Recommendations for gas-gun brass

[BWYoda]

Newb loader who is trying to source a reasonably priced source for .223 and 7.62 brass to feed an AR and FAL respectively. I came across these guys selling once-fired fully prepped brass:

http://precisionbrass.net/order.html?gclid=COO27qfBuKACFctY2godi0VlTA

Wondered of anyone had used this stuff before and could comment on the quality. Is the military stuff a better option for these weapons? I've not yet de-crimped/re-sized/swaged military brass so if I were to go for the non-prepped stuff and was wondering if it's worth the time and effort. I'm looking to load about 5/600 rds. Thanks fellas!

 

[4Rail_Gunner]

Re: Recommendations for gas-gun brass

I've never used them but I will add this.

Using mixed headstamps or mixed brass means they are not all the same internal capacity.
This leads to different velocities with the same load.
Giving you vertical stringing at longer distances.
Just something to consider.

 

[BWYoda]

Re: Recommendations for gas-gun brass

Have you found the variation to be that substantial?

 

[former naval person]

Re: Recommendations for gas-gun brass

In the FAL and AR, military brass is what was designed for the weapons. If your AR is not a fully prepped match weapon, you probably will NOT be able to tell the difference in headstamps. In the FAL I'd almost guarantee you won't. I was just prepping some LC brass the other day and segregated out the LC 87 that I have a majority of, and other various LC from 91 through 2000. As I was swaging the primer pocket with my Dillon 600, I could tell a difference in the base thickness from 87 to the later brass. Later brass felt thinner. JMHO

 

[TresMon]

Re: Recommendations for gas-gun brass

I shot an AR .223 gas gun frequently & faithfully @ 1000 yards last year. (it was set up for it- 26" barrel and all.)We have a local 1000 yard practice session every Monday afternoon during spring summer and fall, plus the matches I attend.

I would have to know (1) actually at what range your going to be shooting or wanting to be effective at, and (2) the average size of your target.

A 600 yard deer does not require near the precision as competing in a 300 yard egg shoot.

But my post's here will get you pointed in the right direction. Lemme know how I can help. In my second long post I speak of issues with varying brass...

http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthre...449#Post1686449


I have to state that most any decently built AR for any purpose whether CQB,GP battle rifle, or precision should shoot SUB .75 moa- and with that varying brass will rear it's ungly head on target at mid to long range.

 

[BWYoda]

Re: Recommendations for gas-gun brass

Thanks Tresmon. A lot of useful information there. The point about varied cases is well taken. x grains in one won't shoot the same as x grains in another. So would sorting the cases by weight resolve the issue? To answer your question, I'm not a match .223 shooter, and rarely go over 150-200yds with my AR, most of it being tac drills on steel etc. My precision stuff is .308.

 

[TresMon]

Re: Recommendations for gas-gun brass

if your staying inside 200 yards on steel- shoot any ammo you can get your hands on, CHEAP! You'll be all smiles.

 

[balkandom]

Re: Recommendations for gas-gun brass

I call my FAL "Cookie Monster", because it really doesn't care what it shoots, and it wrecks the brass.Trying to re-form the cases is as bad or worse than what M-60 ammo used to be. That being said, I agree with what those above have said, uniformity is the key. I use the LC "Match" and "LR" brass-the cases are heavy in comparison to most others and you DO lose some case capacity, but it's uniform, reloads multiple times, and compared to lots of the commercial, it's cheap.
I don't reload for the FAL, mine is just a military-run, not anything special-I could fire any of my good rounds through it if I had reason to, but you can find decent military surplus which will give you similar accuracy and reliability to what you can load for it for a little more money and you're not wrecking your brass.
That being said, if you do decide to reload for it, the military stuff will do just fine, just make sure a small-base sizing die is used to resize it.

My 2 cents-

 

[Powder_Burns]

Re: Recommendations for gas-gun brass

.223 and .308 are probably the 2 easiest rifle cases to score at the shooting range...pick them ALL up and then sort them at home when you have time. A sweep with a magnet gets all your steel cased crap out of the way, and then its time to tumble. When your cases are all nice and shiny now you can inspect for pitting, cracks, gouges, etc. Start a nice cull pile for all the reject cases. FAL is gonna wreck .308 brass, ask anyone that shoots em.

As of now I'm culling military cases...Lake City aren't so bad but a lot of these mil/nato cases have crimped in primers and they are more of a pita to de-crimp than the effort is worth. And then you end up with a few cases that still fight the primers going in, screw up a primer, have to decap and try again. Like what was mentioned above, case capacity varies a lot. Some cases are thicker than others, if you can measure grains of water capacity thats one way of finding out. Also Also as well, some cases have undersized flash holes and you will find out the hard way when you break a decapping pin. Find out which cases are like that, get a decapping pin turned down with some emory or sand paper until it fits..

 

[superyota]

Re: Recommendations for gas-gun brass

take a look at brassmanbrass.com i have ordered and used .223 unpreped and do work myself, fast shipping and quality brass all is once fired with crimped primers, unless you by preped cases. check them out think that they also carry 7.62 cases.

 

[BWYoda]

Re: Recommendations for gas-gun brass

Thanks for the link, I'll check it out. As for the FAL chewing up the brass that's a concern I had!

 

[former naval person]

Re: Recommendations for gas-gun brass

Weight may help...but depends upon the internal configuration of the brass. Thick base with thin walls may have same weight as thin base with thickly contoured walls, which may change the water capacity of the cases. If you load military, try to get the same head stamp...that will weed out most of the severe variation. But, at 200 yards, the changes will mostly be in the noise. (By that I do not mean the noise to your ears, but the noise in the system). JMHO

 

[BCP]

Re: Recommendations for gas-gun brass

I have a brass question too, hopefully someone can help me.

I have been loading federal and remington brass, and after 2-3 loadings I'm getting pressure signs on the case head, however the load isn't a "max" load. Are there any tougher brass brands out there? I've heard Lapua is tough but I can't afford that, should I be looking for once-fired Lake City or maybe some Winchester? Or should I just back my load off? It's a bit frustrating since it's a very accurate load.

This is being shot through an AR btw.

 

[Powder_Burns]

Re: Recommendations for gas-gun brass

Federal is notoriously soft brass, at least in .223 rem not positive about other cartridges(although I strongly suspect).
Hornady, Black Hills, Lake City, Winchester, and PMC seem fine to me. I don't feel great about the Sellier & Bellot cases but they probably hold up well too. Not sure if any of this translates across to .308 so ymmv.

 

[81Z4ME]

Re: Recommendations for gas-gun brass

What are you shooting the brass in? It can make a difference. Some rifles have more "generous" chambers than others and the brass gets worked pretty hard.

Before you automatically full length resize check your chamber to see if you need to. Not all rifles require really "well resized" brass. Many bolt actions do not. My M1A has a match barrel on it (came that way from SAI many years ago) and yet I've never set the die up so that it makes contact with the shell holder. I can leave a little small ring of "dirty" resizing lube at the spot where the neck and shoulder meet and the brass runs through my M1A with no issues.

I use civilian brass (or military) in my M1A and M1 Garand. Maybe some day I'll have an issue but up to know its all been good.

 

[BWYoda]

Re: Recommendations for gas-gun brass

The M4 is chambered for 5.56, so I'm not overly worried about the snug chamber on that score. As for the FAL, the only issue which has been raised is the fact that it chews through brass so I've got to watch for early case head separation.

 

[BCP]

Re: Recommendations for gas-gun brass

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 81Z4ME</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My M1A has a match barrel on it (came that way from SAI many years ago) and yet I've never set the die up so that it makes contact with the shell holder.</div></div>

I never thought of that. I always set them up to where they make good contact on the upstroke. I will try setting it to where the barely make contact, or not at all.

 

[former naval person]

Re: Recommendations for gas-gun brass

BCP...all that is fine, just remember that the M1A isn't a turn bolt action with high torque to seat the cartridge. You really need to size it enough that the springs will reliably seat the cartridge in the chamber and lock up completely. Otherwise you may get a "just enough" lock up wherein the cartridge will fire but the lugs aren't fully into battery. Think, "Tolerance stackup". A firing event in such a case can ruin a rifle...and an eye. Or hand. Or worse. Running a gas gun like that should make you a conservative. Not a liberal. JMHO