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Range Incident

Cozmo

Private
Full Member
Minuteman
Mar 20, 2013
29
0
Tyler, Texas
I had a very unusual incident happen yesterday at the range. I was shooting at the 100 yard range with several other people. To my left, and at the end bench was a couple shooting a rifle. I only saw the woman shooting. The rifle was strapped into a rest with rubber feet. I waited to post my target while I waited I noticed that each time she shot the gun the rest assembly moved towards the rear 1/2 inch to an inch. Coupled with the movement of the gun due to recoil was the woman's extremely poor shooting position. She was shooting right handed, while kneeling in a chair, and sitting on her right foot. She was hunched over the gun giving the impression she was left eye dominant. She was wearing a baseball style hat and plastic sunglasses. I shot a round of 5 and was setting up for my next set when the incident happened.

I know this is a long-winded scenario but I need to write it out in case I mention something important that I have overlooked.

The next thing that happened was a shot was fired behind me. The report was not normal, being somewhat muffled. At the same time debris seemed to rain down around behind me, some hitting my back and left arm as I was setting up. I looked up trying to find the cause of the muffled report and source of the debris.

What I saw was the woman still over the gun with what appeared to be 3-4 bloody spots on her face.

I suspected she had been scoped badly. I stood and faced her. She stood and faced me. Where her husband/boyfriend was, I don't know. I was looking for the source of the blood around her right eye. None was there, but almost immediately a large amount of blood began coming from her mouth.

I told her to remove her hat and sunglasses, looking for the source of the blood. It was not from her eye. Everything seemed to be coming from her mouth. It was all down the front of her shirt. About this time the husband/boyfriend appeared and began efforts to stem the flow of blood.

I turned my attention to the gun. It was a black, bolt-action gun. Someone at the range stated that it was a Howa 7mm. I cannot confirm this. A gentleman tried to lift the bolt of the gun but it was frozen and jammed. It appeared to be closed. I could not determine where the debris came from until someone mentioned that the bottom of the gun had been blown off. Sure enough, the plastic magazine had been demolished. It simply was gone.

The site was quickly policed and all gear placed in the car and the woman was quickly taken to the hospital.

How could this have happened? The trigger could not have been engaged or fired without a closed bolt. But how do you get the obvious blow-back down through the magazine that obviously destroyed the bottom of the gun? Oversize cartridges would not have allowed the bolt to close. Undersized cartridges would not have caused the extreme blow-back down through the magazine. I guess the injuries could have come from the shock wave and flying debris.

Any thoughts about this?
 
Had to be a very hot round.

I had this happen to me with the snipers hide 2009 build. The cone shaped bolt was the issue but gap was able to fix the bolt and chamber
 
What caused her injury? From your description there was trauma to the inside of her mouth? Speculation on the 'muffled' report? Any idea what part failed?
 
Sorry, I lost focus after the first few paragraphs. There are an amazing array of ways people can hurt each other and themselves with a firearm. It isn't worth your worry unless you are trying to bang the woman in question :)

Sent from mobile phone
 
I policed the brass and placed it in the cab of the truck before they left. Wish I had looked at it harder or kept one of the casings. I remember it as being factory but cannot be sure. Is this a common thing? I have been shooting and hunting for 50 years, reloading for 3, and have never even heard, much less seen a "hot" round. However, your explanation would seem to be the only good one I've heard yet.
 
There must have been some trauma to the inside of her mouth. The muffled report must have come from the exhaust of the gases down through the magazine. And the only "failed" part I saw was the total destruction of the magazine. The barrel and action appeared fine, but frozen.

While I wasn't trying, or hoping to bang the woman, I am interested, if only so the same injuries don't happen to me.
 
I dont understand ? If you were trying to bang her you should have been the one to drive her to the hospital. Was this at the hwy 31 range?
 
Is it possible that the barrel got (partially?) obstructed after the previous shot? Just guessing wildly...
 
Range Incident

It's almost impossible for us to say what happened when we were not there.

Did YOU find out what happened?

If not, consider finding out what happened and then telling us, so that this thread can become educational for others instead of a game of twenty questions.
 
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Some rifles vent over pressure down through the magazine well. I would bet it was a Thompson Center ? We had a customer bring one in and the brass had flowed out every crack and crevis . The plastic magazine was long gone.

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Did they have other rifles to mix up ammo? I've seen a tikka 22-250 blown to bits by a 223 round

Howas do vent to mag well. Possibly a hot load or wrong round. From the sound of it they had no idea and should of been better supervised.

Without eyeballing the brass in the chamber or knowing what load it was it's impossible to know for certain. Sounds like the rifle performed as intended and she probably copped shrapnel ricochet off the bench.
 
Eyes are hard to replace so I am glad the blood was coming from her mouth.

(Hope everyone is OK and what really happened is updated)
 
This was a case of a double feed. I saw this with a Mosin Nagant. She did not extract an unfired round and so it was left inside the chamber. She then attempted to chamber another round and when the nose of the bullet impacted the primer of the first round, an out of battery detonation occurred. This is what blew out the bottom of the action and why you got pelted with debris. The debris was powder, brass and whatever else. The impact to her mouth was the bolt flying back from the force of the out of battery round.

I hope she is okay and makes a full recovery.
 
The OP indicated the bolt appeared to be closed. I think that would preclude the double-feed theory.

HRF
 
Howa had a recall some time ago stating the rifle could possibly fire a loaded round on a partially closed bolt. Doesn't sound like what happened here as you stated the bolt was frozen. If it did indeed fire before fully locked, I doubt the bolt would still be in the rifle.
 
Howa had a recall some time ago stating the rifle could possibly fire a loaded round on a partially closed bolt. Doesn't sound like what happened here as you stated the bolt was frozen. If it did indeed fire before fully locked, I doubt the bolt would still be in the rifle.

Got a link to a recall notice for that one? There was a possible barrel torque issue recall but haven't seen or heard of that one before.
 
Of course we are all speculating as to what happened. It would be helpful to know what went wrong so we could all learn from it. My wife thinks I have a morbid sense of curiosity, but when tragedy strikes I like to know every detail so I might avoid it. So if you could follow up that would help all of us. It could have been bad ammo. While I think it is difficult to destroy a modern bolt gun, CBC did have some old lots of 7.62 that ruined some guns. I once had a box of 9mm that had a few uber hot rounds. I should have stopped shooting and thrown the ammo away, but youth and the idea that I had just parted with some hard earned cash got in the way of reason. When one round sent the slide back so hard I thought the impact would crack the frame of my 226, and then found that the extractor had been blown out of the slide, I decided to trash the remaining rounds.

It's terrible she got hurt, and it could have been much worse. I also think it's sad to make light of her injuries the the banging her comments.
 
I'm curious why the hubby/ friend did not fire that rifle. Were any of the spent casings saved for inspection ant to check for head separations or even if they were handloads. That mighta been helpful.
 
Sounds an awful lot like a kaboom. It happens.

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Who has an obviously newbie female shooter pulling the trigger on a 7mm (mag?) ? Even in a rest... Sheesh, people....

All newbie females I train I start with a 22rf AR-15 suppressed.
 
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Howa had a recall some time ago stating the rifle could possibly fire a loaded round on a partially closed bolt. Doesn't sound like what happened here as you stated the bolt was frozen. If it did indeed fire before fully locked, I doubt the bolt would still be in the rifle.

Unless her mouth stopped the bolt?
 
Here's what happened.....SHIT

Report back your actual findings...as Graham said, we can't tell you what happened - we weren't there.
Were there any RSO's there on site supervising the range?
 
Howas have a series of gas relief holes on the underside of the bolt when in battery. Sounds like the holes did their job, and directed the gas downward. Who knows what caused the excess pressure in the first place.
 
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The above is a Thompson center that let go . See the brass around the bolt ?

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It sounds like the rear of the shell case ruptured and allowed the escaping gases to exit the least resistance place which was in the magazine area. Many years ago I had the exact same thing happen to me while shooting a FN FAL with new ammo. The case cracked in the extractor groove and the gas blew the magazine out of the gun and opened it like a 6"x6" piece of sheetmetal. The magazine spring caught me in the face along with a piece of brass sliver in my nose and the pressure around my head area felt like someone punched me in the face. Even though my nose was bleeding I declined to get medical treatment, but notified the Mfg. of what happened and they issued a UPS pickup of the remaining ammo including the ruptured case, they were very concerned with my injury and wanted to know if I had to be treated. They got back to me in less then 10 days and told me the brass shells had a Mfg. defect and asked me what I wanted to make it right, I told them I only wanted a replacement magazine which I got several weeks later along with 6 box's of 308 ammo. Shit does happen occasionally.
 
$10 she had her tongue sticking out the corner of her mouth and just before she shit her pants she bit the damn thing in half. That is the source of the blood...
 
Who thinks her man was trying to "OFF" her with a HOT load? maybe a little or a lot Unique instead of 62grs H4831sc, where in the hell was he all this time while she was shooting, and shooting in a poor position at that? hmmmmmm
 
How is a case-head separation the fault of the shooter, or an example of natural selection?

How do you know its case head sep?

How do you know the person wasn't using reloads?
How do you know the person wasn't using the wrong ammo?
How do you know if the person got a squib and then shot the next round?

A new shooter, who apparantley does not know what they are doing doing something stupid is more likley than a round going Kaboom of a catostophic rifle failure.
I am just betting the odds here.
 
How do you know its case head sep?

How do you know the person wasn't using reloads?
How do you know the person wasn't using the wrong ammo?
How do you know if the person got a squib and then shot the next round?

And yet your inability to answer those questions certainly didn't preclude you from reaching the conclusion that the shooter somehow is at fault and deserves to be the victim of natural selection. But that wouldn't have been as much fun as selected the crudest possible response, eh?

BTW, the stuck bolt and destroyed magazine are two clues as to what happened.

A new shooter, who apparantley does not know what they are doing doing something stupid is more likley than a round going Kaboom of a catostophic rifle failure.
I am just betting the odds here.

Overpressure events aren't exactly rare, so I think you're betting on the wrong odds. The likelihood that the shooter could have found a way to screw up in such a fashion as to cause a rifle to blow up is pretty low.
 
Who has an obviously newbie female shooter pulling the trigger on a 7mm (mag?) ? Even in a rest... Sheesh, people....

All newbie females I train I start with a 22rf AR-15 suppressed.

Excellent question. I hate seeing newbies man or woman forced to shoot a shoulder crusher for their first experience. It's stupid.