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Took a chance on this... So far, so good!

sirhrmechanic

Command Sgt. Major
Full Member
Minuteman
So last winter, had a chance to buy this out of England. Sight unseen. But from a 'reputable' dealer. And price was sort of off the charts low. That said, it had a small repaired crack in the stock and sleeved barrels, which both dramatically affect value. I also had no idea of mechanical condition, etc.

After 8 months of paperwork and import fun... Arrived. And while the 'disclosed' items were right on... it was a hodgepodge of 'other' items. Issues with single trigger. Barrels didn't break cleanly. Automatic ejectors not working. And the crack that was 'repaired' was re-cracked. And more extensive internally than first believed. Oh and the buttplate was extended and pinned/glued. And I assumed was owned by either an NBA player or Lurch. Because it was a good 1/2" too long.

But... it is a Thomas Boss & Co. made in 1902. Their new 'Racehorse' style as it was the sleekest, slimmest gun on the English market. And the fit, finish, engraving, etc. is amazing. So, off to the workshops at Schloss Nitrocellulose for the treatment... First time I've really torn down a London Best gun... but there ya go. Might as well dive in.

First issue, it was bone dry. Not sure why it was not lubricated and properly 'tuned' when the barrels were sleeved. But everything inside was dry. Lots of burrs. Things were hanging up. This gun led a hard life, apparently. But lots of careful work and I have the locks and trigger working right. Then got the ejectors working (messed up during the re-sleeving process, probably.)

Just thought you guys would like to see some pictures of the inside of a pretty cool old gun. One of the interesting things about Boss is that since they were founded c. 1820, they have produced just over 10,000 guns. So many details have been saved and recorded that we know just about everyone involved in making it. Joseph Brazier of "The Ashes" (his workshop name) made the locks. It was engraved by John James Sumner III the third engraver in a family of four master engravers dating back to 1809.

Anyway, just some cool pictures. Everything is hand filed, hand-fitted and hand-engraved.

boss 5.jpg


Brazier supplied 'soft' actions for engraving and finishing.
boss 3.jpg


Cleaned up and lubricated. And de-burred.
boss 6.jpg


"The Ashes" was the name of Brazier's workshop in Wolverhampton. Company is still in business and makes barrels still.
boss 1.jpg



And had to remove the old horn buttplate, which was over an inch thick. I sawed through the thick part with a bandsaw and then used a belt sander to thin the nice checkered horn plate to a more... presentable and better-fitting thickness. Then had to heat the 'thin' part of the plate that was glued and pinned to the stock. Yes, glued. So took a blowtorch to the horn (without getting flame on the oil finish!) and the glue let go enough to pry the remains of the plate off.

I have a couple of special screws ordered for the rear plate (just like the last one) and will final fit the checkered horn plate probably next weekend.
boss 7.jpg


I also de-greased, spread and properly glued the stock crack(s) and hopefully they will hold. I think they will once I have the sideplates re-fitted. Re-Stocking this would be spendy... I don't want to go there!

boss 8.jpg


Anyway, more pix to follow, but rather pleased with this gamble as I think the sweat equity is going to be well worth it. Not to mention, it's just a perfect field gun.

Cheers,

Sirhr

PS.... this gun, new cost just over 70 Pounds sterling in 1902. By comparison, a skilled engineer at that time would have been making about 110 pounds... a year. It was nice to be king!
 
So last winter, had a chance to buy this out of England. Sight unseen. But from a 'reputable' dealer. And price was sort of off the charts low. That said, it had a small repaired crack in the stock and sleeved barrels, which both dramatically affect value. I also had no idea of mechanical condition, etc.

After 8 months of paperwork and import fun... Arrived. And while the 'disclosed' items were right on... it was a hodgepodge of 'other' items. Issues with single trigger. Barrels didn't break cleanly. Automatic ejectors not working. And the crack that was 'repaired' was re-cracked. And more extensive internally than first believed. Oh and the buttplate was extended and pinned/glued. And I assumed was owned by either an NBA player or Lurch. Because it was a good 1/2" too long.

But... it is a Thomas Boss & Co. made in 1902. Their new 'Racehorse' style as it was the sleekest, slimmest gun on the English market. And the fit, finish, engraving, etc. is amazing. So, off to the workshops at Schloss Nitrocellulose for the treatment... First time I've really torn down a London Best gun... but there ya go. Might as well dive in.

First issue, it was bone dry. Not sure why it was not lubricated and properly 'tuned' when the barrels were sleeved. But everything inside was dry. Lots of burrs. Things were hanging up. This gun led a hard life, apparently. But lots of careful work and I have the locks and trigger working right. Then got the ejectors working (messed up during the re-sleeving process, probably.)

Just thought you guys would like to see some pictures of the inside of a pretty cool old gun. One of the interesting things about Boss is that since they were founded c. 1820, they have produced just over 10,000 guns. So many details have been saved and recorded that we know just about everyone involved in making it. Joseph Brazier of "The Ashes" (his workshop name) made the locks. It was engraved by John James Sumner III the third engraver in a family of four master engravers dating back to 1809.

Anyway, just some cool pictures. Everything is hand filed, hand-fitted and hand-engraved.

View attachment 7933885

Brazier supplied 'soft' actions for engraving and finishing.
View attachment 7933883

Cleaned up and lubricated. And de-burred.
View attachment 7933886

"The Ashes" was the name of Brazier's workshop in Wolverhampton. Company is still in business and makes barrels still.
View attachment 7933882


And had to remove the old horn buttplate, which was over an inch thick. I sawed through the thick part with a bandsaw and then used a belt sander to thin the nice checkered horn plate to a more... presentable and better-fitting thickness. Then had to heat the 'thin' part of the plate that was glued and pinned to the stock. Yes, glued. So took a blowtorch to the horn (without getting flame on the oil finish!) and the glue let go enough to pry the remains of the plate off.

I have a couple of special screws ordered for the rear plate (just like the last one) and will final fit the checkered horn plate probably next weekend.
View attachment 7933887

I also de-greased, spread and properly glued the stock crack(s) and hopefully they will hold. I think they will once I have the sideplates re-fitted. Re-Stocking this would be spendy... I don't want to go there!

View attachment 7933888

Anyway, more pix to follow, but rather pleased with this gamble as I think the sweat equity is going to be well worth it. Not to mention, it's just a perfect field gun.

Cheers,

Sirhr

PS.... this gun, new cost just over 70 Pounds sterling in 1902. By comparison, a skilled engineer at that time would have been making about 110 pounds... a year. It was nice to be king!

Good Lord I want to see that gun once you finish with it.
 
Thanks for all the posts showing the processes you take. I know they're abbreviated, but the tidbits you pass along come in very handy.
 
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Thanks for all the posts showing the processes you take. I know they're abbreviated, but the tidbits you pass along come in very handy.
That's why I post things. And no secrets here. If you want to know something, ask! As @buffalowinter and I have said, we're both in the world where we just look at things and know how to do them. But not everyone has been doing this stuff for 40 - 50 years and has a barn full of tools and a head full of techniques. So if you want something 'expanded on' or input on something... I'm not a professional gunsmith. I don't have secrets to hide. And am happy to inspire, educate, terrify, entertain, train or otherwise assist my assorted acolytes, Paduan's and Grasshoppers.

So just ask!!! That's what makes the Vintage Section so awesome. Stuff going on here that is long lost in a world of CNC and "Sopmod Barbie" assembly guns. This is back to the '20s and '30's and the era of prototyping with files.

Cheers!

Sirhr
 
Well, sadly, there is probably no repairing this stock. Even the repairs made in England were thwarted by oil-soaked wood and the extent of the cracking. So... have a call out to a stocker in Michigan and may make a road trip out to have a fitting and maybe do some bird hunting while I am out there. Gun is still shootable, so may take it grouse shooting and then drop it off.

Not going to be cheap, but this gun is well worth it and for what I acquired it for, I have a lot of room to invest in a stock for it.

Oh those lines... and that engraving... This was why it was called "The Racehorse" gun by Boss when it was new.

boss1.jpg


Original wood is lovely. But the action area is just soaked with old oil and no glue in the world is going to put it back together.

Going to go with another piece of dark wood... try and match it as close as I can.

boss2.jpg


Well, more when I find out about stocking. And I am still going to fit buttplate. So I can use it this fall.

Cheers,

Sirhr
 
Sirhr,

That is a very impressive piece of functional artwork. I am looking forward to seeing how it performs in the field. My hat is off to you for keeping it working.
 
Well, sadly, there is probably no repairing this stock. Even the repairs made in England were thwarted by oil-soaked wood and the extent of the cracking. So... have a call out to a stocker in Michigan and may make a road trip out to have a fitting and maybe do some bird hunting while I am out there. Gun is still shootable, so may take it grouse shooting and then drop it off.

Not going to be cheap, but this gun is well worth it and for what I acquired it for, I have a lot of room to invest in a stock for it.

Oh those lines... and that engraving... This was why it was called "The Racehorse" gun by Boss when it was new.

View attachment 7938016

Original wood is lovely. But the action area is just soaked with old oil and no glue in the world is going to put it back together.

Going to go with another piece of dark wood... try and match it as close as I can.

View attachment 7938017

Well, more when I find out about stocking. And I am still going to fit buttplate. So I can use it this fall.

Cheers,

Sirhr
Have you tried soaking in acetone? I mean, stick it in a tub of the shit and let it soak.
 
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Reactions: candyx
Have you tried soaking in acetone? I mean, stick it in a tub of the shit and let it soak.
Unfortunately, it is punky.... acetone will just make it crumbly... ;-)

And I did flush with lacquer thinner several times. No joy. The wood is just too far gone.

Believe me, I'd love to be able to fix it. But I need to keep a pattern for the stocker. And I sort of built a new stock into my purchase price. And then some. A Lot actually. So, re-stocking is the best bet.

Already made appointment for fitting and stock-making up in Michigan. So off to the races!

Cheers,

Sirhr
 
Unfortunately, it is punky.... acetone will just make it crumbly... ;-)

And I did flush with lacquer thinner several times. No joy. The wood is just too far gone.

Believe me, I'd love to be able to fix it. But I need to keep a pattern for the stocker. And I sort of built a new stock into my purchase price. And then some. A Lot actually. So, re-stocking is the best bet.

Already made appointment for fitting and stock-making up in Michigan. So off to the races!

Cheers,

Sirhr
Bummer on the stock. I wonder if something like a wood hardener might work in that area, but not sure how much stress is in that area.

I’d give Mr. Fredi a call and see if he has a blank that matches up.
 
Bummer on the stock. I wonder if something like a wood hardener might work in that area, but not sure how much stress is in that area.

I’d give Mr. Fredi a call and see if he has a blank that matches up.
Tried Smiths CPES.... which is some of the best in the industry. It didn't sink in well. Which makes it not work very well. I might have tried Vacuum Impregnation and vapor degreasing, though that would require refinishing. But at a certain point one just can't throw money/time at a piece of wood that has gone punky.

And even if it survived static repair, think about the shock load of firing. It's not going to make it.

Like I said, I bought this for a song. So I can afford a spendy new stock by one of the best in the business. And still not be even close to underwater. It's an invstment in a piece of firearms history. I mean... Boss made 1 gun a week for the last 200 years. I think that merits an expenditure to keep up the Traditions of Mr. Thomas Boss!

Cheers,

Sirhr
 
Tried Smiths CPES.... which is some of the best in the industry. It didn't sink in well. Which makes it not work very well. I might have tried Vacuum Impregnation and vapor degreasing, though that would require refinishing. But at a certain point one just can't throw money/time at a piece of wood that has gone punky.

And even if it survived static repair, think about the shock load of firing. It's not going to make it.

Like I said, I bought this for a song. So I can afford a spendy new stock by one of the best in the business. And still not be even close to underwater. It's an invstment in a piece of firearms history. I mean... Boss made 1 gun a week for the last 200 years. I think that merits an expenditure to keep up the Traditions of Mr. Thomas Boss!

Cheers,

Sirhr
Who’s the stock maker in Michigan? I’m a local and curious!
 
Del Whitman, way up on the western side of the upper peninsula. Lake Ann area. Hoping to drop gun of and do some bird hunting in Oct up there.

Cheers,

Sirhr
Nice, enjoy. Duck season up that way starts September 24 if you get bored of grouse or pheasant!
 
Really looking forward to seeing this re-stocked and put back in the field!

Just for grins, I plugged in the £ 70 purchase price from 1902 into a BPS inflation convertor. That gun would cost a little over £ 6,000.00 (or @ $7,000.00) in today's money, give or take. The finer things in life have never come cheap!
 
Reality is a new British best sidelock today cost 200-250k.
Holland, Boss or Purdey.
That's why buying a 'broken' one for $5K... and spending another $5k for a new stock... and ending up with a vintage gun that will sell for 5 - 10x that... is a good deal! Just involves sweat equity and taking the risk. And spending a few weekends carefully working on it.

Best part is that I get to shoot it and carry it in the woods for years! I can't do that with a 401K.

Cheers,

Sirhr
 
Del does great work, I used him a few times when I was into doubles nearly 20 years ago.

That Boss is a dream gun! Nothing beats a london sidelock. Hunted grouse and woodcock with a borrowed Purdey and Joseph Lang a few times. Look forward to seeing it finished.
 
So last winter, had a chance to buy this out of England. Sight unseen. But from a 'reputable' dealer. And price was sort of off the charts low. That said, it had a small repaired crack in the stock and sleeved barrels, which both dramatically affect value. I also had no idea of mechanical condition, etc.

After 8 months of paperwork and import fun... Arrived. And while the 'disclosed' items were right on... it was a hodgepodge of 'other' items. Issues with single trigger. Barrels didn't break cleanly. Automatic ejectors not working. And the crack that was 'repaired' was re-cracked. And more extensive internally than first believed. Oh and the buttplate was extended and pinned/glued. And I assumed was owned by either an NBA player or Lurch. Because it was a good 1/2" too long.

But... it is a Thomas Boss & Co. made in 1902. Their new 'Racehorse' style as it was the sleekest, slimmest gun on the English market. And the fit, finish, engraving, etc. is amazing. So, off to the workshops at Schloss Nitrocellulose for the treatment... First time I've really torn down a London Best gun... but there ya go. Might as well dive in.

First issue, it was bone dry. Not sure why it was not lubricated and properly 'tuned' when the barrels were sleeved. But everything inside was dry. Lots of burrs. Things were hanging up. This gun led a hard life, apparently. But lots of careful work and I have the locks and trigger working right. Then got the ejectors working (messed up during the re-sleeving process, probably.)

Just thought you guys would like to see some pictures of the inside of a pretty cool old gun. One of the interesting things about Boss is that since they were founded c. 1820, they have produced just over 10,000 guns. So many details have been saved and recorded that we know just about everyone involved in making it. Joseph Brazier of "The Ashes" (his workshop name) made the locks. It was engraved by John James Sumner III the third engraver in a family of four master engravers dating back to 1809.

Anyway, just some cool pictures. Everything is hand filed, hand-fitted and hand-engraved.

View attachment 7933885

Brazier supplied 'soft' actions for engraving and finishing.
View attachment 7933883

Cleaned up and lubricated. And de-burred.
View attachment 7933886

"The Ashes" was the name of Brazier's workshop in Wolverhampton. Company is still in business and makes barrels still.
View attachment 7933882


And had to remove the old horn buttplate, which was over an inch thick. I sawed through the thick part with a bandsaw and then used a belt sander to thin the nice checkered horn plate to a more... presentable and better-fitting thickness. Then had to heat the 'thin' part of the plate that was glued and pinned to the stock. Yes, glued. So took a blowtorch to the horn (without getting flame on the oil finish!) and the glue let go enough to pry the remains of the plate off.

I have a couple of special screws ordered for the rear plate (just like the last one) and will final fit the checkered horn plate probably next weekend.
View attachment 7933887

I also de-greased, spread and properly glued the stock crack(s) and hopefully they will hold. I think they will once I have the sideplates re-fitted. Re-Stocking this would be spendy... I don't want to go there!

View attachment 7933888

Anyway, more pix to follow, but rather pleased with this gamble as I think the sweat equity is going to be well worth it. Not to mention, it's just a perfect field gun.

Cheers,

Sirhr

PS.... this gun, new cost just over 70 Pounds sterling in 1902. By comparison, a skilled engineer at that time would have been making about 110 pounds... a year. It was nice to be king!
Can you tell us what you paid for it? Or is that going to stay a secret?
 
Can you tell us what you paid for it? Or is that going to stay a secret?
Already posted above... Spent $5K on it. Another $1000 in import fees/shipping from UK. I'll end up with $5K in a new stock. And have a Boss that, on the open market, will be 25 - 40K easily... I'll do that kind of deal all day long and twice on Sundays!

In reality it will probably be worth more, because last fall I acquired its 'twin' in an original Boss Double Gun Leather case for a great price! So it's going to be a cased, composed pair of identical guns, numbered 1 and 2. We are matching the wood on this one to the 'new' one. They are very close. Dark, dense.

Will be an awesome set when done!

Cheers,

Sirhr
 
Already posted above... Spent $5K on it. Another $1000 in import fees/shipping from UK. I'll end up with $5K in a new stock. And have a Boss that, on the open market, will be 25 - 40K easily... I'll do that kind of deal all day long and twice on Sundays!

In reality it will probably be worth more, because last fall I acquired its 'twin' in an original Boss Double Gun Leather case for a great price! So it's going to be a cased, composed pair of identical guns, numbered 1 and 2. We are matching the wood on this one to the 'new' one. They are very close. Dark, dense.

Will be an awesome set when done!

Cheers,

Sirhr
Amazing.
 
I have a few case accessories if you care to see. Let me know. Some marked some unmarked.
 
Already posted above... Spent $5K on it. Another $1000 in import fees/shipping from UK. I'll end up with $5K in a new stock. And have a Boss that, on the open market, will be 25 - 40K easily... I'll do that kind of deal all day long and twice on Sundays!

In reality it will probably be worth more, because last fall I acquired its 'twin' in an original Boss Double Gun Leather case for a great price! So it's going to be a cased, composed pair of identical guns, numbered 1 and 2. We are matching the wood on this one to the 'new' one. They are very close. Dark, dense.

Will be an awesome set when done!

Cheers,

Sirhr

I just jizzed.