The SHC 2014 was my first match and I have to say it was fun to be a part of. I hope to be part of this awesome event as an RO for as long as I can and for as long as they are being held. I have never competed before and know very little about long range shooting. Like any sport/art form/job, event there seems to be a lot of lingo that is used. Can the shooters start posting some of the terms and definitions that are used in long distance shooting? I had noticed that many of the same things were called different things so help me to learn what the standard terms are.
Sniper’s Hide Cup The lingo? Questions from the RO of A4 SHC 2014
- Thread starter Pstiffler1748
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Can you be specific about which terms you are referring to? Would help us explain them to you...
Heres a few-
Mils - Mil radian - Metric unit of measurement inside of a scope or point of impact change/shift = 1cm @ 100m
MOA - Minute of Angle - Same as above in Standard 1" @100 yards'
DOPE - Data of previous engagement - (Information used to make future shots)
Zero - Your ability to make an accurate shot from "zeroed" gun that has been sighted in properly.
"Seconds" - Speed of your projectile in Feet per a second
"Drop" - How much your round will fall at a specificfyard line based on power and speed
"Hold" - How much you will off set aim to impact your intended target.
Chono - Measuring your projo's speed
Projo - Projectile
"DA" - Density Altitude - The measurement of elevation and air pressure to give you the altitude your round thinks it is seeing
BC - Ballistic Coefficient - A standard model based of a G1 or G7 curve profile to measure how well your round travels through air medium
"Subsonic" - A Projectile that slows down past the speed of sound at a given altitude - Generally around 1100 FPS.
"Supersonic" - The above in reverse
"Destabilize" - The distance or velocity at which a round will not fly centric. Decreases accuracy.
And Finally...
Minutia - The amount of opinions everyone has to arrive at the same result which generally will cause butt pain at some point to include the definitions I listed above
Mils - Mil radian - Metric unit of measurement inside of a scope or point of impact change/shift = 1cm @ 100m
MOA - Minute of Angle - Same as above in Standard 1" @100 yards'
DOPE - Data of previous engagement - (Information used to make future shots)
Zero - Your ability to make an accurate shot from "zeroed" gun that has been sighted in properly.
"Seconds" - Speed of your projectile in Feet per a second
"Drop" - How much your round will fall at a specificfyard line based on power and speed
"Hold" - How much you will off set aim to impact your intended target.
Chono - Measuring your projo's speed
Projo - Projectile
"DA" - Density Altitude - The measurement of elevation and air pressure to give you the altitude your round thinks it is seeing
BC - Ballistic Coefficient - A standard model based of a G1 or G7 curve profile to measure how well your round travels through air medium
"Subsonic" - A Projectile that slows down past the speed of sound at a given altitude - Generally around 1100 FPS.
"Supersonic" - The above in reverse
"Destabilize" - The distance or velocity at which a round will not fly centric. Decreases accuracy.
And Finally...
Minutia - The amount of opinions everyone has to arrive at the same result which generally will cause butt pain at some point to include the definitions I listed above
Thats what I wass looking for soter1
There was a lot of talk about wind.
If someone said that they were going to hold a full value for wind, it would mean that the wind is coming at a right angle, and they would apply the full predetermined offset for that wind speed.
If someone said they would hold a half value for wind, it would mean the wind was coming diagonally, and they would hold off roughly half of what they would for a full value wind speed.
People would either hold or dial for wind when shooting. If people held, they would aim the appropriate amount to the left or right of the target. If people dialed for wind, they would adjust the windage turret of their scope so the crosshairs would be centered on the target. Most people held for wind.
I thought A4 was a great stage and you did a fine job as an RO.
Sorry about hitting the sunroof on the Audi. [Actually I'm not, I'd do it again in a heartbeat.]
If someone said that they were going to hold a full value for wind, it would mean that the wind is coming at a right angle, and they would apply the full predetermined offset for that wind speed.
If someone said they would hold a half value for wind, it would mean the wind was coming diagonally, and they would hold off roughly half of what they would for a full value wind speed.
People would either hold or dial for wind when shooting. If people held, they would aim the appropriate amount to the left or right of the target. If people dialed for wind, they would adjust the windage turret of their scope so the crosshairs would be centered on the target. Most people held for wind.
I thought A4 was a great stage and you did a fine job as an RO.
Sorry about hitting the sunroof on the Audi. [Actually I'm not, I'd do it again in a heartbeat.]
A lot of guys use their 10mph full value wind as a base line and then halve it for a 5 or take 3/4s due to the angle etc.
The nice thing is if everyone uses that method, caliber is irrelevant. If you shoot and miss, and I clean up, I can tell you later I used a quarter of my 10mph FV hold and you can apply that on the next stage and its relevant.
The nice thing is if everyone uses that method, caliber is irrelevant. If you shoot and miss, and I clean up, I can tell you later I used a quarter of my 10mph FV hold and you can apply that on the next stage and its relevant.
Fuck! in most cases indicates a miss....
I know I put one straight through the sunroof on the second car on A4, the cool part was I watched my own trace curve right down in front of the target and shatter that sunroof. Very cool. Turns out that target was ten yards behind the car FYI if anyone went off the car distance vs the actual plate. I'm jealous of the people who got to shoot out tires and headlights after the match was over! Always been a dream of mine to shoot out a tire from 600 yards! 
I know I put one straight through the sunroof on the second car on A4, the cool part was I watched my own trace curve right down in front of the target and shatter that sunroof. Very cool. Turns out that target was ten yards behind the car FYI if anyone went off the car distance vs the actual plate. I'm jealous of the people who got to shoot out tires and headlights after the match was over! Always been a dream of mine to shoot out a tire from 600 yards!
Well, you could always shoot out your own car items. Drive out to the desert or someplace desolate and bang away, right? ;-)
or more specifically, when you get 9 hits in a row using the same wind and then you miss the sudden let off and the shot goes wide by your exact hold.
Sorry but that was done during the match by someone, we seen that Saturday evening when we were fixing targets. Should have seen the left rear quarter of the Audi!I'm jealous of the people who got to shoot out tires and headlights after the match was over! Always been a dream of mine to shoot out a tire from 600 yards!
Or when Joe Dawson's voice is in your head saying "There's no wind in the bowl".
Thats funny because in all the video I took I noticed that by about the 4th shot someone would say that, Thanks for clearing that up for me.
I didn't get to go to the SHC, but from shooting here in the Nevada desert, I have learned this one.....Not really a SPOKEN sort of thing, but a grown man crying = The Wind just kicked my butt!!
Pstiffler, for more clarity on the usage of the word please refer to the link below.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xZkb4TPI-Lo&feature=youtube_gdata_player
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xZkb4TPI-Lo&feature=youtube_gdata_player
Hey, were you the RO on A4 on the last day? If so, thanks for letting us smoke those p-dogs by the car while we waited to move to the next stage. That was a blast.. literally.
Radians are not metric. Don't know where this keeps coming from.
How do people associate MILs to Metric when the definition of MILs is 1/1000 of a Radian?
Well we all know that MOA is Minutes-Of-Angle. And everyone "knows" that 1 MOA at 100yards = 1" of drop...thats acceptable...right?
Well lets do some High School Trig to see just how close to 1" at 100yards 1 MOA actually is...
1 Minute-of-angle * 1deg = 1/60 degrees for our shooting angle
-------
60 Minutes
tan( 1/60) * 100yards * 36 inches = drop in inches = 1.047197581" pretty dang close only 0.047197581" off
---------
yard
Now lets see how close to 1 meter, 1 MIL is at 1000 meters....
First we all know that 2*pi*radians = 360 degrees, or 1 radian = 360 degrees/2*pi
So 1 MilliRadian is 1/1000 of that or 360 degrees/2000*pi
so if we follow the same trig as above we get:
tan( 360 degrees / 2000*pi) * 1000meters = drop in meters = 1.000000333 meters only 0.000000333 off
So if one is OK associating 1" to 1 MOA at 100 yards. Then 1 Meter to 1 MIL at 1000Meters is 143,022 times more accurate!!!
Just a wild guess, but this is where this keeps coming from...
Its only Rocket Surgery eh
Well we all know that MOA is Minutes-Of-Angle. And everyone "knows" that 1 MOA at 100yards = 1" of drop...thats acceptable...right?
Well lets do some High School Trig to see just how close to 1" at 100yards 1 MOA actually is...
1 Minute-of-angle * 1deg = 1/60 degrees for our shooting angle
-------
60 Minutes
tan( 1/60) * 100yards * 36 inches = drop in inches = 1.047197581" pretty dang close only 0.047197581" off
---------
yard
Now lets see how close to 1 meter, 1 MIL is at 1000 meters....
First we all know that 2*pi*radians = 360 degrees, or 1 radian = 360 degrees/2*pi
So 1 MilliRadian is 1/1000 of that or 360 degrees/2000*pi
so if we follow the same trig as above we get:
tan( 360 degrees / 2000*pi) * 1000meters = drop in meters = 1.000000333 meters only 0.000000333 off
So if one is OK associating 1" to 1 MOA at 100 yards. Then 1 Meter to 1 MIL at 1000Meters is 143,022 times more accurate!!!
Just a wild guess, but this is where this keeps coming from...
Its only Rocket Surgery eh
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Take your formula and plug in other length units, then you realize that the relationship between radians and meters is the same as the relationship between radians and any other linear measurement unit regardless of whether the length unit is metric or not.
1 milliradian = 1 meter at 1000 meters
1 milliradian = 1 yard at 1000 yards
1 milliradian = 1 foot at 1000 feet
1 milliradian = 1 fathom at 1000 fathoms
1 milliradian = 1 furlong at 1000 furlongs
1 milliradian = 1 mile at 1000 miles
and on and on and on.
And while the radian appears on the International System of Units as the official unit of angular measurement, it is a derived dimensionless unit (meter/meter). Since it is dimensionless it is equally applicable to any system of measurement, metric or otherwise.
All of the above is not rocket surgery. It's actually simple math, if you know math that is.
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eh
guys the saying is rocket science not rocket surgery!....................... what is happening we are taking hemorroids out of the rockets?...... no rocket science, brain surgery
Idahoorion
guys the saying is rocket science not rocket surgery!....................... what is happening we are taking hemorroids out of the rockets?...... no rocket science, brain surgery
Idahoorion
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