Terminal Performance for Elk

[fmillik]

Anyone know of a resource to research the minimum/maximum fps for optimal bullet terminal performance?

I’m looking to find a 7mm bullet that’s optimal performance is between 2000-2600 fps on game as large as elk.

 

[fmillik]

Yes.

 

[Sniperwannabee]

Just call Berger, they have awesome customer service . I’m sure any major hunting bulletin will work

 

[Rthur]

Got one for the hunting section.
@padom , @MarinePMI

R

 

[Average guy]

A Nosler partition would be my first choice

 

[usmc45]

Hammer Hunters

 

[C.Hazelton]

Try the knowledgebase at ballisticstudies.com

 

[nso123]

Hammer Hunter or Absolute Hammer.

 

[chevy_man]

A Nosler partition would be my first choice

Yup. 115 .257 has dumped them for me.


We've also had 100% kill rate with 130 accubonds out of 6.5 Creed, and the 110 accubond in the 25-06.


You don't need a freight train to tip an elk. Any reasonable bullet placed in the lungs will work.

 

[hafejd30]

ELDX

 

[Mavrykk]

I've seen a .243 with core-loks drop an elk @200yrds.
Try not to over think things.

 

[Jgunner]

We have used bergers exclusively for years. They are amazing. Even at long distances and lower than ideal velocities, they continue to amaze us.

 

[Dirty D]

Yup. 115 .257 has dumped them for me.


We've also had 100% kill rate with 130 accubonds out of 6.5 Creed, and the 110 accubond in the 25-06.


You don't need a freight train to tip an elk. Any reasonable bullet placed in the lungs will work.

A friend grew up in MT and laughs at hunters that think a 300WM is the minimum to kill an elk. Patrick filled his tags every year with a 270 and whatever cheap ass ammo was on the shelf at WalMart

 

[Dirty D]

We have used bergers exclusively for years. They are amazing. Even at long distances and lower than ideal velocities, they continue to amaze us.

I took a class from a retired CAG operator and SOTIC instructor, he said the terminal performance of the 215 Berger on live humans (relatively thin skinned targets) even down to subsonic velocities was impressive and devastating.

 

[Govt Mule]

Best hunting bullets made for big game is Swift A-frames. 95% retention of bullet weight whatever they hit. Partition on steroids...

 

[Jgunner]

I took a class from a retired CAG operator and SOTIC instructor, he said the terminal performance of the 215 Berger on live humans (relatively thin skinned targets) even down to subsonic velocities was impressive and devastating.

I can imagine. Ive seen what they do to multiple coyotes stacked shoulder to shoulder at 200 yards, it looked likea grenade went off between them

 

[fmillik]

Try the knowledgebase at ballisticstudies.com

I have found his data and explanations to be great.

 

[spamassassin]

Perhaps if the question was better the responses could be more helpful. The kind of meh answers you're getting is a sign that the question is poorly constructed. First of all, that's a HUGEASS velocity window. 2600fps is pretty spanky for an impact velocity. Pretty much any expanding bullet will expand at that kind of impact speed. Problem is, it's a bit much for some bullets. As an example for me, SST's routinely shed the jacket hitting elk size game at that kind of speed and even a good bit under 2600fps. 2000fps might not be enough for some really tough bullets to expand more than a token amount but it's enough to open up or fragment most anything designed to open up or fragment that's not in the ridiculously tough category like some (but certainly not all) monolithic copper hunting bullets. Use core-lokt, it worked for quite a number of decades. If you don't like those, I particularly like Nosler Partition and Swift A-Frame.

 

[fmillik]

A friend grew up in MT and laughs at hunters that think a 300WM is the minimum to kill an elk. Patrick filled his tags every year with a 270 and whatever cheap ass ammo was on the shelf at WalMart

I had a 300 prc that I originally bought for elk, but now I just use for shooting steel. To shoot comfortably, the rifle weighs around 13.5 lbs, which is impractical for backcountry hunting. I’ve also found shooting game beyond 600 yards tends to have substandard results, and you need a fair amount of distance to make carrying such a massive rifle worthwhile.

So instead, I’m putting together a 6 lb, 7mm-SAW with an 18.5” barrel. With a 160/8 gr bullet, it maintains 1500 ft-lbs of pressure out to 400 yards, which is the distance I’m limiting myself to.

I’m hoping to still have sufficient KE as well as bullet performance to maximize lethality.

(Plus it’s just fun to research)

 

[fmillik]

Perhaps if the question was better the responses could be more helpful. The kind of meh answers you're getting is a sign that the question is poorly constructed. First of all, that's a HUGEASS velocity window. 2600fps is pretty spanky for an impact velocity. Pretty much any expanding bullet will expand at that kind of impact speed. Problem is, it's a bit much for some bullets. As an example for me, SST's routinely shed the jacket hitting elk size game at that kind of speed and even a good bit under 2600fps. 2000fps might not be enough for some really tough bullets to expand more than a token amount but it's enough to open up or fragment most anything designed to open up or fragment that's not in the ridiculously tough category like some (but certainly not all) monolithic copper hunting bullets. Use core-lokt, it worked for quite a number of decades. If you don't like those, I particularly like Nosler Partition and Swift A-Frame.

It’s the FPS range my bullet will be traveling at the distances I’m limiting myself to.

I understand some bullets perform best at very high speeds (monolithic) while others fragment too much prior to getting good penetration at high speeds.

So I’m trying to find the bullet that best performs between the listed speeds.

 

[Lazyninja]

Another for the hammers

 

[_Windrider_]

@velayo_0317 says 6.5 creedmoor is the best elk round. Hands down.

 

[fmillik]

Yup. 115 .257 has dumped them for me.


We've also had 100% kill rate with 130 accubonds out of 6.5 Creed, and the 110 accubond in the 25-06.


You don't need a freight train to tip an elk. Any reasonable bullet placed in the lungs will work.

Read an article by Ron Spomer on the 257 Roberts. Had never even heard of the cartridge before yesterday.

 

[Im2bent]

Dude why take chances? This will not only kill it DRT but it will process the meat and cook it for you. 5 min after you pull the trigger you're macking on elk burgers.

 

[eca7891]

Any bonded or copper “ solid “ would work.

I used a Berger on mine with really good results. 4”-5” or penetration then it was like a grenade went off. Make sure you do a chest shot if you go with those otherwise you will be tossing sone of the meat from lead fragments.

 

[ma smith]

+1 The is a non-bonded bullet going to hold together? Looks like 2600fps is @ 100 yds...?

This below is interpolated from 7mm x 168gr to 180gr load data.

Projectile: 175gr Hybrid/Elite Hunter x 7MM
Cartridge: RSAUM
Load Data: Vit. N560 max @ ~2,850 FPS
Terminal FPS: 2600 - 2000 FPS
Terinal Distance: 100 - 700yd

 

[spamassassin]

It’s the FPS range my bullet will be traveling at the distances I’m limiting myself to.

I understand some bullets perform best at very high speeds (monolithic) while others fragment too much prior to getting good penetration at high speeds.

So I’m trying to find the bullet that best performs between the listed speeds.

That's exactly what I'm getting at. That 600fps represents anything from not much distance at all to quite a long distance depending on the BC of the bullet. It's probably better if you tell us what chambering and distance and then we can do the thinking work.

 

[jbuck88]

I load the 130gr accubonds for my 74yo FIL to hunt with. I've been very impressed with that bullet so far. If you're wondering about lower impact velocities then I might consider the LR line. I couldn't find any to help my kid for his 28Nos. So I grabbed a box of 175 ELD-x to try.

I know I would have preferred a bonded bullet though, or I'm a huge fan of the partitions if you don't need the BC.

 

[BytorJr]

Read an article by Ron Spomer on the 257 Roberts. Had never even heard of the cartridge before yesterday.

I actually have shot a 257. Very mild recoil; and apparently a hell of a deer cartridge. Probably best to reload your own because bullet selection isn't great in factory ammo (especially now). There are some relatively high BC bullets now too that a "Bob" should be able to push without going too heavy (say 130g I think). Great < 300 yard gun. Stylish nowdays...hell no; but cool nonetheless (IMO).

 

[chevy_man]

Read an article by Ron Spomer on the 257 Roberts. Had never even heard of the cartridge before yesterday.

Guess I should have clarified. I'm pushing the 115s 3200 out of a 25-06.

I have shot deer with a .257 Roberts, but that was with the older 100grn ballistic tips and they were unreliable on exit wounds.

 

[Oryx]

Ive put down numerous elk with 7MM - all with the 140 Barnes MRX. excellent bullet and will mushroom and retain most mass at those speeds. While it may not have the highest BC of the 7MM's it is very accurate

 

[Wyfox]

I've killed a lot of elk with Accubond's in 6.5mm and 30cal varieties.
My go to bullet for hunting.

 

[db2000]

If saving 5 pounds on a rifle is a must, good luck packing an elk out of a canyon in CO. That being said I used a 300 WBY Mag and it worked fine at 515 yd and 180 gr Accubond. Most the other suggestions are fine inside that distance. The guy that owned the land shot everything with a 30-06

 

[BCP]

A Nosler partition would be my first choice

Yeah too bad they are a dollar apiece or some stupid shit.

I killed my first elk with a nosler partition. Best hunting bullet out there imho.

I have 60 remington cor lokts around here, that's more elk than I'll ever shoot in a lifetime.

 

[Average guy]

Yeah too bad they are a dollar apiece or some stupid shit.

I killed my first elk with a nosler partition. Best hunting bullet out there imho.

I have 60 remington cor lokts around here, that's more elk than I'll ever shoot in a lifetime.

After seeing my dad shoot a deer with a 30-06 with 200 partition, I was a believer at a young age. It was a 300 plus yard shot semi quartered away. Bullet entered through the ribs jellied the heart and lungs and exited with a baseball size hole through the brisket. Figuring the velocity it was traveling at time of impact it thoroughly impressive. Not a Texas deer but a large 6 year old Wyoming whitetail. Many elk fell from the same load in the years that followed.

 

[zeroz]

The barnes TTSX/ LRX will expand from 2800 down to 1700ish. The barnes offerings are awesome. Ive only recovered one ever. It was a 168TTSX out of an '06 that still weighed 159 after a steep uphill frontal shot. After punching in the chest it ended up in against the hide at the top of the back after about 36" of penetration. DRT. Im a big fan of not spattering the meat with lead when the bullets fall apart. I have seen many fall to the 127 Lrx, including one this year with a grendel that only went 20 yards, so yeah you dont need a magnum to kill an elk. I always giggle at the 1500ft/lbs minimum thing. I think my arrow has 50 ft /lbs and kills the shit out of them. Guys that say they need a magnum want to be able to shoot them in ass and watch em drop I guess. Poke a hole in the middle of both lungs is all you need to do, turning them to gel is just a bonus.

 

[RedTimber]

The barnes TTSX/ LRX will expand from 2800 down to 1700ish. The barnes offerings are awesome. Ive only recovered one ever. It was a 168TTSX out of an '06 that still weighed 159 after a steep uphill frontal shot. After punching in the chest it ended up in against the hide at the top of the back after about 36" of penetration. DRT. Im a big fan of not spattering the meat with lead when the bullets fall apart. I have seen many fall to the 127 Lrx, including one this year with a grendel that only went 20 yards, so yeah you dont need a magnum to kill an elk. I always giggle at the 1500ft/lbs minimum thing. I think my arrow has 50 ft /lbs and kills the shit out of them. Guys that say they need a magnum want to be able to shoot them in ass and watch em drop I guess. Poke a hole in the middle of both lungs is all you need to do, turning them to gel is just a bonus.

But its just so fun to saw through the sternum and see nothing but strawberry jam inside

 

[SouthFork]

Depends. Know guys that still shoot them with Core-Lokts. They seem to tip them over every year.

I have used Accubonds, Partitions, AFrames and Barnes X. All tipped elk over too. Mostly they were shot with 180grs out of a .300win.

If you hit them in the hind end. They don’t seem to die. If you hit them through the lungs or heart they tip over pretty quickly.

Shot placement seems to be more important than velocity to me.

 

[Ndbowhunter]

162gr eld-m and the amax before it is what ur after.

full stop.

 

[usmc45]

Bergers and ELDX's both work great and I have always had 100% with Bergers but i got tired of the meat damage. I get the same result from Hammers with much less tissue damage and meat loss.

 

[jbuck88]

Bergers and ELDX's both work great and I have always had 100% with Bergers but i got tired of the meat damage. I get the same result from Hammers with much less tissue damage and meat loss.

Based on what I've seen with the 143ELDx on deer it wouldn't be my first choice on Elk. They are fantastically accurate bullets, but not the best for penitrating for close range.

Full disclosure I hunt with a 300wsm and my uncle had around 39 elk killed with his 30-30 and 170gr corelocked.

 

[XTREM HTR16]

Berger 175 elite hunter works great on elk out of my 7 SAUM.

 

[168BTHPM]

A friend grew up in MT and laughs at hunters that think a 300WM is the minimum to kill an elk. Patrick filled his tags every year with a 270 and whatever cheap ass ammo was on the shelf at WalMart

Shot placement over caliber always, however I grew up in MT and only hunt with a .300WM using 180gr Nosler Partitions, unless I am in grizzly country then I carry my .375 H&H using 300gr Woodleigh Weldcores. I do know a lot of people that hunt with .308, .270 and .30-06 that kill stuff almost every year.

 

[chevy_man]

Yeah too bad they are a dollar apiece or some stupid shit.

I killed my first elk with a nosler partition. Best hunting bullet out there imho.

I have 60 remington cor lokts around here, that's more elk than I'll ever shoot in a lifetime.

Have you seen prices lately?

That's not abnormal.

 

[eca7891]

A dollar a piece for a lifetime of elk bullets.

I don’t see the problem.

 

[db2000]

A dollar a piece for a lifetime of elk bullets.

I don’t see the problem.

That’s what I was thinking
$3000-$5000 elk hunt. $1-$10 in bullets

 

[Oryx]

That’s what I was thinking
$3000-$5000 elk hunt. $1-$10 in bullets

You don't have to spend $3000-$5000 on an elk hunt. I hunted elk for almost 20 years and I would bet that I didn't spend $3000 total ..... never paid for a hunt

...But I get what you're saying about the bullet price.

 

[db2000]

You don't have to spend $3000-$5000 on an elk hunt. I hunted elk for almost 20 years and I would bet that I didn't spend $3000 total ..... never paid for a hunt

...But I get what you're saying about the bullet price.

I get it. Must be nice!
Hell, my tag was $675 and this was a friend of a friend putting us up for a week for $1000. Unfortunately I’m also on east coast so after driving once I just start flying.

 

[Oryx]

Everyone has a little different opportunity and story, but things are definitely getting more expensive!
I had excellent access, resident prices ( in some case free tags), a remote cabin and often would just hunt cows for meat. Never a need for a guided hunt.