Shoulder Bump Affect on Velocity/SD

parshal

Private
Supporter
Full Member
Minuteman
Supporter
Feb 13, 2017
1,360
570
Colorado
I did a small test today. Granted, the sample size isn't large but there's enough there to draw some conclusions for more testing.

I loaded 60.3 grains of H1000 in my 6.5 SS using Norma brass. It's all from the same lot. Cases were measured with a Sinclair 40 degree bump insert. All loads were measured on an FX120 using grams (3.901) for more accuracy.

Fired cases measure 2.523-2.525
Four loaded cases measured 2.5195
Four loaded cases measured 2.516-2.517
I had one case at 2.521 so went ahead and loaded it

Results over the Magnetospeed at 30 degrees in the order fired. There was about 90 seconds between each 'group'. All loaded rounds easily chambered with no resistance.

2.5195" - 3193, 3198, 3202, 3213; SD 8.4
2.516/17" - 3198, 3199, 3198, 3210; SD 5.8
2.521" - 3174

The first thing I noticed was the fourth shot on the four shot strings were faster. I went back through my data book and found this to be a pattern. Longer shot strings over the Magnetospeed produce higher average velocities. I usually shoot a whole string straight through. I may stop doing that and give things time to cool to get a more accurate velocity.

The second group measures .0035" shorter at the shoulder than the longer ones. The velocities were more consistent even excluding the fourth shot of each string.

The last shot is noticeably slower than the others. None of the others were slower than 3193 and this one was 19 fps slower than the slowest shot in the other strings.

More testing is needed but, for velocity, it would seem my rifle likes .005 - .006" shoulder bump vs tighter.

H1000 seems to produce the lowest SD for all the tested charges when compared to N570, R26 and R23.

Incidentally, I loaded 60 grains of H1000 yesterday and shot it at 10 degrees after leaving the rifle and loaded rounds outside for an hour. The average for 5 shots was 3176 with an SD of 5.6. That same charge at 49 degrees gave me 3196 with an SD of 6.4. Note, these two strings were loaded at different times so it's not an apples to apples comparison. But, that's a loss of 20 fps from cold to frigid.

60.3 of H1000 at 51 degrees gave me 3213 with an SD of 3.4 and .331" group and another of .682 with an SD of 3.4. This is a gain of 11 fps going from 30 to 51 degrees.
 
I try to bump .001-.002 off the biggest measurement, for you 2.525. I would consider your bump to be in the .7-.8 range. You prefaced it perfectly by saying your sample size is not big enough. You a drawing a hasty conclusion that is more than likely false. The certain thing in this matter is, bumping the shoulder like that is going to lead to early case head separations.
 
I'm going to repeat the test today with a larger sample size. Curiosity is too much.

Note, I can't close the bolt without some resistance on a 2.522 shoulder.
 
yea... many other variables and your sample sizes are way too small. you need to shoot 20-25 shot strings of each sample then post your results. you will notice there is no measurable difference.

Too many guys putting too much stake and drawing too many conclusions lately off 3 and 5 shot strings over a chrono. for real numbers shoot at least 25rds.....bolt gun you should be bumping. 001-.002. I bump .0015" and have consistent SD's sub 5 in my custom bolt guns.
 
yea... many other variables and your sample sizes are way too small. you need to shoot 20-25 shot strings of each sample then post your results. you will notice there is no measurable difference.

Too many guys putting too much stake and drawing too many conclusions lately off 3 and 5 shot strings over a chrono. for real numbers shoot at least 25rds.....bolt gun you should be bumping. 001-.002. I bump .0015" and have consistent SD's sub 5 in my custom bolt guns.
25 string? No cooling off barrel? That would burn quick
 
yes 25 shots. nobody said anything about rapid fire in a row. your making assumptions. when I shoot 5 shot groups at distance I'll shoot 2 five shot groups at 300 then 2 5 shot groups at 500 then a five shot group on steel at 700. all over the Labradar.

here's 28 shots testing the prototype barrel for Patriot Valley Arms that's gonna be used on the new John Hancock rifle.

 
I be
yes 25 shots. nobody said anything about rapid fire in a row. your making assumptions. when I shoot 5 shot groups at distance I'll shoot 2 five shot groups at 300 then 2 5 shot groups at 500 then a five shot group on steel at 700. all over the Labradar.

here's 28 shots testing the prototype barrel for Patriot Valley Arms that's gonna be used on the new John Hancock rifle.


I believe i used a question mark there buddy :)
 
I'm going to repeat the test today with a larger sample size.
Wise choice. Your sample size is too small to draw well formed conclusions. As mentioned above, you should do it over a minimum of 20 rounds.

As a side note for general load development: A low number of shots may tell you if you have a bad load, but it can't tell you if you have a good load.
 
Last edited:
Well, luckily, I work from home and can shoot off my porch so it's pretty easy to test for velocity.

I'd agree 20-25 shots per sample would be ideal but I just happened to have this brass sized differently and decided to test it.

Today I shot 60.1 grains of H1000 at 26 degrees. Everything sat outside and I waited 10 minutes between each 'string'. Anything more than five shots was broken into two groups. I had two batches of brass processed at two different times so I kept those separate even though the lot of brass was the same. This is all in the order fired.

2.519 - 3182, 3191, 3192; SD 5.3
2.517 - 3187, 3208, 3215, 3212; SD 12.6
2.515 - 3195, 3196, 3195, 3189, 3193; SD 1.3

Next batch

2.515 - 3202, 3205, 3204; SD 1.7
2.520-2.522 - 3183, 3202, 3217, 3193; SD 14.4
2.519 - 3176, 3202, 3197, 3209, 3185; SD 13.2
2.517 - 3182, 3195, 3202, 3184, 3205, 3211; SD 11.6

Even this low sample size test of two different batches of brass show the 2.515" with better SD just like yesterday. I'd much prefer having seen the longer cases look better!
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Hussell