I got my Savage 110 BA chambered in .338 Lapua about a week ago and mounted a Sightron 4-16x56mm on it. Since then I've put about 40 rounds through it. With factory Hornady 250 gr match ammo, I was able to make mostly sub-moa groups at 200-500 yds (with proper break-in procedures, of course). I'm waiting for my brass and other reloading equipment to get here, so i bought some Bitterroot Valley 300 gr cartridges and shot it today at 200 and 300 yds (max distance at the range I was at). At 200 yds my patterns were scattered at best, and at 300 they tightened up a little (to about 2.5 moa). I know that it takes a 1:9 barrel longer to stabilize a 300 gr bullet, and I know the 110 can be picky about which round it spits out, but should I really be getting these large groups? Of course this is assuming it is not shooter error, but should i really be getting 6" groups at 200 yards because the bullet is not fully stabilized at this range?
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Re: Savage 110 BA .338 Lapua question
What is proper break in? How good is the Bitterroot ammo?
What is proper break in? How good is the Bitterroot ammo?
Re: Savage 110 BA .338 Lapua question
ya budy, you may want to start on the reloading or a diff factory ammo. I have a 110 ba 338 LM also, have not had it that long but so far i have a 3/4inch 4shot group at 100yrd and 2.5ingroup at 400yrd. and ya it seems to be picky on what it likes. but ill bet when you give it what it wants it be real nice. when i get a good one shooting ill let you know and you do the same. have a good one.
ya budy, you may want to start on the reloading or a diff factory ammo. I have a 110 ba 338 LM also, have not had it that long but so far i have a 3/4inch 4shot group at 100yrd and 2.5ingroup at 400yrd. and ya it seems to be picky on what it likes. but ill bet when you give it what it wants it be real nice. when i get a good one shooting ill let you know and you do the same. have a good one.
Re: Savage 110 BA .338 Lapua question
One of my hunters loaded me up some different rounds this weekend, and it definately liked the 250 gr SMK the best. I shot a 3" 3 shot group at 500 yds, and am happy with that. We still have a lot of testing to do on different loads, just not enough time to do it in one day! Will shoot it some more the middle of next week, and hopefully stretch it out a little farther. I'll let you know the specifics of the round it liked, but i don't have the stats in front of me.
-HW
One of my hunters loaded me up some different rounds this weekend, and it definately liked the 250 gr SMK the best. I shot a 3" 3 shot group at 500 yds, and am happy with that. We still have a lot of testing to do on different loads, just not enough time to do it in one day! Will shoot it some more the middle of next week, and hopefully stretch it out a little farther. I'll let you know the specifics of the round it liked, but i don't have the stats in front of me.
-HW
Re: Savage 110 BA .338 Lapua question
try some of the federal gold medal if you don't reload.
try some of the federal gold medal if you don't reload.
Re: Savage 110 BA .338 Lapua question
The 250gr Hornady worked ok for me? Some have said the FGMM has not worked out good for them in the BA 110.
Diego
The 250gr Hornady worked ok for me? Some have said the FGMM has not worked out good for them in the BA 110.
Diego
Re: Savage 110 BA .338 Lapua question
off topic but what is the recoil on this platform? Thinking about purchasing one in either 338 or maybe 300 win mag just cause rounds are cheaper. Thanks
off topic but what is the recoil on this platform? Thinking about purchasing one in either 338 or maybe 300 win mag just cause rounds are cheaper. Thanks
Re: Savage 110 BA .338 Lapua question
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: millertime2</div><div class="ubbcode-body">off topic but what is the recoil on this platform? Thinking about purchasing one in either 338 or maybe 300 win mag just cause rounds are cheaper. Thanks </div></div>
Minimal! It's like shooting a .270 or similar. You'll hardly feel it!
As for the ammo prices, well....start reloading!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: millertime2</div><div class="ubbcode-body">off topic but what is the recoil on this platform? Thinking about purchasing one in either 338 or maybe 300 win mag just cause rounds are cheaper. Thanks </div></div>
Minimal! It's like shooting a .270 or similar. You'll hardly feel it!
As for the ammo prices, well....start reloading!
Re: Savage 110 BA .338 Lapua question
I agree, recoil is about like a .270. More of a 'push' really. Some of the heavier loads I shot had a little more punch, but nothing unmanageable. One could easily send 100+ rounds/day downrange without adverse effects. And unless you want to spends $100+/per 20 rounds, reloading is a must.
I agree, recoil is about like a .270. More of a 'push' really. Some of the heavier loads I shot had a little more punch, but nothing unmanageable. One could easily send 100+ rounds/day downrange without adverse effects. And unless you want to spends $100+/per 20 rounds, reloading is a must.
Re: Savage 110 BA .338 Lapua question
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: millertime2</div><div class="ubbcode-body">off topic but what is the recoil on this platform? Thinking about purchasing one in either 338 or maybe 300 win mag just cause rounds are cheaper. Thanks</div></div>
I own a pair of Browning Safari rifles in .375 H&H and .458 win mag and they each weigh under 8 lbs; with sorbothane buttpads you STILL go "oof" when shooting. Muzzle energy with EITHER round approximates the .338 LM.
Initially, I was kind of surprised myself to feel such little recoil. The 110 BA gun platform itself weighs around 15 lbs which takes up a LOT of the recoil.
The Savage recoil is more like the impulse from a 20 gauge slug. Manageable.
I'm looking forward to shooting it. A lot. You should too.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: millertime2</div><div class="ubbcode-body">off topic but what is the recoil on this platform? Thinking about purchasing one in either 338 or maybe 300 win mag just cause rounds are cheaper. Thanks</div></div>
I own a pair of Browning Safari rifles in .375 H&H and .458 win mag and they each weigh under 8 lbs; with sorbothane buttpads you STILL go "oof" when shooting. Muzzle energy with EITHER round approximates the .338 LM.
Initially, I was kind of surprised myself to feel such little recoil. The 110 BA gun platform itself weighs around 15 lbs which takes up a LOT of the recoil.
The Savage recoil is more like the impulse from a 20 gauge slug. Manageable.
I'm looking forward to shooting it. A lot. You should too.
Re: Savage 110 BA .338 Lapua question
Good to know. Is the trade off for cheaper ammo in the 300 mag vs 338 worth it or would you stay with the 338 for better ballistics. I do reload, and would plan on reloading either round.
Good to know. Is the trade off for cheaper ammo in the 300 mag vs 338 worth it or would you stay with the 338 for better ballistics. I do reload, and would plan on reloading either round.
Re: Savage 110 BA .338 Lapua question
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Heeler22</div><div class="ubbcode-body">......I know that it takes a 1:9 barrel longer to stabilize a 300 gr bullet....</div></div>
My Sako TRG42 with 1/12 twist handles the 300SMK @ ~2700fps at ~3000ftDA great!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Heeler22</div><div class="ubbcode-body">......I know that it takes a 1:9 barrel longer to stabilize a 300 gr bullet....</div></div>
My Sako TRG42 with 1/12 twist handles the 300SMK @ ~2700fps at ~3000ftDA great!
Re: Savage 110 BA .338 Lapua question
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: millertime2</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Good to know. Is the trade off for cheaper ammo in the 300 mag vs 338 worth it or would you stay with the 338 for better ballistics. I do reload, and would plan on reloading either round. </div></div>
If you reload, it costs about 50% more to load 338LM ammo than it does 300WM to equal standards - using quality brass, bullets etc etc.
Is it "worth it"...
You gotta ask yourself if you "need" or can even "use" the ballistics the 338LM offers. Sure, it is super bad-ass, but it's really hard to justify. I think the 300WM is hard to justify, unless you need downrange energy to kill critters at range. You can't even justify the 338LM for 1 mile shooting, as the 300WM handles that just fine.
Not a lot of hard data, but I suspect a 300WM barrel will last longer, and 50% less cost for ammo is significant.
Unless you are killing critters from a long ways away, I'd stick to a 300WM, or a 7mm of some sort.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: millertime2</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Good to know. Is the trade off for cheaper ammo in the 300 mag vs 338 worth it or would you stay with the 338 for better ballistics. I do reload, and would plan on reloading either round. </div></div>
If you reload, it costs about 50% more to load 338LM ammo than it does 300WM to equal standards - using quality brass, bullets etc etc.
Is it "worth it"...
You gotta ask yourself if you "need" or can even "use" the ballistics the 338LM offers. Sure, it is super bad-ass, but it's really hard to justify. I think the 300WM is hard to justify, unless you need downrange energy to kill critters at range. You can't even justify the 338LM for 1 mile shooting, as the 300WM handles that just fine.
Not a lot of hard data, but I suspect a 300WM barrel will last longer, and 50% less cost for ammo is significant.
Unless you are killing critters from a long ways away, I'd stick to a 300WM, or a 7mm of some sort.
Re: Savage 110 BA .338 Lapua question
The info I have read shows the 300 will wear out a barrel a lot faster then the 338, which is one of the reasons I went with the 338?
Diego
The info I have read shows the 300 will wear out a barrel a lot faster then the 338, which is one of the reasons I went with the 338?
Diego
Re: Savage 110 BA .338 Lapua question
I got my .338 as a gift, so I didn't really have a choice (bye the way, by far the best gift I've ever received!). But if it were my dime, I would go with a 300 or 308 (broke college student here). The 300 has excellent ballistics and is, overall, much more affordable. So it all depends on your financial situation. But if you want to lay down steel at 2000 yards, the .338 is probably your best bet.
I got my .338 as a gift, so I didn't really have a choice (bye the way, by far the best gift I've ever received!). But if it were my dime, I would go with a 300 or 308 (broke college student here). The 300 has excellent ballistics and is, overall, much more affordable. So it all depends on your financial situation. But if you want to lay down steel at 2000 yards, the .338 is probably your best bet.
Re: Savage 110 BA .338 Lapua question
I have the 300WM version of the 110BA. I decided on it over the 338LM for economical and practical reasons. The reloading gear cost is about the same (I was pricing Redding comp dies), as are the primers. Pills are marginally more expensive, but the brass is crazy expensive and you're pouring about 20% more powder into them. And what about when you travel and forget your reloads at home? Good luck finding any selection of factory ammo wherever you end up. I can get three different versions of 300WM at Wally world for less per round than a 338LM reload. And at least in my case the extra energy of the 338LM isn't necessary for punching holes in paper. I may hunt with my BA (I even have a GameKing load for it) but I can't see myself taking a shot far enough out for the difference to matter.
I would like to hear how the 300WM wears out barrels faster than a 338LM. Maybe because it cost too much to put 100 rounds a weekend through the 338 and so it lasts longer in years?
Back to the guy asking about the recoil: the 300WM version is a kitten. This was my first magnum so I was a bit nervous taking the first shot, let alone thinking I was going to get through the first 100 rounds I brought with me to break it in. I think between the weight of the stick and the muzzle brake you end up close to .22LR. Seriously, I think you'll get a headache from poor ear protection before you get a sore shoulder from this rig.
Oh and good luck finding the 300WM version. It took me 6 months to get one. During that time I passed over numerous ads for the 338LM version. They both cost the same but I guess Savage made more of the 338? A quick search of GB shows four 300WM and 15 of the 338LM. If anything you can say having the 300WM version has some exclusivity
I have the 300WM version of the 110BA. I decided on it over the 338LM for economical and practical reasons. The reloading gear cost is about the same (I was pricing Redding comp dies), as are the primers. Pills are marginally more expensive, but the brass is crazy expensive and you're pouring about 20% more powder into them. And what about when you travel and forget your reloads at home? Good luck finding any selection of factory ammo wherever you end up. I can get three different versions of 300WM at Wally world for less per round than a 338LM reload. And at least in my case the extra energy of the 338LM isn't necessary for punching holes in paper. I may hunt with my BA (I even have a GameKing load for it) but I can't see myself taking a shot far enough out for the difference to matter.
I would like to hear how the 300WM wears out barrels faster than a 338LM. Maybe because it cost too much to put 100 rounds a weekend through the 338 and so it lasts longer in years?
Back to the guy asking about the recoil: the 300WM version is a kitten. This was my first magnum so I was a bit nervous taking the first shot, let alone thinking I was going to get through the first 100 rounds I brought with me to break it in. I think between the weight of the stick and the muzzle brake you end up close to .22LR. Seriously, I think you'll get a headache from poor ear protection before you get a sore shoulder from this rig.
Oh and good luck finding the 300WM version. It took me 6 months to get one. During that time I passed over numerous ads for the 338LM version. They both cost the same but I guess Savage made more of the 338? A quick search of GB shows four 300WM and 15 of the 338LM. If anything you can say having the 300WM version has some exclusivity
Re: Savage 110 BA .338 Lapua question
From time to time we have members posting asking if anyone can predict how long their particular rifle's bore will last before requiring rebarreling. Perusing an old July 2009 issue of Field and Stream Magazine, it contained the following information as compiled by writer, David E. Petzal. I have edited the article for the salient points:
Every time you ignite a cartridge, some 5,000 to 6,000 degrees of heat is applied for a few thousandths of a second and at whatever chamber pressure the cartridge individually develops. This causes steel to melt. This is called "erosion". The more powder to burn and form gas pressure, the faster the erosion. A small case capacity with slow burn rate powders will not erode as fast as large (and overbore) capacity cases with faster burn rate powders. A fast burn rate powder will burn hotter than a slower one.
Stainless steel resists the damage of heat/pressure more so than chrome/moly steel.
Now, some generalities of useful barrel life, based on factory loaded standard ammo:
.223 Remington (3,000 to 4,000 shots)
22/250 Remington (2500 shots)
.270 Winchester (3,000 shots)
7mm Remington Magnum (1,500 shots)
30/30 Winchester (6,000 + shots) He says "God only knows, never saw one shot out!
30-06 (4,000 to 5,000 shots)
.300 WSM (2,000 shots)
.300 Weatherby (1,000 to 1,500 shots)
.338 Winchester Magnum (2,500 to 3,000 shots)
An interesting side note: gunsmith Melvin Forbes told Petzel he saw something like 3,000 rifles come in for rebarreling, but only found 3 that were actually shot out. The other 2,997 were due to neglect in not cleaning or improper cleaning.
Moral of post - don't overheat the barrel while shooting (should be able to keep hand comfortably grasping barrel), use the slowest powder that provides adequate accuracy, be knowledgeable of proper cleaning techniques and clean when accuracy tails off.
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From time to time we have members posting asking if anyone can predict how long their particular rifle's bore will last before requiring rebarreling. Perusing an old July 2009 issue of Field and Stream Magazine, it contained the following information as compiled by writer, David E. Petzal. I have edited the article for the salient points:
Every time you ignite a cartridge, some 5,000 to 6,000 degrees of heat is applied for a few thousandths of a second and at whatever chamber pressure the cartridge individually develops. This causes steel to melt. This is called "erosion". The more powder to burn and form gas pressure, the faster the erosion. A small case capacity with slow burn rate powders will not erode as fast as large (and overbore) capacity cases with faster burn rate powders. A fast burn rate powder will burn hotter than a slower one.
Stainless steel resists the damage of heat/pressure more so than chrome/moly steel.
Now, some generalities of useful barrel life, based on factory loaded standard ammo:
.223 Remington (3,000 to 4,000 shots)
22/250 Remington (2500 shots)
.270 Winchester (3,000 shots)
7mm Remington Magnum (1,500 shots)
30/30 Winchester (6,000 + shots) He says "God only knows, never saw one shot out!
30-06 (4,000 to 5,000 shots)
.300 WSM (2,000 shots)
.300 Weatherby (1,000 to 1,500 shots)
.338 Winchester Magnum (2,500 to 3,000 shots)
An interesting side note: gunsmith Melvin Forbes told Petzel he saw something like 3,000 rifles come in for rebarreling, but only found 3 that were actually shot out. The other 2,997 were due to neglect in not cleaning or improper cleaning.
Moral of post - don't overheat the barrel while shooting (should be able to keep hand comfortably grasping barrel), use the slowest powder that provides adequate accuracy, be knowledgeable of proper cleaning techniques and clean when accuracy tails off.
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Re: Savage 110 BA .338 Lapua question
Based on that I'd say they'll be about the same. A lot of the loads I've seen use the same, slow-burning powder for both the 300WM and 338LM. I've been using MagPro which was what Accurate recommends for both. The 338LM has slightly higher chamber pressure per their data (64k vs 60k psi) so that can't help. But if the powder is the same, the barrel make the same, and we make the assumption that the entire powder charge is burned before the bullet exits the barrel then why wouldn't the cartridge with the greater amount of powder wear out quicker? More powder means more potential energy which is expelled in the form of heat and pressure. The heat is what is "eroding" the barrel.
Thinking about it a bit more I checked surface area for the two barrels. Without considering rifling the surface are of the 338LM is 10% greater than the 300WM so you could assume that if the same powder charges are used the 338LM would wear less simply based on the fact that there's more surface available to wear out. However the 338LM uses, on average, 20% more powder so I think it's still going to be close, but the math seems to point to 300WM for longevity. But I could still be missing something in my over-analysis
Based on that I'd say they'll be about the same. A lot of the loads I've seen use the same, slow-burning powder for both the 300WM and 338LM. I've been using MagPro which was what Accurate recommends for both. The 338LM has slightly higher chamber pressure per their data (64k vs 60k psi) so that can't help. But if the powder is the same, the barrel make the same, and we make the assumption that the entire powder charge is burned before the bullet exits the barrel then why wouldn't the cartridge with the greater amount of powder wear out quicker? More powder means more potential energy which is expelled in the form of heat and pressure. The heat is what is "eroding" the barrel.
Thinking about it a bit more I checked surface area for the two barrels. Without considering rifling the surface are of the 338LM is 10% greater than the 300WM so you could assume that if the same powder charges are used the 338LM would wear less simply based on the fact that there's more surface available to wear out. However the 338LM uses, on average, 20% more powder so I think it's still going to be close, but the math seems to point to 300WM for longevity. But I could still be missing something in my over-analysis
Re: Savage 110 BA .338 Lapua question
Again maybe apples to oranges?
Using 175 gr M118 LR, 7.62 x 51 mm allows engagement to between 800 - 1000 yds, depending on the rifle used.
7.62 x 51 mm barrel life is typically 10,000 rounds or so.
Research is being conducted to create a 7.62 x 51 mm M118LR replacement that offers true 1000 yd capabilities.
.300 Win Mag (7.62 x 67 mm) in an accurate bolt-action rifle like the Mk13 allows engagement out to approximately 1200 yards using the Mk248 Mod 0 190 gr SMK OTM load from Black Hills or HSM.
.300 Win Mag effective range may be extended out to about 1500 yards or so with the new 210 & 220 gr OTM loads.
.300 Win Mag barrels have a short life span of approximately 1,500 rounds and sharp recoil.
.338 Lapua Magnum (8.6 x 70 mm) is a far better alternative for long range sniping than both 7.62 x 51 mm & .300 Win Mag.*
.338 Lap Mag allows a shooter to approximately double the effective engagement range compared to 7.62 x 51 mm (ie. an 800 m shot from 7.62 x 51 mm is approximately the same difficulty as a 1600 m shot from .338 Lap Mag.
Compared to 7.62 x 51 mm, .338 Lap Mag has approximately half the wind drift and double the energy at 1000 m.
Contrasted with .300 Win Mag, .338 Lap Mag has about half the wind drift and twice the energy at 1500 m.
In recent testing a 5 shot 3/4 MOA group was shot at 2000 m with a .338 Lap Mag Sako TRG42 w/Sure Fire muzzle brake & suppressor.
Both 250 gr and 300 gr loads are in use, with a slight edge in accuracy to the heavier projectile.
.338 Lap Mag barrel life is approximately 3500 rounds -- more than double that of .300 Win Mag.
.338 Lap Mag is in use by several U.S. SOF units and .338 Lap Mag is being type classified.
.338 Lap Mag ammunition is available using several military projectile types.
Recent testing has demonstrated it is possible to shorten .338 Lap Mag 1/9.35 twist barrels from 27” to 20” and still maintain adequate accuracy to 2000 m.
.338 Lap Mag factory production sniper rifles are available from Accuracy International, Barrett, Prarie Gun Works, Remington, & Sako; custom rifles are also available from several vendors.
.338 Lap Mag factory ammunition is commercially available from Black Hills (current DOD contract), Hornady, HSM, Lapua, Nammo, Norma, Remington, Ruag, as well as several custom loaders.
.338 Lap Mag AP ammo is an area that can be further refined.
For long range anti-personel sniping, .338 Lap Mag has several advantages over most .50 BMG platforms, in particular the M82A1 and M107 Barrett semi-autos currently in use.
.338 Lap Mag systems are generally significantly more accurate than the M82A1 and M107.
.338 Lap Mag is easier to carry in the field, as most systems are half the weight of the .50 BMG Barrett.
Diego
Again maybe apples to oranges?
Using 175 gr M118 LR, 7.62 x 51 mm allows engagement to between 800 - 1000 yds, depending on the rifle used.
7.62 x 51 mm barrel life is typically 10,000 rounds or so.
Research is being conducted to create a 7.62 x 51 mm M118LR replacement that offers true 1000 yd capabilities.
.300 Win Mag (7.62 x 67 mm) in an accurate bolt-action rifle like the Mk13 allows engagement out to approximately 1200 yards using the Mk248 Mod 0 190 gr SMK OTM load from Black Hills or HSM.
.300 Win Mag effective range may be extended out to about 1500 yards or so with the new 210 & 220 gr OTM loads.
.300 Win Mag barrels have a short life span of approximately 1,500 rounds and sharp recoil.
.338 Lapua Magnum (8.6 x 70 mm) is a far better alternative for long range sniping than both 7.62 x 51 mm & .300 Win Mag.*
.338 Lap Mag allows a shooter to approximately double the effective engagement range compared to 7.62 x 51 mm (ie. an 800 m shot from 7.62 x 51 mm is approximately the same difficulty as a 1600 m shot from .338 Lap Mag.
Compared to 7.62 x 51 mm, .338 Lap Mag has approximately half the wind drift and double the energy at 1000 m.
Contrasted with .300 Win Mag, .338 Lap Mag has about half the wind drift and twice the energy at 1500 m.
In recent testing a 5 shot 3/4 MOA group was shot at 2000 m with a .338 Lap Mag Sako TRG42 w/Sure Fire muzzle brake & suppressor.
Both 250 gr and 300 gr loads are in use, with a slight edge in accuracy to the heavier projectile.
.338 Lap Mag barrel life is approximately 3500 rounds -- more than double that of .300 Win Mag.
.338 Lap Mag is in use by several U.S. SOF units and .338 Lap Mag is being type classified.
.338 Lap Mag ammunition is available using several military projectile types.
Recent testing has demonstrated it is possible to shorten .338 Lap Mag 1/9.35 twist barrels from 27” to 20” and still maintain adequate accuracy to 2000 m.
.338 Lap Mag factory production sniper rifles are available from Accuracy International, Barrett, Prarie Gun Works, Remington, & Sako; custom rifles are also available from several vendors.
.338 Lap Mag factory ammunition is commercially available from Black Hills (current DOD contract), Hornady, HSM, Lapua, Nammo, Norma, Remington, Ruag, as well as several custom loaders.
.338 Lap Mag AP ammo is an area that can be further refined.
For long range anti-personel sniping, .338 Lap Mag has several advantages over most .50 BMG platforms, in particular the M82A1 and M107 Barrett semi-autos currently in use.
.338 Lap Mag systems are generally significantly more accurate than the M82A1 and M107.
.338 Lap Mag is easier to carry in the field, as most systems are half the weight of the .50 BMG Barrett.
Diego
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