy Tuesday!

    Later, Frank
    Bartlein Barrels
     
    I don't know why you are not concerned about the powder shortage don't you like to shoot (I doubt it) or maybe your too rich to give a shit what is available and what it costs well fuck o I do.

    I don't waste my time on stupid shit like open letters to powder "manufacturers".

    Nobody is going to listen to you. You will achieve nothing.
     
    Last edited:
    • Like
    Reactions: Big Phish
    To put it plainly to all.... nothing is going to get any better anytime soon and I'll spell it out for you right now...as I'm done with this being beaten to death or blaming powder or ammo makers or bullet makers or primer makers etc... for not making enough stuff.

    Or people on conspiracy stuff and saying the gov't is hoarding/buying up all the ammo so we can't get anything. No truth to it at all and in fact the gov't is out of ammo and powder at times... the stuff simply cannot be made fast enough.

    Also some powders take longer to make.... the powders that have a lower usage.... are not getting made so they can focus on the higher volume/needs type powders etc...that have a higher priority/usage rating... call it what you want.

    Since the year of Covid and riots in 2020 demand for ammo and even for us reloaders.... the industry pretty much has not caught up and will not catch up per se... don't forget in 2020 and 2021 alone there where 13.2 million first time gun buyers/owners... if those 13.2m owners each wanted 100 rounds of even just 9mm ammo.... that comes to 1.32b rounds of ammo if I did my math right.... and no one in the industry could've predicted what was going to happen and have been prepared for it...even if they started ramping up it wouldn't have been enough... so is everyone still tracking here?

    Then the war in Ukraine happened.... unless you are unaware we are shipping everything from 5.56 ammo to tank ammunition to howitzer ammo over there.....

    Then.... the fight in Israel/Gaza happened.....

    Then..... one of three yes only three! Manufacturing plants on this planet that makes nitrocellulose which goes into powder blows up....don't believe me.... read the article...and this is a short one you can look up others....


    So with that plant being offline.... 1/3 of the worlds production is gone right now. The word on the street is at least two more years....

    Oh...by the way a normal 105mm round uses 30# of nitrocellulose in it and our artillery supply for rounds was low before the war in Ukraine even started!

    What I'm hearing is that ammo makers for this year are not going to get all the powder they want.... next year as well. I know places already couldn't get certain types of powder as of last year.

    So I say the trickle down effect goes like this.... military is going to get priority, and then the ammo makers are next on the priority list...anything left over that is available and when it's available will go to us reloaders.

    To top all of this off... I've never seen the amount of emergency requests for ammunition test barrels that I've been seeing since 2020 and there has been no let up.

    So we all need to get a grip on what the reality is.... and it's not good!

    Oh and don't forget all the do gooders over here blocking manufacturing because they say it effects the climate! Not just for powder but for iron, copper and other minerals as well.... so we are relying more and more on imports!

    Happy Tuesday!

    Later, Frank
    Bartlein Barrels

    @Frank Green is the reason I have north of 150lbs of powder stocked up (including more than 30 of RL 26 - I'm getting nervous there, as I'm down from my high of 45lbs!)

    Back in the October before Ukraine started, when PMing about/ordering a barrel, he gave me cryptic advice to stock up on everything reloading related. Not that I needed too much prodding given the pandemic had made stuff scarce, but this, combined with a few acquaintances in the military telling me "something is up" made me really take it to heart. I bought up every bit of powder I could find that I regularly loaded, regardless of price (yes, I paid the Gunbroker tax on quite a few lbs and on not an insignificant number of primers and bullets). I actually drove three hours up to Reno because a "local" store had 6 lbs of RL26 - only 2 remained by the time I arrived. At least it's a nice drive...

    Today, I don't fret about component availability, as I can look up as I write this and gaze into my closet where I have ~15k primers, a bunch of powder, and not enough support on the shelves to carry the weight of all my bullets.

    Thanks Frank! (though my bank account does not like you)

    TL: DR When Frank talks, listen.
     
    To put it plainly to all.... nothing is going to get any better anytime soon and I'll spell it out for you right now...as I'm done with this being beaten to death or blaming powder or ammo makers or bullet makers or primer makers etc... for not making enough stuff.

    Or people on conspiracy stuff and saying the gov't is hoarding/buying up all the ammo so we can't get anything. No truth to it at all and in fact the gov't is out of ammo and powder at times... the stuff simply cannot be made fast enough.

    Also some powders take longer to make.... the powders that have a lower usage.... are not getting made so they can focus on the higher volume/needs type powders etc...that have a higher priority/usage rating... call it what you want.

    Since the year of Covid and riots in 2020 demand for ammo and even for us reloaders.... the industry pretty much has not caught up and will not catch up per se... don't forget in 2020 and 2021 alone there where 13.2 million first time gun buyers/owners... if those 13.2m owners each wanted 100 rounds of even just 9mm ammo.... that comes to 1.32b rounds of ammo if I did my math right.... and no one in the industry could've predicted what was going to happen and have been prepared for it...even if they started ramping up it wouldn't have been enough... so is everyone still tracking here?

    Then the war in Ukraine happened.... unless you are unaware we are shipping everything from 5.56 ammo to tank ammunition to howitzer ammo over there.....

    Then.... the fight in Israel/Gaza happened.....

    Then..... one of three yes only three! Manufacturing plants on this planet that makes nitrocellulose which goes into powder blows up....don't believe me.... read the article...and this is a short one you can look up others....


    So with that plant being offline.... 1/3 of the worlds production is gone right now. The word on the street is at least two more years....

    Oh...by the way a normal 105mm round uses 30# of nitrocellulose in it and our artillery supply for rounds was low before the war in Ukraine even started!

    What I'm hearing is that ammo makers for this year are not going to get all the powder they want.... next year as well. I know places already couldn't get certain types of powder as of last year.

    So I say the trickle down effect goes like this.... military is going to get priority, and then the ammo makers are next on the priority list...anything left over that is available and when it's available will go to us reloaders.

    To top all of this off... I've never seen the amount of emergency requests for ammunition test barrels that I've been seeing since 2020 and there has been no let up.

    So we all need to get a grip on what the reality is.... and it's not good!

    Oh and don't forget all the do gooders over here blocking manufacturing because they say it effects the climate! Not just for powder but for iron, copper and other minerals as well.... so we are relying more and more on imports!

    Happy Tuesday!

    Later, Frank
    Bartlein Barrels
    Hmmm so..

    Manufacturing hasn’t caught up with demand

    Increasing capacity is revenue intensive and nearly impossible

    Larger orders and larger business partners take precedence over some guy in his basement

    And what does trickle down is at a higher price

    It’s almost like economics 101…


    See I think Biden started the war in Ukraine knowing that the capacity needed would make civilian inventory vanish so less people would buy guns making it easier to come take them….

    conspiracy!!!!!
    Grassy knoll!!!
    Burn the rich!!!!
     
    Last edited:
    Hmmm so..

    Manufacturing hasn’t caught up with demand

    Increasing capacity is revenue intensive and nearly impossible

    Larger orders and larger business partners take precedence over some guy in his basement

    And what does trickle down is at a higher price

    It’s almost like economics 101…


    See I think Biden started the war in Ukraine knowing that the capacity needed would make civilian inventory vanish so less people would not buy guns making it easier to come take them….

    conspiracy!!!!!
    Grassy knoll!!!
    Burn the rich!!!!
    Amen I wish more of the above reacted as you did but I love a good controversy
     
    To put it plainly to all.... nothing is going to get any better anytime soon and I'll spell it out for you right now...as I'm done with this being beaten to death or blaming powder or ammo makers or bullet makers or primer makers etc... for not making enough stuff.

    Or people on conspiracy stuff and saying the gov't is hoarding/buying up all the ammo so we can't get anything. No truth to it at all and in fact the gov't is out of ammo and powder at times... the stuff simply cannot be made fast enough.

    Also some powders take longer to make.... the powders that have a lower usage.... are not getting made so they can focus on the higher volume/needs type powders etc...that have a higher priority/usage rating... call it what you want.

    Since the year of Covid and riots in 2020 demand for ammo and even for us reloaders.... the industry pretty much has not caught up and will not catch up per se... don't forget in 2020 and 2021 alone there where 13.2 million first time gun buyers/owners... if those 13.2m owners each wanted 100 rounds of even just 9mm ammo.... that comes to 1.32b rounds of ammo if I did my math right.... and no one in the industry could've predicted what was going to happen and have been prepared for it...even if they started ramping up it wouldn't have been enough... so is everyone still tracking here?

    Then the war in Ukraine happened.... unless you are unaware we are shipping everything from 5.56 ammo to tank ammunition to howitzer ammo over there.....

    Then.... the fight in Israel/Gaza happened.....

    Then..... one of three yes only three! Manufacturing plants on this planet that makes nitrocellulose which goes into powder blows up....don't believe me.... read the article...and this is a short one you can look up others....


    So with that plant being offline.... 1/3 of the worlds production is gone right now. The word on the street is at least two more years....

    Oh...by the way a normal 105mm round uses 30# of nitrocellulose in it and our artillery supply for rounds was low before the war in Ukraine even started!

    What I'm hearing is that ammo makers for this year are not going to get all the powder they want.... next year as well. I know places already couldn't get certain types of powder as of last year.

    So I say the trickle down effect goes like this.... military is going to get priority, and then the ammo makers are next on the priority list...anything left over that is available and when it's available will go to us reloaders.

    To top all of this off... I've never seen the amount of emergency requests for ammunition test barrels that I've been seeing since 2020 and there has been no let up.

    So we all need to get a grip on what the reality is.... and it's not good!

    Oh and don't forget all the do gooders over here blocking manufacturing because they say it effects the climate! Not just for powder but for iron, copper and other minerals as well.... so we are relying more and more on imports!

    Happy Tuesday!

    Later, Frank
    Bartlein Barrels
    Thank You for putting my observations in prospective
     
    • Like
    Reactions: Frank Green
    I don't waste my time on stupid shit like open letters to powder "manufacturers".

    Nobody is going to listen to you. You will achieve nothing.
    Hay gunny I may not have achieved anything but I like Frank of Bartlein Barrels he did a great analyses of the issue. But I think I provided something for some folks to do this am.
    Have a good day
     
    Hmmm so..

    Manufacturing hasn’t caught up with demand

    Increasing capacity is revenue intensive and nearly impossible

    Larger orders and larger business partners take precedence over some guy in his basement

    And what does trickle down is at a higher price

    It’s almost like economics 101…


    See I think Biden started the war in Ukraine knowing that the capacity needed would make civilian inventory vanish so less people would not buy guns making it easier to come take them….

    conspiracy!!!!!
    Grassy knoll!!!
    Burn the rich!!!!

    To be fair prices would go down if people didn't impulse buy everything in sight. It's only starting to get normal again.
     
    To be fair prices would go down if people didn't impulse buy everything in sight. It's only starting to get normal again.

    I think it's as much the scalpers than anything else. Too easy for them to get notified of a release, buy up all the inventory, then screw the general consumer.
     
    • Like
    Reactions: Big Phish
    This being an election year, plus Gaza, and UA bullshit still going on it's only going to get worse.
     
    • Like
    Reactions: DubfromGA
    It's only starting to get normal again.
    Maybe in 3 years time frame from what I'm hearing/seeing.

    read my post #32.

    I'll add VV powder is a little more available.

    Guys we make ammunition test barrels even for the powder makers... usually I can order powder direct and I haven't been able to order anything direct for the last about 1.5 years.
     
    My sister in law is bi-polar......clearly for those that don't know the OP is as well. you can spot it a mile away.

    On the one hand I feel bad. On the other hand the OP likely just stopped taking their meds recently. I honestly wish there was a way to help these people. I mean this sincerely.
     
    John Quirk

    [email protected]



    This is an open letter to the Powder Manufacturers.

    A number of powders have been out of stock for an unacceptable period of time. Some popular IMR powders like 4895, 7828, have been unavailable approaching six months others like
    ( I am told) 4955 even longer.

    What is going on? If you look for instance at Powder Valley and sort on IMR powders you will find most are out of stock. Is Hodgeon Powder Company purposely not manufacturing these in favor of their own? Well Hodgeon they aren’t the same!!

    Assuming I am wrong in my insinuation, Hodgeon should make a public statement in the various discipline publications; stating the reason for their delay and a timetable for reintroduction of these important powders

    L. O. L.

    You do realize that reloading is a secondary market for these manufacturers, right? At what point would you as a businessman neglect your primary contracts to pander to a niche clientele?

    If you really expected to make something happen this would be an open letter to the stupid mother f-ers in the govt that have us handicapped and at the mercy of the global market and economy that is hamstrung feeding multiple wars at the moment.

    1709667194652.gif