- Thread starter El Dookie
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What exactly are you looking for? I've reloaded for my SBR'd PS90 for years and got my start from the reloading section on the FiveseveN forum.
There is/was a very dedicated crew over there who took a methodical approach to building a load data library.
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Not even close to correct. I reload 5.7 all the time. Components right now are hard to find for everything but look for any 40 grain style bullet. I use A or Z max but any 223 bullet will work provided you got load data for it.
IF you are reloading for an FN or Ruger platform, DO NOT tumble your brass. Wash it in a simple green and water mix and then dry it good. The FN factory rounds have a sealer on the primer and the pocket will need cleaned up and possibly swaged.
All caps are bad but warranted here: PAY SUPER CLOSE ATTENTION TO YOUR POWDER CHARGE. VERY SMALL INCRIMINATES OVER WILL CAUSE PROBLEMS in a delayed blowback system.
Fiveseven forum as mentioned above and search for Ifire, his load data is what I used to get my start.
No horse in the 5.7x28 race myself but this stuck me as an interesting comment, can you explain the reasoning just for my own curiositys sake?
The 5.7 cases have a coating on the brass to aid in chambering/extracting. Tumbling will take that coating off.
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@Powder_Burns got it before I made it back here.
Here it is ifire load data
I use the 40gr VMAX. Same bullet as the SS197 except with a Hornady red polymer tip vice the blue one FNH uses for factory ammo.
The Federal AE load uses FN brass, so look out for it as a brass source as well.
ETA: the above link has load data built around the 16" barreled PS90. I've used it as a guide for my SBR'd/P90 barrel length rifle. If you're using a FiveseveN or Ruger pistol you might want to look for firearm specific data to compare and contrast.
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Ifire has a lot of time invested in this for sure. I have used 40g for the last 6 or so years reloading this round. The 27g was problematic for my barrel twist. The 36g varmint grenade does pretty good, but my go to is definitely 40g with autocomp powder. I loaded a few heavy ones to play with subsonic but never got real deep into that.
I got lucky with brass and picked up 1k from a range that didn’t think it would sell. OP might have some luck hitting up a few local ranges and asking if they will keep 5.7 when they collect brass during cleanup. There are a few sights that sell it but seems dry right now for sure.
I got lucky with brass and picked up 1k from a range that didn’t think it would sell. OP might have some luck hitting up a few local ranges and asking if they will keep 5.7 when they collect brass during cleanup. There are a few sights that sell it but seems dry right now for sure.
RCBS sells dies, but the 5.7x28mm case is finicky to reload. IDK if they have changed the shell holder, but the first ones had the standard oversized hole, which left the case head supported only by the (very thin) rim. The solution was to turn a bushing and epoxy it in the SH, giving the case head more support.
I'll echo the recommendation to not tumble the brass. It has a plastic coating that is needed to function correctly/reliably in the firearm.
True Blue used to be the powder of choice for reloading this case, but it has been many years since I attempted to reload it. Easier just to buy ammo, and salt it away for times like now.
I'll echo the recommendation to not tumble the brass. It has a plastic coating that is needed to function correctly/reliably in the firearm.
True Blue used to be the powder of choice for reloading this case, but it has been many years since I attempted to reload it. Easier just to buy ammo, and salt it away for times like now.
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Lee dies here as well. Did it on a single stage for years, then got the 550 shell plate and locator buttons from AE to at least resize at a faster pace, but earlier this year shelled out the bucks for the 650 kit from AZ Born along with a Dillon trimmer.
Ran through a gallon of brass needing sized and trimmed like nobody’s business and did the same when it came time to load, though I used a Redding manual PM vice a Dillon case activated one.
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@towerofpower93 I haven’t upgraded from my single stage yet. I spent several hours doing my brass prep step by step a while back. The only quick piece I used was a WFT2 trim bushing for trimming. I don’t shoot the bulk to justify a full out progressive setup. My platform is a little more conservative on brass consumption and way less hard on brass so I probably get a few more firings from it.
Bolt gun?
I do two reloads from my once fired brass and then toss it. Got my first neck separation a few months back which was easy enough to get out with some Cerrosafe, but I'd like to avoid that happening again.
The blowback action of the P90 really really blows those shoulders forward and means the brass is getting worked hard during resizing.
I had a FiveseveN for a bit, but never reloaded for it so all my data is from the SBR'd PS90. A bolt gun has always fascinated me, but I already have too many projects...
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Yeah it’s a bolt gun. You are correct though, the FN platforms are brutal on brass. I occasionally get some 1x fired that I lose the necks on when prepping. It’s a lot easier to get one out of your resizing die than a chamber that is for sure.
I have some brass I am on the 4th loading I believe, and it is still pretty strong or appears strong still. Primer pockets last longer too. I am loading fairly conservative with the last batch being 5.2g of autocomp. I started with 4.8 and it shoots great so I might go back to that load setting when I do another batch.
I have some brass I am on the 4th loading I believe, and it is still pretty strong or appears strong still. Primer pockets last longer too. I am loading fairly conservative with the last batch being 5.2g of autocomp. I started with 4.8 and it shoots great so I might go back to that load setting when I do another batch.
Small world, I run 5.4gr of Auto Comp under a 40gr VMAX for my rifle.
Get ~100fps over the FN factory loads with the same accuracy.
What is your max bullet weight for 5.7x28? Having trouble like everyone else in finding components for my 57. But I have plenty 50 and 55 grain .224 bullets but no data on reloading over a 40 grain.
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Will get out in the shop and pull the data in a bit. I believe I have data for all the way up to 62g, although most barrels won’t shoot 62 very good. My barrel is a 14 twist, so my results may vary from yours some. If I remember correctly, most 5.7 barrels are 1:9.
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Found data for 55g but not the 62g. I have loaded some up and if I remember it didn’t shoot very well for me. I have never tried 55g though. I stick to 40g as I’ve had great luck with that weight. The 36g does ok but 27 sucked in my gun as well. I didn’t play with the he 27 much, so there’s a chance it could have worked better. Or maybe it was all me, and I just hadn’t figured the gun out yet. If you want the 55g data, shoot me a pm and I’ll share.
@Bigjim6278 @roostercogburn98
I messed around with trying 55gr subs in my suppressed and SBR'd PS90. The twist rate is fine as I swapped the 16" FN barrel for a 1:9 twist Hi-Desert Dog barrel back in the day.
Accuracy was pretty meh, the ES/SD were insane, and I ran into issues with the suppressor creating back pressure and popping the mag out. This was a well documented issue over on the FiveseveN Forum at the time and while fixes were found, I didn't feel like adding strips of lead tape to the bolt or any of the other solutions for what was just a niche handloading adventure.
Here's my data. Of note, the instances of keyholing in the 25m target noted in the 18 Jan data may have been something wonky going on with the suppressor and gasses interfering with the flight of the bullet. Never had any indications of a baffle strike, but that was the only variable changed from all the unsuppressed testing. Was thinking about trying some other powders to address the unlocking time/map popping issues, and maybe running a .30cal suppressor to see if the larger bore would have lead to less bullet deflection, but I kinda gave up on it as I found a 40gr VMAX going nearly 2200fps wasn't that loud anyway when suppressed and far more fun to mess around with on steel than the 55gr subs.
| Win Auto Comp 2.5gr | Hornady 55gr FMJBT | Rem 7.5 SRP | 1.585" | Avg: 963.9 ES: 44 SD: 23.7 | 05JAN14 3 round test group PS90 unsuppressed |
| Win Auto Comp 2.6gr | Hornady 55gr FMJBT | Rem 7.5 SRP | 1.585" | Avg: 969.8 ES: 75 SD: 37.2 | 05JAN14 2 round test group PS90 unsuppressed |
| Win Auto Comp 2.7gr | Hornady 55gr FMJBT | Rem 7.5 SRP | 1.585" | Avg: 1019 ES: 67 SD: 24.3 | 05JAN14 5 round test group PS90 unsuppressed |
| Alliant Steel 2.9gr | Hornady 55gr FMJBT | Rem 7.5 SRP | 1.585" | Avg: 987.6 ES: 93 SD: 37.7 | 05JAN14 5 round test group PS90 unsuppressed |
| Alliant Steel 3.0gr | Hornady 55gr FMJBT | Rem 7.5 SRP | 1.585" | Avg: 925.2 ES: 86 SD: 33.7 | 05JAN14 5 round test group PS90 unsuppressed |
| Alliant Steel 3.1gr | Hornady 55gr FMJBT | Rem 7.5 SRP | 1.585" | Avg: 1014 ES: 83 SD: 29.3 | 05JAN14 5 round test group PS90 unsuppressed |
| Alliant Steel 2.9gr | Hornady 55gr FMJBT | Rem 7.5 SRP | 1.585" | Avg: 1053 ES: 68 SD: 34 | 18JAN14 13 round test group (only 2 rounds were read by the chrono) PS90 and SFN-57 suppressor. All rounds keyholed in 25m target. No rounds keyholed in 5 yard target on 05JAN14. Mag popped twice out of 13 rounds fired. |
| Win Auto Comp 2.5gr | Hornady 55gr FMJBT | Rem 7.5 SRP | 1.585" | Avg: 955.2 ES: 146 SD: 49.5 | 18JAN14 10 round test group PS90 and SFN-57 suppressor. All rounds keyholed in 25m target. No rounds keyholed in 5 yard target on 05JAN14. |
| Alliant Steel 2.9gr | Hornady 55gr FMJBT | Rem 7.5 SRP | 1.585" | Avg: 870.2 ES: 297 SD: 102 | 26JAN14 7 round test group PS90 unsuppressed. No keyholing in 25m target. |
| Win Auto Comp 2.5gr | Hornady 55gr FMJBT | Rem 7.5 SRP | 1.585" | Avg: 956.2 ES: 130 SD: 41.9 | 26JAN14 10 round test group PS90 unsuppressed. No keyholing in 25m target. |
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@towerofpower93
I think we run the same loads for the pst part. I do run mine through a 30 cal can and have shot the 40g to 400 yards through a 16 inch 1:14 twist bolt gun. I have pretty much stuck with autocomp and 40g bullets as they have done quite well. It is not that loud and I think I’m right around your velocities with 5.2 grains. The loads with 4.8 did extremely well and I think were in the mid to high 2100 range. It has been a while since I have ran those rounds through a chrony.
I think we run the same loads for the pst part. I do run mine through a 30 cal can and have shot the 40g to 400 yards through a 16 inch 1:14 twist bolt gun. I have pretty much stuck with autocomp and 40g bullets as they have done quite well. It is not that loud and I think I’m right around your velocities with 5.2 grains. The loads with 4.8 did extremely well and I think were in the mid to high 2100 range. It has been a while since I have ran those rounds through a chrony.
Hi. Have you ever noticed the large Extreme Spread and Large Standard Deviation users of this round report. Yes, I know that 5 gr of True Blue (etc) is going to lie in different positions relative to the primer, BUT, I 'discovered' another possible cause today. Since I've only just started reloading this tiny ctg, I'm putting this out there to folks who have a lot of experience with this round.
Today, I received another 200 once fired cases to play with. I reload 40 different ctgs, but this was a new one to me.
The last batch of 200 once fired cases I purchased, I used a Lee decapping die to remove the spent primers. This is ALWAYS my first step with any ctg. Nrar the end of the first 200, I broke the 'unbreakable' Lee decapping pin. I switched to the excellent Zoekim decapping pin and finished the lot.
Today, I thought I'd deprime the next 200 cases to start the process. I was having a strange problem with an occasional primer not getting pushed out of the brass. I also noticed the occasional extra effort on the Rock Chucker up stroke and a small 'squeak' on the downstroke. No matter how I adjusted the decapping pin up or down, or the die body itself, the same issue kept happening.
To find the root cause, I sectioned a junk case, wanting to see how thick the web was.
That's when I discovered that the tapered Zoekim pin just wasn't able to enter the Flash hole far enough to push out the dead primer.
This is when I realized there was a large difference in flash hole diameters. These cases are ALL FN, but from different lots, I'm sure.
So, do think the flash hole size variation has any impact on velocity?
I was surprised with the large factory rounds ES and SD I just observed on my Garmin C1.
Anyone?
Today, I received another 200 once fired cases to play with. I reload 40 different ctgs, but this was a new one to me.
The last batch of 200 once fired cases I purchased, I used a Lee decapping die to remove the spent primers. This is ALWAYS my first step with any ctg. Nrar the end of the first 200, I broke the 'unbreakable' Lee decapping pin. I switched to the excellent Zoekim decapping pin and finished the lot.
Today, I thought I'd deprime the next 200 cases to start the process. I was having a strange problem with an occasional primer not getting pushed out of the brass. I also noticed the occasional extra effort on the Rock Chucker up stroke and a small 'squeak' on the downstroke. No matter how I adjusted the decapping pin up or down, or the die body itself, the same issue kept happening.
To find the root cause, I sectioned a junk case, wanting to see how thick the web was.
That's when I discovered that the tapered Zoekim pin just wasn't able to enter the Flash hole far enough to push out the dead primer.
This is when I realized there was a large difference in flash hole diameters. These cases are ALL FN, but from different lots, I'm sure.
So, do think the flash hole size variation has any impact on velocity?
I was surprised with the large factory rounds ES and SD I just observed on my Garmin C1.
Anyone?
I could believe it. My factory ammo and now handloads all have what would be considered atrocious ES/SD if it were 5.56 or another round I'd be taking past 200yds.
Hi. Well, here's a new puzzle to solve.
Today, I chrono'ed some 5.7 hand loads I just whipped up.
The 35 gr Hornady V-Max with 5.3 gr of True Blue averaged 2152 with an ES of only 32 fps.
The 40 gr Hornady V-Max with 5.0 gr of True Blue averaged 1954 with an ES of 341! *
* there were 2 rounds that were 1705 and 1986 that really fouled the data. Don't know what happened to that 1705 round.
I'll try that load again, some day.
Without those 2 slow rounds, the avg would have been 2028.
All the same lot of once fired/prepped brass.
This has been a fun journey.
thanks for the reply.
ron
Today, I chrono'ed some 5.7 hand loads I just whipped up.
The 35 gr Hornady V-Max with 5.3 gr of True Blue averaged 2152 with an ES of only 32 fps.
The 40 gr Hornady V-Max with 5.0 gr of True Blue averaged 1954 with an ES of 341! *
* there were 2 rounds that were 1705 and 1986 that really fouled the data. Don't know what happened to that 1705 round.
I'll try that load again, some day.
Without those 2 slow rounds, the avg would have been 2028.
All the same lot of once fired/prepped brass.
This has been a fun journey.
thanks for the reply.
ron
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I’d be willing to bet your on the verge of losing that case or cases with slow velocities. As mentioned above, most do the platforms are super hard on brass and it takes a toll quick. One day I’ll run a handful through the chronograph again and see what kind of numbers it’s pushing. Haven’t really done that since I first got numbers way back when. I’m probably due anyway to see how the barrel has settled
OK, thanks Rooster. I'll keep an eye out for that. The once fired cases have a very short neck, as opposed to new ammo and resized ammo where the die pushes the shoulder back to the original, unfired case dimensions. I read that the reason for this is the typical auto loader's action has already started to unlock while the powder is still burning. I'm using a Thompson Contender and the shoulder doesn't move.
This next batch will be resized with Imperial to prevent damaging that fragile little rim........
This next batch will be resized with Imperial to prevent damaging that fragile little rim........
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Imperial has saved me a few I believe. It’s the only thing I’ll use on the 5.7. Mine is fired from a bolt action, so cases get less abuse like your TC. I have a plan to get some factory loads and fire them in my gun so they are only ever fired through one platform and see how that changes the way brass looks.
I took a handful of measurements from 3 or 4 platforms a while back for another member here and there were some small differences in each platform.
" I have a plan to get some factory loads and fire them in my gun so they are only ever fired through one platform and see how that changes the way brass looks." -roostercogburn98
This will make a huge difference for you. I have been reloading for t/c and bolt guns in 5.7x28 and it makes all the difference. Trying to use once fired from a blowback gun is a waste of time.
As the coating goes , in the bolt actions you can remove it with zero effect on reliability. Although I believe removal is very much harder than people will lead you to believe.
This will make a huge difference for you. I have been reloading for t/c and bolt guns in 5.7x28 and it makes all the difference. Trying to use once fired from a blowback gun is a waste of time.
As the coating goes , in the bolt actions you can remove it with zero effect on reliability. Although I believe removal is very much harder than people will lead you to believe.
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Yeah removal is tricky to get completely gone. If you beat it up, it just turns black and gummy.
I leave it as it has no adverse impact. Only reason I’m using once fired from any type of blowback is I got a couple thousand for free. Once I wear them out, I will probably buy a case of ammo and start fresh. I’d hate to mix up what I already have going on.
The finish/coating on the brass is very important for cycling! I've had dies for awhile now, but haven't processed brass yet. About the only way you can find brass is "once fired" or "range brass". My 2 pistols (s&w & fn) ejects the best brass to reuse, but the ps90 and 57 AR upper is terrible. Like stated earlier the 5.7 is very sensitive to charge. Very few published load data for that cartridge (lyman, western powders) are the only 2 I know of.
I'll check it out also, thanks!
I'll have to do backward math to figure out velocity.
I have the S&W mp5.7, it doesn't seem to care if the cases are coated or not.
Had good luck reloading with 40 vmax and WSF.
Had good luck reloading with 40 vmax and WSF.
That's good news, but the ps90 (and maybe the fn pistol) needs the coating for cycling? Brass is dry and nickel would benefit as it's not as dry. NP3 coated brass could be awesome, but might not seal and maybe crack when expanded?
I don't know, but I cleaned all the coating off some brass and had zero issues, my buddies FN absolutely would not run it.
When I bought mine I did so based on the review by that Outlaw dude. When in the store I compared it to the FN and was shocked at how much better the trigger was on the MP.
Best pistol money I've spent in a long time.
Anyone shoot range brass through the cmmg? Any concerns with the coating?
I don't have their upper or complete rifle/pistol/sbr, but hopefully get their 8" setup kit (barrel, bcg).
That's what I bought, just haven't gotten it out yet.
Good to know the removal of the coating hasn't caused you issues in the M&P.
I've never experimented with removing the coating for my PS90 or PSA Rock, but I'm interested to see what EA's aftermarket coating will accomplish once it's available.
No issues with mine. Range pickup 1x fired. Loaded it and it cycled just fine.
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Is he still fucking with shit? I hadn’t heard anything new from his work I’m forever.
He had at one time promised virgin brass, but I don’t think it ever panned out
Pretty sure he had the brass at one point, but COVID and/or the realization that not many folks would want to mess with a case that has dramatically different capacity would be a good business model. Putting yourself in a niche within a niche seems like an easy way to generate a poor ROI.
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I thought it was FN fucking with him and threatening lawsuits?
And the ATF raided his business oh so long ago, and then told him he could no longer produce or modify copper projectiles.
I know he had a full on assault ran on him and his business. I had not heard much about him after some of that. He had some neat ideas though, too bad he caught the “mans” eye
I wasn't aware of the FN or ATF nonsense. I was big into 5.7 for a bit, but kinda fell off the forum back in 2017-18 and just got back into playing with it.
Bummer that he was dogpiled and that may have stifled innovation.
