Rifle Scopes The difference between FFP & SFP Leupold reticles

[BigBrother]

I've used a number of Leupold Mark 4s, and I've noticed that the ones that are FFP have a reticle that remains solid black, but SFP ones have a weird "browning" reticle that changes colors based on the shade underneath it, as seen here:

Anyone know what gives with the difference? Also, I've observed all this with variable mag Mark 4s- anyone know which (solid or color-shifting) the fixed mag ones have?

Thanks.

 

[Jon A]

Re: The difference between FFP & SFP Leupold reticles

The main difference is where the reticles are located. The SFP reticles are right in the eyepiece and it's much easier for stray light (even reflected off your face) to enter the ocular and "light up" the reticle, turning it brownish. If you cup your hands making a tube between your eye and the eyepiece so no stray light can get in the reticle will turn black again.

I believe the location of the FFP reticles makes it much more difficult for this stray light to get to them so all else being equal they remain darker and blacker which in my opinion makes them much easier to see under such conditions.

This isn't just a Leupold thing; I've noticed the same difference with IOR SFP/FFP scopes. The FFP reticles are blacker and easier to see in many different lighting conditions.

There are other differences beyond the above "all else equal" comparison. For example Zeiss SFP reticles tend to stay black better than many other brands' SFP reticles. How it's physically made can make a difference.

 

[BigBrother]

Re: The difference between FFP & SFP Leupold reticles

That's bizarre though- I've seen plenty of SFP scopes, even dirt cheap ones at gun shows (Barska and worse) that remain perfectly black. I've never really seen this "browning" phenomenon with others. Frankly I can't understand how people don't have issue with it- to me it's really distracting.

In any case, anyone know if the fixed-mag Mark 4s have this? I recall looking through an M3 on a real M24 at a base once and I think it was solid. Anyone?

 

[BobinNC]

Re: The difference between FFP & SFP Leupold reticles

BigBrother,

Leupold uses wire reticles in most of their scopes. A wire reticle will show "browning". A glass etched reticle will not show "browning", and remain black.

Bob

 

[palma]

Re: The difference between FFP & SFP Leupold reticles

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BobinNC</div><div class="ubbcode-body">BigBrother,

Leupold uses wire reticles in most of their scopes. A wire reticle will show "browning". A glass etched reticle will not show "browning", and remain black.

Bob </div></div>

A glass etched reticle will appear brown if lightly etched. One of the only two USOs that I will ever own appeared brown in certain places and was even translucent in others. You could actually see through parts of the reticle. Twas in spec....or so I was told.

 

[Jon A]

Re: The difference between FFP & SFP Leupold reticles

Not necessarily. While etched reticles may be less prone to it, it can and does still happen. As I mentioned, the SFP IORs do it and they're etched. I don't know if Leupold still makes their standard Mildot from wire, but their newer tactical reticles (such as TMR) are etched.

 

[BigBrother]

Re: The difference between FFP & SFP Leupold reticles

Well, in that case, can anyone provide a through-the-glass shot of a fixed mag Mark 4, preferably against a light bg?

 

[BobinNC]

Re: The difference between FFP & SFP Leupold reticles

Jon,

From Leupold:

<span style="font-style: italic">The Leupold Answer Guide

Why does the reticle sometimes appear amber?

This condition is normal. You are seeing light refractions reflecting off the pressed portion of the reticle. The condition is most noticeable when light enters the eyepiece of the scope at about 65 to 90 degree angle to the scope. Due to polish marks on the die that presses the reticle configuration, there may be bright areas and dark areas of the reticle wire.

Why does my reticle turn gold?

Most of our reticles are made of wire. The duplex reticle, for example is made of platinum. The wide posts of the reticles are made by pressing the wire flat. When installed in the scope the reticle is located in the eyepiece of the scope. Under some conditions, such as shooting with the sun behind you, light will enter the eyepiece of the scope and reflect off the reticle wire causing it to appear gold. Sometimes light will reflect off the shooters face and back on to the reticle resulting in the gold appearance.</span>

I don't know which reticles that Leupold uses that are glass etched. Perhaps the TMR is. I do know the early Ultra's had etched glass reticles, that why Leupold would not change them, as they were glued in.

Bob

 

[Jon A]

Re: The difference between FFP & SFP Leupold reticles

Wow, they've actually put on their FAQ what some die-hard L<span style="font-weight: bold">E</span>upold faithful used to not admit would happen at all! Cool.

And don't get me wrong, the wire Leupold reticles are about the worst I've seen in this aspect. I was just trying to point out etched aren't necessarily immune to it, and putting them in the FFP helps even more.

 

[BobinNC]

Re: The difference between FFP & SFP Leupold reticles

Jon A,

Not, disagreeing with you at all. If glass etched SFP reticles display this characteristic as well that's good to know. I always thought it was limited to wire reticles.

Thanks,

Bob