Question about Syria

[Pok]

Today there is chatter about a Russian fighter harassing a US spy plane over Syria.

Given that we're not at war with Syria, and we've never been invited by the Syrian govt, aren't we there illegally? Aren't we the ones provoking?

Tell me I'm wrong if I am. I just don't understand all the complaints if we're the ones in the wrong.

If Syrian planes were flying over the US we'd likely shoot them down

 

[Maggot]

Look at a map of the area. we're just doing the Israeli's bidding.

 

[Bigfatcock]

Fuck syria.

 

[Maggot]

Fuck syria.

You'd fuck everything else, why not.

 

[acudaowner]

there are beautiful women all around the world , even in Syria

like a box of fine chocolate you never know what your going to get until you unwrap it .

 

[UKDslayer]

Today there is chatter about a Russian fighter harassing a US spy plane over Syria.

Given that we're not at war with Syria, and we've never been invited by the Syrian govt, aren't we there illegally? Aren't we the ones provoking?

Hegemony means you can be anywhere and you can always manufacture a reason to be there. Whether its morally right to be there depends if you have morals.

 

[Fig]

We are in conflict with ISIS/ISL/Caliphate/etc. They have been routed from Iraq and are trying to take shelter in the middle of war torn Syria. We are running constant drone strikes against them wherever they are. They are monstrous religious fanatics who murder or enslave any non-Caliphate person. These are the people Obama let blossom into The Islamic State, and that Trump prosecuted rigorously and sent the majority of them to Hell. I think it's pretty rag tag at this point, but they are the 2020s equivalent of Al Queda. We simply don't want them running around as they are the heart of Fundamentalist Islamic Movement at the moment. Every time we kill one of the them world becomes a better place. IMO this is the correct way to fight them. Get intel-send drone-blow them all to hell.

The vast majority of Syrians hate them. Turkey hates them. Assad and his army hate them. The Russians hate them. We hate them. Assad and the Russians may not like us, but they know who we are killing, and they approve.

Most of the Syrians I know that are here (expatriates or citizens) side with Assad against "The Beards". They would support the Syrian rebels who wanted to overthrow Assad, but they have been shattered by the Syrians and the Russians to a degree where they have no fieldable force left. It is likely that what's left of the rebels have thrown in with the Caliphate, because they are their only possible allies. Both are pretty spent. Whether that's true or not it's what the Russians and Assad have been saying. I think in the final analysis that Syrians have decided that they vastly prefer peace under a brutal dictator to, what has basically become, a five way civil war.

I totally disagree that Israel has much to do with it. Remember, before all this shit went down Syria had just started having open trade with both Turkey and Israel. There were articles about how Syria was booming, and it all ended in about a month. QED.

 

[simpletoms]

Broad brush strokes…. A lot of little details got us to this point.

When the Syrian Civil War was gaining steam for the Free Syrians, Bashar Al Assad pulled troop out of the east end of Syria to help defend his enclave in the west. That void enable ISIS/ISIL to operate with impunity along the Euphrates river valley. That lead to US Operations in Syria as it was destabilizing Iraq (along with Iran’s influence). I‘m sure that we have some thin legal reason to operate within the region. Look up CJTF-OIR… But you‘re not wrong. We are uninvited. Ostensibly, Russia is there at the request of the Syrians. We are not. That’s why we’re not pushing back violently against these “Russian aggressions”. Syria is a mess. There’s no exit plan, and everyone has a different agenda. Just go to wikipedia and look at the number of belligerents involved in the Syrian Civil War.

 

[Fig]

Hegemony means you can be anywhere and you can always manufacture a reason to be there. Whether its morally right to be there depends if you have morals.

That's some sort of bullshit leftist opinion. You could say that if we were overthrowing Assad and trying to turn Syria into a Constitutional Republic. We are not even close to being the dominant state in that region. We don't have anywhere close to a hegemony. We are killing Muslim religious fanatics, full stop. Assad and Putin are also killing them. The only people who don't want them dead are their fellow fanatics.

 

[Fig]

Broad brush strokes…. A lot of little details got us to this point.

When the Syrian Civil War was gaining steam for the Free Syrians, Bashar Al Assad pulled troop out of the east end of Syria to help defend his enclave in the west. That void enable ISIS/ISIL to operate with impunity along the Euphrates river valley. That lead to US Operations in Syria as it was destabilizing Iraq (along with Iran’s influence). I‘m sure that we have some thin legal reason to operate within the region. Look up CJTF-OIR… But you‘re not wrong. We are uninvited. Ostensibly, Russia is there at the request of the Syrians. We are not. That’s why we’re not pushing back violently against these “Russian aggressions”. Syria is a mess. There’s no exit plan, and everyone has a different agenda. Just go to wikipedia and look at the number of belligerents involved in the Syrian Civil War.

I'd go you one further, and say we really aren't involved in the conflict in any official capacity. We're kind of circling the conflict picking off the worst ones. I'm sure there's a ton of CIA type shit going on. I think we probably dabbled in the Free Syrian Army at the beginning, but that is ancient history at this point. There are no good guys. There is no one to side with against Assad or the Russians. There are still people worthy of a drone strike though...

 

[Maggot]

There are still people worthy of a drone strike though...

As like maps, would you say there are some much closer to home?

 

[LawnMM]

Is Syria a part of Russia? Your logic is a little flawed

 

[DocRDS]

what part of "spy" plane in confusing to you OP

 

[GreenGO Juan]

Is Syria a part of Russia? Your logic is a little flawed

The Assads have been supported by Russia since the 1960's. They have a Naval base there. And are there at the request of the Assads. Which since then have basically been at war with Israel.

The US and Nato forces, on the other hand are not there at the request of the Assads but they can't keep us out.

Also Its interesting that no one has mentioned Iran, Saudi, Jordan the UAE, Turkish and others influence in the country.

This all ties back to the forever wars, Arab spring, Iraq, Libya and Ukraine. The west trying to push Moscow's influence out of these regions. World domination shit, control of trade and a rapidly expanding China

 

[lariat]

This may be the reason.

Russia, Iran coordinating to expel US troops from Syria: Report

The US army has been reinforcing its occupation in Syria over the past few months

new.thecradle.co

 

[Pok]

what part of "spy" plane in confusing to you OP

Not confused by that concept at all.

What I found confusing is us complaining that it was being harassed. Of course it's being harassed, it's not supposed to be there from the standpoint of the Syrian govt.

I don't think they have the balls to shoot it down, but if they did would they be wrong?

If you're behaving aggressively, you expect people to respond aggressively

 

[W54/XM-388]

The short story on Syria

We tried to overthrow probably the least oppressive of all the middle eastern governments because the British wanted to run an oil pipeline cheap and get cheap oil without paying market prices.

We spent a couple billion dollars arming some of the worst people on the planet to murder and genocide Christians, Muslims and others, because well who cares about how many millions dead it takes to get our puppet government put in place.

Millions of people had their lives destroyed, hundreds of thousands were killed and Europe was flooded with very angry, irate refugees.

Eventually Russia had enough of our "Arab spring" nonsense and started going whole hog killing the monsters we funded (much to the anger of McStain).

Then the USA had to pretend not to be on the side of ISIS while still trying to bomb Syrian and Russian stuff "oopsy" to try to drag it out.

Now the US has a small invasion force left in the north, to make sure Turkey and other USA allies can steal all the oil in the region and get rich while some corrupt puppet types that call themselves Kurds are being supposedly "protected" by the USA (but of course the USA won't protect those same folks when the Turks come rolling in to kill them).

So we are occupying yet another country illegally (but we don't care because we are the superpower), so that we can plunder their wealth, enrich corrupt elites and have our hands in more power plays and of course keep the middle east a mess so nobody can get ahead.

Before the USA came in and messed everything up, Syria had pretty much the most freedom of religion of any of the arab countries.

 

[Pok]

Btw I agree with fuck Syria

 

[rtB]

If you remember what Benghazi was about, arms from Libya were being shuffled to 'moderate head choppers' in Syria to overthrow the democratically elected government of Assad. McCain and his girlfriend Lindsey were over there supporting these good 'mostly peaceful' head chopper folks with arms and training. I'm sure our government had good intentions, but somehow all those arms ended up with the other 'not so moderate' groups of head choppers. Meanwhile Syrian oil was being loaded on trucks and driven to Turkey, where they refined it, put it on Tanker ships (which were owned by Erdogan's son's oddly enough) and shipped down the coast to Israel. But this was all OK according to our "International Rules Based Order". Ever since then the US has occupied Northeast Syria (where the oil is). But of course oil has nothing to do with it, we're protecting democracy and freedom.

 

[LeftyJason]

That's some sort of bullshit leftist opinion. You could say that if we were overthrowing Assad and trying to turn Syria into a Constitutional Republic. We are not even close to being the dominant state in that region. We don't have anywhere close to a hegemony. We are killing Muslim religious fanatics, full stop. Assad and Putin are also killing them. The only people who don't want them dead are their fellow fanatics.

I don't think that that is @UKDslayer opinion I think she was espousing the governments opinion of why we can be there.

 

[sirhrmechanic]

there are beautiful women all around the world , even in Syria

like a box of fine chocolate you never know what your going to get until you unwrap it .

FIFY. These ones don’t explode randomly.

Sirhr

 

[Bigfatcock]

View attachment 8185503

FIFY. These ones don’t explode randomly.

Sirhr

 

[Fig]

Obviously I’m the only one in this thread who doesn’t think the USA is a hegemony or playing four dimensional chess for world domination. I think we have a bunch of extremely stupid and corrupt politicians and three letter agency heads who are blundering and fumbling forward in the dark because they can’t see past their own biases and politics. If the result of that fecklessness is drone striking Caliphatards in lawless lands I’ll take it. Both the Syrians and Russians suck at killing these idiots. We’re pretty good at it. We’ve had more practice.

 

[Seymour Fish]

The short story on Syria

We tried to overthrow probably the least oppressive of all the middle eastern governments because the British wanted to run an oil pipeline cheap and get cheap oil without paying market prices.

We spent a couple billion dollars arming some of the worst people on the planet to murder and genocide Christians, Muslims and others, because well who cares about how many millions dead it takes to get our puppet government put in place.

Millions of people had their lives destroyed, hundreds of thousands were killed and Europe was flooded with very angry, irate refugees.

Eventually Russia had enough of our "Arab spring" nonsense and started going whole hog killing the monsters we funded (much to the anger of McStain).

Then the USA had to pretend not to be on the side of ISIS while still trying to bomb Syrian and Russian stuff "oopsy" to try to drag it out.

Now the US has a small invasion force left in the north, to make sure Turkey and other USA allies can steal all the oil in the region and get rich while some corrupt puppet types that call themselves Kurds are being supposedly "protected" by the USA (but of course the USA won't protect those same folks when the Turks come rolling in to kill them).

So we are occupying yet another country illegally (but we don't care because we are the superpower), so that we can plunder their wealth, enrich corrupt elites and have our hands in more power plays and of course keep the middle east a mess so nobody can get ahead.

Before the USA came in and messed everything up, Syria had pretty much the most freedom of religion of any of the arab countries.

Exactly.

 

[GreenGO Juan]

Obviously I’m the only one in this thread who doesn’t think the USA is a hegemony or playing four dimensional chess for world domination. I think we have a bunch of extremely stupid and corrupt politicians and three letter agency heads who are blundering and fumbling forward in the dark because they can’t see past their own biases and politics. If the result of that fecklessness is drone striking Caliphatards in lawless lands I’ll take it. Both the Syrians and Russians suck at killing these idiots. We’re pretty good at it. We’ve had more practice.

IDK they did stop the Western backed rebels from toppling Assad. And destroyed a couple of cities doing it. Our media spent years selling the world on Russian's brutality in Syria. While ignoring that we were supporting the violent uprising.





The coup in Syria failed.

In fact the power vacuum created by the blundering fumbling forward types, of the local powers Iraq Syria Libya etc, is what led to the lawlessness and instability, if you don't think its part of their plan for domination of the world, you haven't been paying attention. And they are pissed, the Russian's got their shit back together enough since the collapse of the Union to actually challenge them. Looking for a reason to kick over China's sand castle before they get any stronger.

 

[GreenGO Juan]

 

[Im2bent]

c'mon man.........

 

[GreenGO Juan]

Look at Russian Hydrocarbon production in 1989 and the years before and then watch what happens in the 90's, then note what happens when Putin comes to power.

You will see why he is a Threat...

 

[DocRDS]

Not confused by that concept at all.

What I found confusing is us complaining that it was being harassed. Of course it's being harassed, it's not supposed to be there from the standpoint of the Syrian govt.

I don't think they have the balls to shoot it down, but if they did would they be wrong?

If you're behaving aggressively, you expect people to respond aggressively

But Syria wasn't harassing it....

Russia was.

Yes I am totally aware of the folly of "Stop your illegal moves on our illegal spyplane" (note we did not protest USSR shooting down U2s)
Perhaps the UN will send us a sternly worded letter.

The whole thing is a fustercluck, but when have the rules ever applied to anyone of import.

 

[Mr.BR]

Syria is about doing Israel's bidding , like Iraq was till it wasn't in GWOT aside from Afghanistan most $ was spent on fighting Israel's potential enemies.

The uprising in Syria was no more spontaneus than that in Libya . It was a regime change op and west+ GCC pushed a massive effort to overthrow Assad.Till Ukraine it was the world's most financed and supplied insurgency.

At present, US maintains a presence at Syrian oil and wheat fields , and All Tanf border crossing with Iraq and CESAR act is specifically designed to prevent a rebuild of Syria, its basically an extermination project . Also present are the French with a couple of illegal bases and air patrol of their own (Syria used to be French colony a they still think they deserve a say in what goes on there)

In the past, some might claim US is there for the Kurds given how much PR Kurds got at the time,if it wasn't for the fact that Turks a NATO ally have a pretty free hand to ethnically cleanse Northern Syria (Rojava) that was mostly Kurdish. and settle jihadis including AQ(the settlers were brought from Libya as well) in their place instead . Turkey is keeping an occupation force in Northern Syria to prevent Kurds living near their border.

To this day illegal occupation is still primarily about doing Israels bidding, limiting Iranian influence near Israel's borders and preventing resurgence of Syria as a nationstate. It has nothing to do with ISIS if anything they are likely being keept on life support to 'justfy' presence . Whatever is left of ISIS would have long ago been moped up by Syrians and their allies


These moderate beheaders even got an Oscar, and Holypedowood was fawning over them as much as they are over Zelensky , funny enough after the project wound down the British founder of the said group was suicided to tie up loose ends

Off course who could forget the last hospital that was front page news like weekly for a year or so . Who knew Syria had so many hospitals.