Remington 700 Crown Damage

[commandernavi]

So, I bought an SPS Tactical AAC-SD in .308 new from Buds and just picked it up today from my FFL. Unfortunately it has crown damage and I am concerned about how this is going to affect accuracy. I paid a lot for this rifle and since it is going to be used for a precision build, this is actually important to me. I have both Bud's and the Remington Warranty to lean on and this is definitely something that should be covered. HOWEVER, it is such a small fix that the time it would take to have it sent back to Remington and have them fix it would probably take a long time.

Also, there seems to be some weird rust or something inside the barrel that didn't go away with a cleaning (3rd pic).

So I ask you, what options do I have in this case?

How much does re-crowning usually cost if I were to do it myself?

Does Remington only service their rifles at their factory or do they have contracts with gun-smiths in major cities that I could just take it to and have it fixed with their money? I really want to avoid waiting months to get my gun back...

What could the discoloration in the 3rd pic in the barrel be and is it a problem?

I live in Houston Texas and was wondering whether there are any good places you could recommend to service it if I have to service it myself.

Thank you for the help!

I have included some (very poor unfortunately) photos below showing how the crown is dented along the edge and also the discoloration.

 

[sniperdude]

well if its going to be used for a build , the builder should be able to fix the crown, you might get Remington to recommend a smith in your area, but I would call them to bitch about that, I feel thet should not have left the factory like that, but its fixable and I would think for about an hour of the smiths time..depending on how bad it is in person (not from the pics). the discolor looks like copper fouling to me.

hope this helps some

 

[commandernavi]

I think I will send them an email about it to keep a record.

Why would there be copper fouling in a new gun? Test-fires?

 

[sniperdude]

you should send them the pics as well. im not sure about Remington, but the barrels are usually "proofed" and the gun is usually functiones with another round or 2

 

[PyroBebop]

This post worries me, since I also live in Houston, and ordered that exact model from Buds. I believe it should be arriving tomorrow to my FFL , and will pick it up after work.

I hope everything gets fixed quickly CommanderNavi.

 

[commandernavi]

You and me both sir. :/

 

[Skyyr]

I had a very bad experience with Remington customer service, so be forewarned - they are NOT interested in seeing photos of any kind. They will request you to send in your rifle, review it, and then contact you about how they're going to proceed to repair it. The entire process is 4-12 weeks with little to no communication in-between. I literally spent 4 hours on the phone with them back in February/March over a similar issue (although mine was a cosmetic issue with the receiver).

Your best bet is trying to have Bud's make it right - they can legally swap out the rifle for you after you've taken possession of it (whether they will or won't is a matter of company policy). I'd ask them to replace it. There's no reason it should have been sent to you like that.

Just my .02

 

[commandernavi]

That is really upsetting. I will try to call them again in that case. How much does re-crowning usually cost? I may just bite the bullet in this one if it's not too much.

 

[EXTREMEPREJUDICE]

Just send it back to the gun shop you bought it from.......................... If you purchased it new and that's how it showed up at the FFL let the seller deal with the problem. I can't see how Remington would consider "crown damage" a warranty item unless it arrived at your dealer from the factory that way and they missed it (or worse, sold it anyway?) If it was a used rifle I would just shoot it and see how it does because it might have no effect, but since you purchased it new I would require the seller to make it right. Just curious, did you not catch it before you transferred at your FF?

 

[commandernavi]

I caught it there but stupidly didn't realize that the gun was already mine after I completed the background check not after I paid the ffl. I inspected it while he ran my check. Stupid me.

 

[Masked]

The Over-Rated Crown

Take a gander at the article.

Bottom line -- The article makes sense so, moving forward, I wouldn't worry about it's impact on accuracy. Ultimately, I'd contact Remington but, keep in mind, they'll be taking the complete gun back to work on the crown.

 

[commandernavi]

Update: Contacted Remington and sent off for warranty service. I will try to post on here about the experience assuming I don't forget. I called a lot of smiths in my area and they all ask for pretty steep prices (75 bucks for a recrown) and the turn around time isn't much better.

I am hoping to save up and get a suppressor in the future, but that is a long way away unfortunately. Thank you for the suggestion though MtnCreek.

 

[Papa Zero Three]

I called a lot of smiths in my area and they all ask for pretty steep prices (75 bucks for a recrown) and the turn around time isn't much better.

That doesn't seem like an unreasonable amount. Of course you could also do it yourself. Muzzle Crown Refacing Tool Kit

 

[cjherrman]

Keep us posted.

 

[Quark]

Probably just me but you indicated that you are going to use this for a "precision build" If that's the case then why would you even worry about this ?

quark

 

[thrusty]

I caught it there but stupidly didn't realize that the gun was already mine after I completed the background check not after I paid the ffl. I inspected it while he ran my check. Stupid me.

A background check does not obligate the gun to you.....how would it work if you failed the check....well the dealer wouldn't sell you the gun then. A background check only tells the dealer whether he can proceed or not with the sale. I'm hopping you are assuming this and the dealer wasn't the one telling you this non-sense....

The gun is not yours until you walk out the door with it paid, in full.

I'm very surprised that the gun left Remington in that condition....I'm interested in what the factory packing looked like, was there damage to the box to indicate that the crown was damaged during shipping?
I've also not seen that much fouling in a new rifle...yes, they are "proofed" before leaving the factory, but only a couple function rounds...not a couple hundred.

Regardless...you mention you're going to use the action to build a precision rifle...If you plan on keeping the gun as is until you shoot the barrel out, then $75 for a crown job is respectable. Else, send that barreled action off and get in line with one of the top smith's and forget about this mess. (but, I see you've sent the rifle to Remington...so, let us know how it goes).

 

[TeaRex]

Wow- I just went through the exact same thing. I ordered the AAC-SD for my awesome wife from Buds, and took it home from the FFL without inspecting the crown, only to realize later that it had a big ding in it. I called Buds, and they said they couldn't help me after i accepted delivery. I called remington, and they gave me a UPS label to ship it to Mann & Sons sporting goods in IL. The gun was shipped at Remington's expense on 4/24/2013, and i just got it back, freshly recrowned yesterday. Completely free to me. Its pretty crappy of Remington to be shipping out guns with bad crowns, but they did make it right.

 

[Skyyr]

Its pretty crappy of Remington to be shipping out guns with bad crowns, but they did make it right.

It's pretty crappy that it took them 5 weeks to get it back to you. That's 5 weeks of you out the money and the product you paid for because of THEIR mistake.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

It's pretty crappy that it took them 5 weeks to get it back to you. That's 5 weeks of you out the money and the product you paid for because of THEIR mistake.

This is just one of the joys of factory mass produced rifles. I've seen far worse (and unsafe) defects from all the major manufactures. When I pick up a new commercial rifle I thoroughly inspect the gun before transferring it, including checking headspace. Once you transfer it the store you bought it from won't help you.

Unfortunately there is no guarantee of quality control in any rifle under $1500. To get a rifle that is thoroughly inspected before leaving it going to cost you thousands of dollars. Shitty quality control also means more rifles waiting for repairs which means longer wait times. My guess is IF you had a problem with any of the high end brands it would be on the way back to you within a week of receipt. I had a problem with a couple AI mags feeding in my AI AE MKI. I made the 45 minute drive to AINA and was promptly greeted, taken in the back, and my rifle inspected immediately. Within 10 minutes of walking in I had two brand new mags and then had a nice talk with the guys at AI.

I don't know if Remington would even let you drop off a rifle for repair if you were local, and I know they wouldn't even inspect it while you wait, let lone fix it. That's how aimpoint is, I live 10 mins from them and had to drive further than that to UPS to ship it, and pay shipping (they won't accept USPS).

Moral of the story is for premium quality control, and premium service, comes a premium price tag.... and people say you just pay for the name.


Edited to add:

Before somebody takes my post out of context and thinks I'm saying anything under $3K is a POS, that not what I'm saying in any sense. It's possible to get a good mass produced rifle, I've bought dozens of Remington's over the years that shot great. Sure a few have been fucked up out of the box and required repair before use, most broke with use (bolt handles, extractors, ejector springs, bolt releases, triggers, firing pins) but the majority were fine out of the box and the ones that broke I repaired or had repaired. I knew after that first failure and after the first defective rifle that there was a good chance they would break, and there was a chance I can get defective guns. I also learned quickly that they aren't tanks, and that Remington's customer service sucks. I still own Remington's and buy Remington's (despite their recent plummet in quality control) but I have a process to make sure I get a quality gun, and upgrades I do as well as extra parts I keep around to make sure they stay running.

 

[commandernavi]

At least I don't feel alone in this now! Can you post a pic of how they fixed it TeaRex? Thanks for dropping by. They probably have a tool that isn't aligned properly doing the threading or something. How well does it shoot now that it's back?

I totally agree about the premium price = premium qc and service usually. This is my first precision rifle and once I get better and if finances permit I plan on getting into the rifles costing thousands. We will see how that goes but for now I am stuck dealing with this. Oh well.

 

[matchman]

I just had to pass on an 700 5r that had a crown ding. Not so un common I guess.

 

[TeaRex]

Here you go - freshly re-crowned. I haven't taken it back out to the range yet...

 

[commandernavi]

Thanks for the update! If you take it out to the range let us know how it goes if you can.

Also, do you know what that residue inside the barrel is TeaRex? I can see it in your barrel from the photos and my rifle also has this (check photos).

 

[Frank Green]

The Over-Rated Crown

Take a gander at the article.

Bottom line -- The article makes sense so, moving forward, I wouldn't worry about it's impact on accuracy. Ultimately, I'd contact Remington but, keep in mind, they'll be taking the complete gun back to work on the crown.

I'll put this as gently as possible! More damage is done from cleaning then from shooting! The first thing that takes a beating is the muzzles crown more than anything else.

You say you wouldn't worry about it's impact on accuracy? First thing I'm going to ask is what is your definition of accuracy. If you say 1moa or bigger than fine. It is what it is.

If you say your accuracy requirement is 1moa or less than think again.

I've seen barrels where the crown is damaged so slightly that you cannot even see the damage with the naked eye or with a eye loop but you could see it with the bore scope.

In one particular case one barrel one of the grooves and one of the lands right at the bore edge had the slightest bit of damage. Almost to the point you wouldn't think it would have any negative effect on the accuracy. Guess what that gun wouldn't shoot any better than 1.125" to 1.250" moa at a 100 yards. I took the barrel off recrowned the muzzle. Reassembled the gun and took it out and shot it. First group with a cold bore and box ammo it shot a clean .250" moa. I backed it up with another 5 round group that shot sub 1/3moa. Yes I did inspect the rifle and test fired it before I took the barrel off and recrowned the muzzle. Before recrowning the muzzle the barrel had less than 175 rounds on it. So it is possible it wasn't crowned properly when the gunsmith did the work or the shooter damaged it.

I'll throw this in as well. It was a P.D. tactical rifle. I wouldn't want that guy trying to protect me from a bad guy with me near the receiving end of the muzzle with garbage accuracy like that at any distance.

Another example. 1000k yard benchrest gun. The gun wouldn't print anything smaller than like a 11" group at a 1k yards. Customer sent in the barrel for us to look at as the barrel was being blamed for the inaccuracy. When the gunsmith did the installation work they integrally machined the muzzle brake (so the crown work had to be done internally and you could only inspect it with a bore scope). The face of the crown looked like it was done with a hack saw blade when they did the counter bore for the muzzle brake. We properly recrowned the barrel and the first group it fired at a 1k yards it shot barely over a 5" group.

In some cases a damaged crown might not have a impact on accuracy but again I will tell you this. The vast majority of the time a damaged crown will throw your accuracy out of the window. The muzzles crown is the last thing of the barrels bore the bullet touches when it leaves the barrel. This is the last place you want any damage. Other wise you take your chances.

Later, Frank
Bartlein Barrels