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Range Report Range results: Jumping 155s and Jamming 208s

M

MontanaMarine

MGySgt, Ret.
Full Member
Minuteman
Dec 9, 2001
2,236
518
63
Canyon Ferry, MT
Was out getting in some trigger time yesterday.

Using Frank's 10-shot standard has me rethinking 208s over W760 in a 1/12 factory barrel. 208s were pretty tight with 44.5gr RL15 in the past, out to 1100+ yards. I've been messing around with W760 to eek out more velocity, but accuracy went to shit.

155 Scenars on the other hand, performed as usual, very good. A little lateral spread, but wind conditions were a factor.

Tossed in some Portugese milsurp. It sucked ass, as always.

Conditions; 35F, 10-20 mph wind from 7 o'clock, 4500' el.

Rifle:
Rem 700 VS factory bbl, cut to 20.5"
VXIII 2.5-8x36 glass, duplex reticle, M1s
HTG handle

Loads:

308 Win
208 AMax, moly'd
49.0gr W760
CCI200
Win brass
3.00" OAL (touching lands)
2500 fps

308 Win
155 Scenar, moly'd
45.0gr AA2230
CCI 200
Win brass
2.80" OAL (jumping about .25")
2820 fps

Here's some 100 yard 10-shot groups:
Picture009.jpg


308208_155100yds.jpg


After shooting the paper, I went out to 1070 yards (lased) on a prominent rock. 208 needed 40.5 moa el and 3 moa windage, 155s needed 37.5 moa el and 5 moa windage.

The scope in the Talleys has 41.5 moa useable from 100 yd zero, so It was about used up. I need to do a ladder test with this scope, these loads didn't require so much el with the MK4 3.5-10, but it was warmer then too. I was pleasantly surprised that moving this scope from a 20 moa Seekins base, to Talley low LWs, only lost 7 moa of useable elevation. It's been said that the Talleys are generous in the ass, and it does seem so.



 
Re: Range results: Jumping 155s and Jamming 208s

That's a lot of vertical @ 100Y for the 208.
 
Re: Range results: Jumping 155s and Jamming 208s

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MontanaMarine</div><div class="ubbcode-body">After shooting the paper, I went out to 1070 yards (lased) on a prominent rock. 208 needed 40.5 moa el and 3 moa windage, 155s needed 37.5 moa el and 5 moa windage.

The scope in the Talleys has 41.5 moa useable from 100 yd zero, so It was about used up. I need to do a ladder test with this scope, these loads didn't require so much el with the MK4 3.5-10, but it was warmer then too. I was pleasantly surprised that moving this scope from a 20 moa Seekins base, to Talley low LWs, only lost 7 moa of useable elevation. It's been said that the Talleys are generous in the ass, and it does seem so.



</div></div>

Nice post.

May I ask if the elevation needed for the MK4 was 38.5 and 35.75 respectively?? That would be the 5% difference from shooter's moa to true moa.
 
Re: Range results: Jumping 155s and Jamming 208s

That group of 10 on the upper right box is the load data I want just one hole, SMILE.
Great shooting Shane
 
Re: Range results: Jumping 155s and Jamming 208s

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sobrbiker883</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MontanaMarine</div><div class="ubbcode-body">After shooting the paper, I went out to 1070 yards (lased) on a prominent rock. 208 needed 40.5 moa el and 3 moa windage, 155s needed 37.5 moa el and 5 moa windage.

The scope in the Talleys has 41.5 moa useable from 100 yd zero, so It was about used up. I need to do a ladder test with this scope, these loads didn't require so much el with the MK4 3.5-10, but it was warmer then too. I was pleasantly surprised that moving this scope from a 20 moa Seekins base, to Talley low LWs, only lost 7 moa of useable elevation. It's been said that the Talleys are generous in the ass, and it does seem so.



</div></div>

Nice post.

May I ask if the elevation needed for the MK4 was 38.5 and 35.75 respectively?? That would be the 5% difference from shooter's moa to true moa. </div></div>


Good catch, I forgot about that. My calcs off proven LR data with the MK4 were 37.5, and 35.25 respectively. And that was warmer weather (70s vs 30s) so the dots connect pretty well.

I wondered about that factor, but assumed the scopes would both be calibrated the same, given the M1 turrets on the VXIII. But then I'm not well versed on exactly what is changed mechanically in the M1 retrofit.
 
Re: Range results: Jumping 155s and Jamming 208s

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rijndael</div><div class="ubbcode-body">That's a lot of vertical @ 100Y for the 208. </div></div>

It looked even worse at 1070, as splashes were observed. Looked like about 2-3 moa vertical spread downrange, as measured using the inner duplex subtension as a yardstick.
 
Re: Range results: Jumping 155s and Jamming 208s

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Blueboat</div><div class="ubbcode-body">That group of 10 on the upper right box is the load data I want just one hole, SMILE.
Great shooting Shane
</div></div>

That's the super-secret competition/zombie load.......grin
 
Re: Range results: Jumping 155s and Jamming 208s

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BillPrudden</div><div class="ubbcode-body">but but but , I don't understand... How can anyone shoot small 100y groups or anything at all at 1070 with only a 8x scope? Don't you need like 17x minimum?

(Sarcasm)

Nice work and thanks for posting.

Bill </div></div>

Bill, This is my first real crack at 1000+ with this little scope. The thin inner crosswire subtends .3 moa, so it can still bisect a 1 moa target fairly well. For field accuracy, I like not having to fiddle-fuck with the MK4 parallax adjustment. It's on the wrong side for a southpaw and fairly inconvenient to reach in a prone-bipod shooting position. Bullet splashes on rock were easy enough to see, dry dirt should be even easier.
 
Re: Range results: Jumping 155s and Jamming 208s

Good post! Interesting how the groups looks as you don't normally think of jumped bullets grouping better than those on the lands.

Those Scenar's seem to fly pretty flat, I would have thought there would be more of a difference at long range.
 
Re: Range results: Jumping 155s and Jamming 208s

Hey MM. Quick question regarding the M1 turrets you have on that scope. Is your VX III a 1" tube? Can the M1 and M2 turrets be added to 1" tubes or only the 30 mm tubes? Do you know if they would fit on a VX I with the microfit adjustments, or just the scopes with the 1/4" click adjustments?

Nice stick. You ought to bring that one also to Augustis' shoot and ring some steel on the side.
Neal
 
Re: Range results: Jumping 155s and Jamming 208s

Neal,

I'll bring it along too. i was contemplating shooting the course with it, might still, or if not Apr maybe if I make it to the May event.

At any rate, I'll bring it along, with some 155 Scenar loads.

Yes the scope is a 1" tube VX-III 2.5-8x36. I sent it to the Leupold Custom shop to have the M1s installed. I'm not sure about the VX I.

The phone number to the Custom Shop is:

1-800-LEUPOLD, or (503) 526-1400. They were real friendly when I spoke to them. They should have a quick answer.

See you on the 25th, (I'm thinking I shot alongside you and your wife in the Apr 2007 event?).

Shane
 
Re: Range results: Jumping 155s and Jamming 208s

Shane, so what's the verdict on powder with the 208 in the 308? Does R15 give the best velocity and accuracy? I know you've been doing a lot of testing with it. Thanks!
 
Re: Range results: Jumping 155s and Jamming 208s

I had best accuracy with RL15, best velocity with W760.

I've cut my barrel back, but when it was 26", W760 was giving 2550 and 2600 fps with 49.0 and 50.0 gr W760, respectively. At 26", 44.5gr RL15 gave 2520 fps.

I believe at 1/12 twist, my barrel is not optimum. But it's a factory barrel and I wanted to see what is possible.

I'd go 1/10 twist by preference. I suspect twist rate is more critical than powder choice when loading 200+gr bullets in the 308.

 
Re: Range results: Jumping 155s and Jamming 208s

I'd be curious to hear results from anyone shooting 208s or 210s from a Savage 308, given it's 1/10 twist barrel.
 
Re: Range results: Jumping 155s and Jamming 208s

Couldnt seem to get the 155g scenar to fly as well as the heavier 185g scenar with my 24in 1 in 11 twist blaser 308 rifle, groups at 400y were better with the heavier 185 bullet, could this be down to the 1 in 11 twist instead of the favoured 1.in 12-13 recomended for the lighter 155g scenars? my loads were 46.6 n540, lapua brass, cci br, 155g molly scenar, oal 2.870in, with the 185g molly scenar vit 49g n550, lapua brass, cci br, oal 2.850, any thoughts thanks paul.
 
Re: Range results: Jumping 155s and Jamming 208s

My 1/10 twist 30-06 does pretty good with the 155 Scenar at 3000-3100 fps. It typically holds below moa pretty easily for as far as I can do the wind voodoo.
 
Re: Range results: Jumping 155s and Jamming 208s

What do you need to know, Shane. I've shot the Berger 210s out of my Savage a little less than spectacular results. I'm gonna mess with the rifle, not the load. It is the rifles fault.

i have also shot them in the AR10 with the 1 in 11 twist bbl. They stabilize just fine at our altitude. BTW, i was using varget and CCIs somwhere between 40-42 gr.
 
Re: Range results: Jumping 155s and Jamming 208s

Just curious if they would do significantly better at 1/10. That said, they have flown real well at 1/12 with RL15 as the propellant.

Shifting gears a little, I was out with the 30-06 yesterday shooting 208s over 61gr RL22. It loves 'em. 2700 fps via 22.5" bbl. Checked 100yd zero, 5 shots into .5 moa at 100 yards. Shot some come-ups with the MK4 3.5-10x40 M1. Just lasin' and crackin' rocks, getting ready for Augustis' field match on the 25th.

625 yds - 12.0 moa
1000 yds - 26.5 moa
1040 yds - 29.0 moa
1175 yds - 35.0 moa

I'll use this data to tweak a traj table with 25 yd increments from 100-1500 yards. That's about where the scope runs out of legs with 56 moa up available, and retained velocity is calc'ing around 1200 fps.
 
Re: Range results: Jumping 155s and Jamming 208s

Interesting post. I've been wondering about trying some of the 208's in my 308. However, the Bartlein barrel is throated for 175 SMKs. I guess that is one benefit of having a factory Remington barrel with a LONG throat--being able to shoot the heavies seated way out. My lands are at about 2.826", so I would seriously have to reduce my charge weight in order to run the 208's

Looking forward to the Augustus Ranch event. You gonna stay for Sunday too? Can't make Saturday, but will be there with my 308 on Sunday. May drive up Sat pm and camp overnight there. Looking forward to seeing you guys there.
 
Re: Range results: Jumping 155s and Jamming 208s

I'll be heading for home sometime Saturday after the match. Probably hang around for a little while for some side shooting though.
 
Re: Range results: Jumping 155s and Jamming 208s

Thanks for the thread. Your posts on the heavies are always informative.
 
Re: Range results: Jumping 155s and Jamming 208s

Shane,
I just got my rifle back from Chris @ Longshot. I had him install a 1-10 Broughton and cut to 22". So far I've only tried W760 at 2.95 oal. I'm in between 47.5 and 48 grains to fine tune for accuracy. 48 grains gave me 5 rounds under an inch with velocities of 2554, 2559, 2558, 2549, 2556. I'm going to continue tweaking it and when I nail it I'll play with some RL15 and RL17 and see what I come up with.
 
Re: Range results: Jumping 155s and Jamming 208s

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MontanaMarine</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'd be curious to hear results from anyone shooting 208s or 210s from a Savage 308, given it's 1/10 twist barrel.</div></div>

I am shooting 208 A maxs out of my savage model 12. You helped me set the load up. 42 grains of RL 15, 210m primer and I forget what brass right now. That is what vacation and kids will do. Very accurate load.

 
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