Short barrel rifle for long range shooting??

[BgBmBoo]

I have looked searched and looked over many post here...and remember seeing topics about this. But can't dig up anything.

So....here it is. I recently modified a rifle to use for coyote hunting (.243 cal.). Main mod was chopping the barrel down to 16 1/4" to make a fast handling, easy to carry rifle.

It shoots awesome....sub 1/2" five shot groups at 100yrds...with factory ammo. I put the rifle together expecting most of my shooting to be under 300yrds.

Not that I will be using it to make long range shots...but I do wonder about what would be the "limit" that a short barrel rifle like this is?
I know I have sacrificed velocity for having a handy rifle. How much velocity seems to very from different web sources to the next. Some say 20-40 FPS per inch of barrel and some say as much as 100+ FPS per inch.

Input from those of you who shoot short barrel rifles and results would be great.

Take care,Stan


Here is a pic of the rifle:

 

[jasonk]

Re: Short barrel rifle for long range shooting??

Looks like a handy little truck rifle, perfect for the yotes in your area. That's yotes....not yutes.

 

[BgBmBoo]

Re: Short barrel rifle for long range shooting??

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jasonk</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Looks like a handy little truck rifle, perfect for the yotes in your area. That's yotes....not yutes. </div></div>

Well if the "YUTES" try and scalp me it will be handy for that as well!!

 

[MontanaMarine]

Re: Short barrel rifle for long range shooting??

I'd imagine a 95gr Berger VLD at 2800 fps is realistic. With a BC of .515 it should make 1000 yards easily. (1500+ fps remaining in local atmo conditions, 4500' el.)

I'm tossing 155 Scenar(BC .505 and some say it's a bit less) at 2800 fps. They make it past 1K yards. I've had it out to 1150 ringing steel.

Essentially you should be able to launch a bullet with a little higher BC, at equal velocity.

 

[skeetlee]

Re: Short barrel rifle for long range shooting??

I am really disappointed that you dint include your little sweetie in the picture of the rifle. LOL I really like your rifle and it looks ideal for the type of hunting we do around here. I had a tikka varmint in 22-250 and it shot pretty good, but i hated the stock!! Who is making a decent tactical type stock for the tikkas these days. How loud is the rifle you have? I had a 16" bull barrel ar and that thing was just to damn loud to hunt with. I sold it even though i like. Lee

 

[FCS]

Re: Short barrel rifle for long range shooting??

Every barrel, caliber, powder/bullet combination is a bit different. Only way to really tell is a chronograph.

243 AI in a bolt rifle I could easily get 3180 fps with 107 SMK (could go faster but not with accuracy I wanted) from a 28" barrel.

243 AI in a gas gun I am getting 2950 fps from a 22" barrel with a very similar load.

Probably drop another 200 fps going from down to 16 1/4" if running same burn rate powder. Probably could recover some velocity if you went next step faster in burn rate.

Know anybody with a chronograph? Would be interesting to know what velocity you are getting from the 16 1/4" barrel.

FPS lost/in will increase at increasing rate as you shorten the barrel, more prenounced the more overbore the cartridge.

 

[edgerat]

Re: Short barrel rifle for long range shooting??

"what is a yute?"

Bamboo does that Tikka shoot as good as people say they do??? Are those groups from handloads or factory loads?
Isaac

 

[Ridgerunner665]

Re: Short barrel rifle for long range shooting??

I can only get 2600 fps from my sons 20 inch 243 with 100 grain bullets...and thats with 44.5 grains of RL19. 3000 fps from an 85 grain Barnes TSX with 48 grains of RL19.(darn good deer load there)

In my limited experience...the 243 suffers REALLY bad when you cut the barrel (up to 100 fps per inch, with heavy bullets).

With a custom barrel that had a tight chamber and a good (short) throat...you MIGHT be able to get 2,500 fps from that 95 grain Berger VLD out of that 16 1/4" barrel.

The 243 is a fine long range round...but I think it need at least 24 inches of barrel to be a serious competitor.

 

[BgBmBoo]

Re: Short barrel rifle for long range shooting??

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: edgerat</div><div class="ubbcode-body">"what is a yute?"

Bamboo does that Tikka shoot as good as people say they do??? Are those groups from handloads or factory loads?
Isaac </div></div>

Well I took it as him mis-spelling UTE indian's.

Yes...this is my third Tikka. I own one in .223 and the .243. I sold my Tactical model in .308 after I bought my TRG.

They will out shoot my TRG. My TRG is a solid 1/2" at 100 yrd five shot group rifle and my Tikka's will shoot 2ub 1/2" five shot groups at 100yrds.
All my shooting is done with factory ammo...I do not hand load...The .243 groups pictured here were shot with Hornady 75gr. HP ammo.
I pulled the 3rd shot (as seen in the top pic) as I was freezing my ass off that morning. It was 35 deg. with a 15+ mph wind blowing and I was shooting from the prone on frozen ground.

The 3rd and 4th pic are of my Tikka in .223 and again...with factory ammo (Black Hills 50gr Vmax).

SKEETLEE.....as for being loud...I always wear hearing protection...even when I hunt. So it is a non issue for me.
Take care,Stan

 

[hornsurgeon]

Re: Short barrel rifle for long range shooting??

i wouldn't worry about the lost velocity for what you are looking to do. it is plenty accurate. the loss of velocity should only affect your drop. shot at longer ranges, learn the drop, and hit what you shoot at. the only thing to watch for is passing the sound barrier. some loads will destabalize as they pass thru, then most will restabilize somewhere past that. i don't think you have to worry about that unless you are shooting WAY out there.

 

[BgBmBoo]

Re: Short barrel rifle for long range shooting??

I am not really worried about...just a bit curious and would like to hear from other shooters using short barrel rifles.

I did find a article about the L.A. SWAT sniper using a 18" barreled rifle plus some studies done where they cut off a inch of barrel to see what the effect would be.

For me it is what I wanted...and I am all about shot placement when hunting. Here is a short clip of a yote I bagged recently:

<object width="425" height="350"> <param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/NqaZfq9BSMY"></param> <param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param> <embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/NqaZfq9BSMY" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"> </embed></object>


Take care,Stan

 

[skeetlee]

Re: Short barrel rifle for long range shooting??

nice groups! I tried wearing ear protection while hunting, but i felt like i was handicapped by doing so. I was loosing some balance while trying to stalk through the timber, resulting in making more noise than i wanted. Just didnt work for me. Are your tikkas heavy barrel rifles? After seeing this post it re-kindles and old flame! Thanks lee

 

[Luke]

Re: Short barrel rifle for long range shooting??

Why not take it out and shoot it at 300, 600, 800, 1000yds and see how it performs? You should be able to find out the limits of your rifle in about 20 rounds

 

[ker2222]

Re: Short barrel rifle for long range shooting??

Tag

 

[Boltfluter]

Re: Short barrel rifle for long range shooting??

Great video Stan. Hard to beat a Tikka at any price. I think you will love the short barrel for hunting. Very handy and a tack driver.

Regards,
Paul

 

[ken226]

Re: Short barrel rifle for long range shooting??

The barrels diameter to length ratio determines how stiff it is and determines the speed and duration of its vibration harmonices/accuracy node. As a general rule, shorter thicker barrels are more accurate, and require less load tuning to get good results.

As long as you don't need the velocity, short barrels rock.

 

[sinister]

Re: Short barrel rifle for long range shooting??

There's a trade-off when using shorter barrels.

Ballistic (artillery and mortar) theory holds that you should use the minimum powder charge for the velocity you want for a specific weight projo at a certain distance or range (giving the user minimum elevation arc and to minimize group dispersion). If you go with a shorter barrel, to get the same velocity (to keep the bullet stable) you may need to up the charge.

A faster spin (imparted by rifling twist) will help keep the bullet stable with a lower velocity, thus the benefit (say for a .308) of going from a 1-12 twist to a 1-10. A faster twist also allows the use of a longer or heavier bullet with better BC. A tighter bore (say an Obermyer .298 vice an industry .300) will also help to raise your internal pressure for a fixed charge.

This is for EXTREME ranges. Cutting a barrel off to 16 inches may not affect the way you shoot or your desired/expected group sizes, depending on bullet length, shape, weight, and barrel twist.

 

[seanh]

Re: Short barrel rifle for long range shooting??

try some Varget next time you reload...

Varget doesn't give you anything worth writing about in a longer barreled gun but can make up some of the velocity difference in the shorter barrels.

Ok, just saw where you don't reload...you should consider starting.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: skeetlee</div><div class="ubbcode-body">nice groups! I tried wearing ear protection while hunting, but i felt like i was handicapped by doing so. I was loosing some balance while trying to stalk through the timber, resulting in making more noise than i wanted. Just didnt work for me. Are your tikkas heavy barrel rifles? After seeing this post it re-kindles and old flame! Thanks lee</div></div>

Get some electric protection or the valve type ear plugs...forget what they're called...they're ear plugs with a valve that closes upon shock-wave hitting them but you can hear normally the rest of the time.

not exactly what I'm remembering but here are a few
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Surefire-Earpro-...=item53f27f8933

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Tac-Ear-Electron...=item2c6b2e9e1c

http://www.ultimateear.com/products/reactear.php

 

[gopherslayer]

Re: Short barrel rifle for long range shooting??

anyone notice the date for the OP. it's 4 years old.