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Thoughts on a cartridge for extended ranges.

D

dk-1

Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Sep 29, 2007
268
8
45
Central, Ca.
I made a post in the rifles section also, but I will "somewhat" duplicate it here. I know there are hundreds of posts on the sight regarding this stuff, but I have some specific criteria and would like fresh opinions.

I just picked up a 700 in 300WM ADL sporter for a SWEET price. I already have a 700 in .308 for medium distances and I want to build something out of the new rig for a 1500 +/- yard shooter. I already have an NXS set aside for it and would like to use an AICS with their mags. Initially I MAY not be reloading, but I eventually will when components become available again.
 
Re: Thoughts on a cartridge for extended ranges.

1500 yards is really pushing it for a .300WM. Did you have a question about this?
 
Re: Thoughts on a cartridge for extended ranges.

<span style="color: #FF0000">I already have a 700 in .308 for medium distances and I want to build something out of the new rig for a 1500 +/- yard shooter.</span>

I am going to use this rifle for the build..... So what cartridge for a custom build on a 700 long action?
 
Re: Thoughts on a cartridge for extended ranges.

I'm having a heavy barrel 7mm weatherby built up to use Berger 180's. QL says a squash over 3000 fps in a 27" barrel.
 
Re: Thoughts on a cartridge for extended ranges.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: steve123</div><div class="ubbcode-body">How about a 338 edge.

should find lots of info with a search. </div></div>

How much work to build it on a 700 long action?
 
Re: Thoughts on a cartridge for extended ranges.

Not much, open bolt face and install sako extractor.
 
Re: Thoughts on a cartridge for extended ranges.

No need to open the bolt face for 338 edge, as his rifle is already a 300 Win.
 
Re: Thoughts on a cartridge for extended ranges.

338 Edge is off the Ultra Mag family of cartridges, so he would have to have the bolt face opened up to go that route. Excellent cartridge that I'm trying to talk a friend of mine into doing with his 300 Ultra soon.
 
Re: Thoughts on a cartridge for extended ranges.

cd300winchestermagnum-600x336.jpg


cd300remingtonultramag.jpg


If he starts with a 300 Winchester Magnum, there is no need to open up the bolt face.



 
Re: Thoughts on a cartridge for extended ranges.

Oops, my mistake! Guess I need to get more up to speed with the belted mags. Thanks for the correction, Ranger!!
 
Re: Thoughts on a cartridge for extended ranges.

I can't imagine looking into spending the money to get to those distances without loading your own ammo. Like buying a Ferrari and putting the cheapest tires you can find on it.
 
Re: Thoughts on a cartridge for extended ranges.

Thanks for the recommendations on the 338 edge. After doing some research into that cartridge it seems to be what I am looking for.
 
Re: Thoughts on a cartridge for extended ranges.

What altitude?

My Pejsa spreadsheet suggests that at 1000ft altitude, if you can get the .260Rem/142SMK up to 2900fps, you are still doing about 1200fps at 1400yd. My 28" barrel gets 2850fps with a moderately mild load, others report 2900fps from the same length.

Longer barrels might go faster. If you can get it up to 3000fps, the 1500yd velocity is 1067fps or thereabouts.

Higher altitudes yield better LR velocities, the same load at Raton (6600ft) is doing 1367fps at 1500yd. My 2850fps load is still doing 1269fps at 1500yd.

The .308 to .260Rem conversion is just a barrel swap. Same for 6.5-.284, and that one removes a lot of the doubts about adequate velocities.

Think about it...

Greg
 
Re: Thoughts on a cartridge for extended ranges.

If you're looking to compare apples to apples. The two top ballistic performers I can see by computer program are the 7mm 180's and the .338 250-300's. At sea level either will get you to 1600 meters (1 mile). It takes a lot more energy to get a .250 or 300 gr. in .338 downrange. But they buck wind better than the 7mm's. I've shot the 7mm's out to 2k yds. out west in high altitude. But, I've not shot any .338's at long range.
 
Re: Thoughts on a cartridge for extended ranges.

My home range (backyard) is 100-300' ASL and has the capability of maybe 1200 yards. I hunt the Sierra Nevada Mountains from 1,000' ASL to 10,000' ASL. Most of my hunting is wild hogs from 1000-3500' ASL. The higher altitudes I hunt deer. I hunt the flat land at 100'-300' for coyotes, and have the potential in some spots for 1000-1500 yard shots from slightly elevated positions. The temps here are above 70 F most of the year and the humidity is usually above 30%.
 
Re: Thoughts on a cartridge for extended ranges.

200gr 7mm from Richard Graves. 7wsm case. or neck down the win mag.
 
Re: Thoughts on a cartridge for extended ranges.

ewoaf,

It's not underestimated. It's just not as capable of what the .338 is capable of.

999yards,

I agree with you there that the Wildcat bullets Richard put out were exceptional. The BC factor has long been a detractor for ULD type bullets as target shooters with rank get brought in to evaluate new bullets. Their decisions have always seemed to range back to they would rather have an accurate bullet that will shoot the longest military approved competition of 1000 yds. rather than have a bullet that won't shoot one bughole but will remain on it's original accuracy course for up to one mile.

And I agree with you, that once you get the ULD's stabilized they are as accurate as anything out there. I've shot several calibers of Richards bullets. My current favorite is the .257 115 RBBT's. Too bad he sold the business. The good news is the guy building them is in the U.S.
 
Re: Thoughts on a cartridge for extended ranges.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sandwarrior</div><div class="ubbcode-body">ewoaf,

It's not underestimated. It's just not as capable of what the .338 is capable of.

999yards,

I agree with you there that the Wildcat bullets Richard put out were exceptional. The BC factor has long been a detractor for ULD type bullets as target shooters with rank get brought in to evaluate new bullets. Their decisions have always seemed to range back to they would rather have an accurate bullet that will shoot the longest military approved competition of 1000 yds. rather than have a bullet that won't shoot one bughole but will remain on it's original accuracy course for up to one mile.

And I agree with you, that once you get the ULD's stabilized they are as accurate as anything out there. I've shot several calibers of Richards bullets. My current favorite is the .257 115 RBBT's. Too bad he sold the business. The good news is the guy building them is in the U.S. </div></div>
ofcourse not, but were not searching for the farthest/greatest, we're just looking to see to the criteria of the OP. I'd bump the throat a lil longer and runner, saving a ton of money for other stuff.
 
Re: Thoughts on a cartridge for extended ranges.

Look at the .300 Weatherby...will out power the win mag. Put together right it will easily get you to 1500 and then some. Look at the 208 A MAX and Berger's 210 VLD.

Or go with the .338 Edge or the .338 Lapua.
 
Re: Thoughts on a cartridge for extended ranges.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ewoaf</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sandwarrior</div><div class="ubbcode-body">ewoaf,

It's not underestimated. It's just not as capable of what the .338 is capable of.

999yards,

I agree with you there that the Wildcat bullets Richard put out were exceptional. The BC factor has long been a detractor for ULD type bullets as target shooters with rank get brought in to evaluate new bullets. Their decisions have always seemed to range back to they would rather have an accurate bullet that will shoot the longest military approved competition of 1000 yds. rather than have a bullet that won't shoot one bughole but will remain on it's original accuracy course for up to one mile.

And I agree with you, that once you get the ULD's stabilized they are as accurate as anything out there. I've shot several calibers of Richards bullets. My current favorite is the .257 115 RBBT's. Too bad he sold the business. The good news is the guy building them is in the U.S. </div></div>
ofcourse not, but were not searching for the farthest/greatest, we're just looking to see to the criteria of the OP. I'd bump the throat a lil longer and runner, saving a ton of money for other stuff.</div></div>

ewoaf,

Sorry I thought I was posting to another thread. The .300 WM will get you pretty far. Maybe not as far as some, but certainly not at their cost either. You can load relatively inexpensive, as you said, with it.
 
Re: Thoughts on a cartridge for extended ranges.

i shoot with a 300 weatherby with the 210 bergers and threw a ballistic calculator they go subsonic at 1550 m with a muzzle velocity of 2950 out of my 24" vanguard
 
Re: Thoughts on a cartridge for extended ranges.

I just think a 6.5-'06 is a wee bit too far overbore, but I also think that the 7mm/.284 diameter 175SMK in a longer barreled .280 or a 7mm Rem Mag might be adequate to the task.

My approach has always been a question of doing what is ballistically adequate to the task with the minimal amount of energy and mayhem going on inside the engine room.

I think that 175gr of anything arriving ontarget at a decently supersonic velocity will be adequate to any task, be it tactical or paper punching.

I do not subscribe to theoreticals which assign ballistic advantages to bullets of equal BC based on one or the other's greater mass. As long as mass is adequate to deliver respectable terminal energy, drop and drift for a given set of identical BC's and muzzle velocities <span style="font-style: italic">should</span> not differ from the lighter projo to the more massive one.

If I'm wrong, I'm wrong; but that's my theory, and I'm stickin' to it...

Greg
 
Re: Thoughts on a cartridge for extended ranges.

Remington is building some rifles in 338 lapua now. I dont know if they beef up their action, but it may be something to consider.
 
Re: Thoughts on a cartridge for extended ranges.

7mm with the 175 SMK, 180 Berger, 189 Cauterucio are all excellent in the Long range category; if you can run them up to 2,950 fps they are still supersonic at 1,760 yards in my neck of the woods, depending upon temperature.

The company that bought wildcat bullets is located in Elko Nevada. They keep promising to open their doors, but not so far...

JEffVN
 
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