Scaled Pac 40

[Lucas Orsborn]

Hi all

I want to scale down a German pak 40 feild gun to 50bmg. I’m struggling to find anything on the breech, does anyone have anything dimension wise or anything on the machanics. Worse case I’ll buy a plastic scale model and digitise it but that also has its problem.

Cheers
Lucas

 

[LeftyJason]

Hi all

I want to scale down a German pak 40 feild gun to 50bmg. I’m struggling to find anything on the breech, does anyone have anything dimension wise or anything on the machanics. Worse case I’ll buy a plastic scale model and digitise it but that also has its problem.

Cheers
Lucas

This might fit better in Vintage Sniper rifles section. @sirhrmechanic might have some info. I would consider him resident artillery expert (if I forgot anyone else I'm sorry).

 

[sirhrmechanic]

Hi all

I want to scale down a German pak 40 feild gun to 50bmg. I’m struggling to find anything on the breech, does anyone have anything dimension wise or anything on the machanics. Worse case I’ll buy a plastic scale model and digitise it but that also has its problem.

Cheers
Lucas

These will be back in Stock soon.

PAK 40 GERMAN ANTI TANK GUN - BY ARMORTEK - BUILD IT YOURSELF

Build your own 1:6 scale German WW2 PAK 40 anti tank gun, Made from CNC precision engineered aluminium, steel and brass parts.

www.armortek.co.uk

Instead of doing a BMG, with a bit of work, you can do a lower pressure center fire. They do make “blank firing kits” aftermarket. But you would obviously have to make a more barrel and breech.

I have one of these unbuilt… not for sale… but can send some pix and dimensions. They are big!

Here are some build threads.

Pak 40 - Armortek

www.armortek.co.uk

They come up in the WTB section of the Armortek Forum on occasion. If you want to contact a member, let me know and I am glad to PM them. You can’t join forum to post until you buy a kit. But I am glad to help.

You can e-mail Kian the owner is you want… tell him “The guy who built the Mirbat Gun” sent you.

Cheers and glad to help! Sirhr

 

[roostercogburn98]

These will be back in Stock soon.

PAK 40 GERMAN ANTI TANK GUN - BY ARMORTEK - BUILD IT YOURSELF

Build your own 1:6 scale German WW2 PAK 40 anti tank gun, Made from CNC precision engineered aluminium, steel and brass parts.

www.armortek.co.uk

Instead of doing a BMG, with a bit of work, you can do a lower pressure center fire. They do make “blank firing kits” aftermarket. But you would obviously have to make a more barrel and breech.

I have one of these unbuilt… not for sale… but can send some pix and dimensions. They are big!

Here are some build threads.

Pak 40 - Armortek

www.armortek.co.uk

They come up in the WTB section of the Armortek Forum on occasion. If you want to contact a member, let me know and I am glad to PM them. You can’t join forum to post until you buy a kit. But I am glad to help.

You can e-mail Kian the owner is you want… tell him “The guy who built the Mirbat Gun” sent you.

Cheers and glad to help! Sirhr

I want one in 410 or 20 gauge

 

[sirhrmechanic]

I want one in 410 or 20 gauge

So you guys know... none of these are made to fire. Aluminum barrels. Not bored. Aluminum breeches. They are display pieces.

That said... with some expert machining, new barrels, etc... and some good design work, they 'could' be made to fire. But Armortek is very cautious about that sort of thing. My suggestion is that the kit is a superb chassis and starting point. But you will need to create a recoil mechanism (I've done it) and a breech. I have not done it.

.410 would be realistic. IIRC, the 'cases' I did for the Mirbat guns were brass 24 gauge. Display only. But I wanted to make a recoil mechanism. So I did. Springs, not hydraulic. But both are feasible. Or use pneumatics. That might be the best way. Pump it up before firing.

I would not try and do one in .50 BMG!!!

That said, if someone wanted to do one in .50 BMG... one of these kits would be a great place to start to scale up, down or sideways. As I said, glad to share pictures, etc. Or if OP is in the Northeast... come visit and I'll show it to you.

Cheers,

Sirhr

 

[sirhrmechanic]

Hi all

I want to scale down a German pak 40 feild gun to 50bmg. I’m struggling to find anything on the breech, does anyone have anything dimension wise or anything on the machanics. Worse case I’ll buy a plastic scale model and digitise it but that also has its problem.

Cheers
Lucas

One more thing to think about... The Ordinance Museum at Aberdeen Proving Ground has (or had) very detailed 'enemy analysis' files, pictures, etc. Those are probably something you can request.

Also, the Elks Club in Franklin, New Hampshire has a PAK 40 in their front yard. Owned by the city. They don't want to sell it... I tried. They like their gun. But it is readily accessible. Right in the front yard. You can hang out with it, photograph it, measure it, etc. There are not a lot of those on public display in USA. But Franklin has an awesome one!

Post some pictures of your other models! Love to see what you have worked on!

Cheers,

Sirhr

 

[sirhrmechanic]

So an addition to my thoughts above....

I see the OP is in New Zealand. So that makes a visit here or to New Hampshire unlikely. ;-)

And realistically, I didn't think it would be practical to build a BMG model in NZ. Thought they went all 'commie no guns.' Maybe that's Australia. Anyway, regardless, it's an amazing project the OP has in mind. And there are ways to do it.

I will add this... now that I see that the OP is in NZ... One must be aware of ITAR regulations and so there may be some restrictions on sharing information such as the plans/designs I mentioned above that may be available at US Arsenal Museums. I don't 'know' if they may be restricted from sharing with you. But I would be cautious in any requests. I suspect that WW2 information isn't restricted. PAK 40 Technology is not exactly Gerald Bull level base-bleed shell info!

That said, I believe there is a PAK 40 at the Imperial War Museum site at Duxford, UK. I was just there. I am sure I saw one. And the IWM almost certainly is now the repository of the "competitive analysis" information. That or the Royal Artillery Museum at Woolrich may have the info. I know the British reverse-engineered the German PAK guns. But not sure where the information landed. Woolrich is probably the place. But they are closed. So try the IWM. There may "STILL" be ITAR restrictions... but within the Commonwealth, maybe things are a bit different.

Again... sounds like a really cool project! Within the realm of 'not' violating ITAR, I am glad to point you in the right directions. Sadly, I have little more than my kit and what is on the Armortek site. And some directions to send you in the USA. That may or may not share to NZ. Their call. You can't get in trouble for asking!!! Well probably not!

Cheers,

Sirhr

 

[sirhrmechanic]

@MarinePMI

Can you move into Vintage... this belongs there.

Cheers!

Sirhr

 

[Lucas Orsborn]

Hi sir

Thanks for all then info I’ve emailed amourtek and they aren’t doing a run of paks this year. I just need something to use as a reference and then beef up certain components to handle bmg. We’re not quite as bad as oz…. We can’t shoot semis or full autos but are able to own them under a collectors licences.

Thanks for all the help

Lucas

 

[MK20]

Hi sir

Thanks for all then info I’ve emailed amourtek and they aren’t doing a run of paks this year. I just need something to use as a reference and then beef up certain components to handle bmg. We’re not quite as bad as oz…. We can’t shoot semis or full autos but are able to own them under a collectors licences.

Thanks for all the help

Lucas

I would highly recommend using something other than 50 bmg. You will want a rim so I would look into a bunch of the African rounds or possibly a brass shotshell necked down.

Keep in mind that for what you want, exact reproduction of breech, barrel, and recoil components is not necessary. Function and form are what are desired.

 

[sirhrmechanic]

I would highly recommend using something other than 50 bmg. You will want a rim so I would look into a bunch of the African rounds or possibly a brass shotshell necked down.

Keep in mind that for what you want, exact reproduction of breech, barrel, and recoil components is not necessary. Function and form are what are desired.

^^^ This. I would do .45/70. Or an altogether smaller round. Lower pressure. The case was not really necked anyway. It was sort of tapered. A .45/70, .45/90 or a .45/110 would all approximate the original shell profile and all would be low pressure. Much easier to design a breech/barrel combination for vs. .50 BMG which is a very high-pressure round. And very hard on breeches!

Any of the .45 rounds are close in bore size; have a great taper; are readily available in terms of brass and dies; shoot a hand-cast lead slug; and don't have nearly the pressure issues and breech-design challenges of the .50.

Again, sounds like a super cool project!

Did Armortek tell you when they were putting the PAK out again? And if you watch the forum, those do come for sale...

PAK40 For sale - Armortek

This one for example. If you want me to 'contact' the seller on your behalf, I am glad to do so.

Cheers,

Sirhr

 

[Lucas Orsborn]

thanks for all the info. not sure if I conveyed it properly im not going to slap a big barrel on a model and go ham I need it purely for a reference.
my mate has a table of pressures that I can't find listing various peramiters that affect it all, ill try and find out later today.

nah armourtek didn't say anything about a production date just that this years production queue is full maybe more interest will generate a run?

cheers
Lucas

 

[MK20]

Being as you are in NZ, do check out Bertram Brass' offerings as it will likely be more accessible for you vs US stuff due to ITAR.

 

[MarinePMI]

@MarinePMI

Can you move into Vintage... this belongs there.

Cheers!

Sirhr

Done.