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Sidearms & Scatterguns Try before you judge.

P

pdogsbeware

Private
Full Member
Minuteman
Sep 10, 2011
4
2
36
Colorado/Minnesota
Hi, my name is Kevin. "I'm not a fan of <span style="color: #FF0000"><span style="font-weight: bold">X Brand</span></span> pistols." I've said those words a thousand times. I never was a fan of <span style="color: #FF0000"><span style="font-weight: bold">X Brand</span></span>, though not because of any misdirected views about their quality. I'm one of the few non-<span style="color: #FF0000"><span style="font-weight: bold">X Brand</span></span>ers who will admit that they are phenomenal weapons; durable, reliable, simple, cost-effective, reliable (warrants two mentions). I've even supported new gun buyers who the <span style="color: #FF0000"><span style="font-weight: bold">X Brand</span></span> fit the best, telling them not to hesitate to purchase one. They have a proven track record that you cannot argue with, despite what bullshit the haters spew (who, I would venture to say, 97% of detractors have NEVER SHOT an <span style="color: #FF0000"><span style="font-weight: bold">X Brand</span></span>.)

But you still hear "<span style="color: #FF0000"><span style="font-weight: bold">X Brand</span></span> suck" for any multitude of reasons. Any time I hear someone say Glocks/1911s/Berettas/Sigs sucks, my first question to them is, "Well have you ever shot one." You'd be amazed just how many times the answer is no. I've never been a fan of them simply because they didn't feel right when I held them, and I'm of the school of thought that if a pistol didn't fit and wasn't comfortable, I wouldn't shoot it worth a damn. The grip angle feels weird, as well as just the whole grip in general. They simply did not feel right in my hand, so I didn't give them a chance.

Anywho, so a few months ago I decided, after owning several different brands, that I would try out <span style="color: #FF0000"><span style="font-weight: bold">X Brand</span></span>. So I bought one, and spent a few days playing like a little kid with a new toy after Christmas with them to get somewhat used to the feel. Finally went to the range, and hot damn! I was in love! When shooting, I forgot all about the funky feeling grip, and was smiling at how easy it was to shoot, and hit! Muzzle rise was minimal, and the sights came back on target without even trying. Without practicing with the gun, I was already shooting more accurately and faster than with my previous favorite pistol.

I started moving and shooting, and not only was I shooting more accurately than with my other guns, I was able to while moving a lot faster. I've always been a...well...I can admit it, I shoot pretty horribly with a pistol. I like them, they are fun, but I just can't shoot them very well at all. I'm pretty sure Bea Arthur could shoot a handgun better than me. I was just amazed at how well I was shooting. There I was staring at targets with a giant shredded mass of holes center-mass, and it sure looked pretty!

My shooting buddy was also in the same boat as me, he didn't like <span style="color: #FF0000"><span style="font-weight: bold">X Brand</span></span>. He also could admit they were quality firearms, but they just didn't fit him either. So next time we went shooting I forced him to try it. I was loading up some mags at the bench, he went through a few mags, comes up to me and says, "I hate you.".
"Why?"
"Cause now I have to go buy an <span style="color: #FF0000"><span style="font-weight: bold">X Brand</span></span>."

We happened to have two women-folk with us, who were inexperienced. Out of the ensemble of brands and types of pistols, female A shot the <span style="color: #FF0000"><span style="font-weight: bold">X Brand</span></span> incredibly well and the best, while female B couldn't get 3 rounds off without a stovepipe. Female B preferred, and could shoot the best, a HK USP compact. So yes, a sample size of 4 people is NOT something solid facts are made out of. That's the not the point. I'm not saying <span style="color: #FF0000"><span style="font-weight: bold">X Brand</span></span> are the only/best choice for 75% of people. I'm saying, much like prostate massages, don't knock it until you try it.

It took me a while, but I've learned my lesson. This will be the third time I've been adamant about thinking I wouldn't like a particular firearm...tried it...then changed my mind. So the moral here isn't that <span style="color: #FF0000"><span style="font-weight: bold">X Brand</span></span> are good or bad, it's that if you've never SHOT them...don't say a damn thing about how they are "junk, stupid, suck, garbage, worthless". For that matter, ANY type of firearm. For any brand, even once you've tried them, phrase your words better. Don't say, "X brand sucks". Instead try, "I personally don't prefer X brand".

So in conclusion, this is not a post advocating <span style="color: #FF0000"><span style="font-weight: bold">X Brand</span></span>. It's a post advocating trying things for yourself before judging and forming your opinions. Do not speak about that which you do not know. Unless you have actual first hand experience with something, please shut the hell up instead of giving your "expert" advice. On more than one occasion, I've made an ass of myself spewing crap I didn't know anything about. Then I got smart, and started keeping my mouth shut. Then I got smarter still, and started finding out things for myself.

Hi, my name is Kevin. After trying them, I am an <span style="color: #FF0000"><span style="font-weight: bold">X Brand</span></span> fan.
 
Re: Try before you judge.

X2

I never "minded" glocks, but I was never in the mindset of buying one. Always had steel framed handguns, loved em, didnt think anything would change that. Fired my father in laws PD issued one and was like "cool" thats nice...Fired my buddies SO issued one...decided I needed one. Traded my Sig226 for a G23, havent had even an ounce of regret.

Just goes to show ya, dont knock it til ya try it...
 
Re: Try before you judge.

I have tried them, owned, carried and shot two. They still suck. There is no trigger pull, just a mushy mess until it goes off.
 
Re: Try before you judge.

I've shot a few Glocks and still prefer my S&W M&Ps, but would stop short of saying that I'd never own one. Just because they haven't felt right or shot right for me in the past, doesn't mean they are bad, nor that I wouldn't change my mind once I've shot a gen 4 or whatever comes out next. In fact I know the opposite to be true, as I've shot against many people in IDPA and steel comps, who are much better than me and are shooting Glocks.

And yes, your advice to try before you bash is always a best practice. If there was only one perfect sidearm that worked best for everyone, then the myriad choices out there wouldn't exist.
 
Re: Try before you judge.

+1

I much prefer m&ps to glocks. the only thing the glock wins on is trigger reset. After you upgrade with apex parts the trigger is lightyears better than the glock. problem with the glock is ergonomics.

Thing about ergonomics are, if you dont like them youre screwed. Unlike trigger, or sights, you cant replace/upgrade ergos. The glock grip to me is too bulky, take an m&p and try and hit the mag release, now try it on a glock. Its much harder to hit on a glock. I have to rotate the entire gun 90 degrees in my hand to get to the mag release on a glock.

Another gripe I have with glocks is the grip angle, in what world is that a normal grip angle? Its just not natural. the grip angle of a glock makes it point into the air for me, hate it. Octagonal barrel is another con, cant shoot any lead bullets without replacing the barrel. Thats a big down side to someone who reloads and shoots alot, the price difference in lead to jacketed bullets is significant.

Last problem i have with glock is the lack of a beavertail. I havent shot many rounds through glocks, under 500, but of those 500 rounds I have been bit by the slide multiple times. That also is a huge turn off.

15 years ago glocks were the best polymer guns on the market, but now they are getting alot of competition.
 
Re: Try before you judge.

I'm an old 1911 guy from way back. I never hated Glocks, but didn't LOVE Them either. The GEN 4's pushed me over the edge. I run a G19 daily and have the G21 G17 major training or matches.

It's the GEN 4. I like a textured grip. I like the big mag release button. Trigger is very fine for me (and I'm a 1911 trigger snob). And the killer was the G19. If M&P had made a G19 sized gun, I would have run that.

But if my main CCW is a G19, I wanted my other polymer guns to be the same (since I have to adjust to the different grip-angle of the Glock).

Two other bonuses of the Glock for me were the availability of magazines and the fact they have a 10mm I can run in the mountains.

The M&P is better economically. But the GEN 4 is close enough it doesn't matter to this 1911 guy.

TTR
 
Re: Try before you judge.

Exceptional post! And good read.

Glock is one of those rule breakers. Why? I will never know. It never feels great in the hand but, as you said, you tend to forget as soon as they go hot. Same with the trigger, everything I know tells me the trigger isn't anything special but it not only works but works well.

Maybe that's why they are so special, they figured out how to do it right from a completely different angle.

Again, good read, and I couldn't agree more. Always have an open mind.
 
Re: Try before you judge.

I too was a Glock hater, until I shot one. That was 1997, have owned one ever since. My first was a 23, got rid of it for a 22, and am now wanting a 17 and 19. But I also want a 1911 after finally shooting one a friend has. But I've wanted a 1911 since I first handled one at 15.

Eric
 
Re: Try before you judge.

I was a Glock hater also. Never thought I would own one. Now the only automatic centerfire pistol I own is a Glock 20. Once you get used to the trigger (I am a revolver guy) it is cake for me now.
 
Re: Try before you judge.

IMHO the very best is a 17.

Dremel it to shape it to your hand
Soldering Iron to create texture
Dremel to chop the frame to accept G19 mags

I am surprised with the number folks that are running 'chops' that Glock USA doesn't come out with this or a chopped 19.


Good luck
 
Re: Try before you judge.

the 3% of people who have shot them and STILL say they hate them are just too proud to admit it. I have a buddy who will not ever say anything good about them, even despite the Glocks track record. In my opinion, even if your not a "Glock" guy, you have to at least give credit where credit is due. They are a notable benchmark in handgun history.
 
Re: Try before you judge.

I hate to love them. I never wanted to like them until I was issued one for duty. they also never felt good in my hand until the gen4. they're accurate, light, and reliable. couldnt ask for more
 
Re: Try before you judge.

I believe it's the best combat handgun on the market. That being said, I do not enjoy shooting them. The egornamics on a Glock suck, the Gen 4's are better, but still off. I own, and carry multiple Glocks, but I prefer to carry my M&PC while off duty. Smith did it right with the M&P, it feels so natural in your hand, and is very accurate. I never knock anything until I have a chance to try it, I've stuck my foot in my mouth on more than one occasion!
 
Re: Try before you judge.

Nothing wrong with glocks. I do prefer 1911's though, I have sigs, glocks, etc., but I still prefer the single action triggers on the 1911 set at about 3 lbs, with minimum pre/over travel. Long trigger pulls and sa/da guns are hard for me to get used to.
 
Re: Try before you judge.

I never had a problem with them at all. The only thing I don't like about my 19 is the shape of the slide simply prints much more than a 1911. Otherwise it's light, decent trigger out of the box and ridiculously easy to maintain. Not much to complain about at all.
 
Re: Try before you judge.

Its not so much a problem with them, I have to qualify twice a year with a G22. Its mediocre at best for me. As a lefty, bone stock Glocks just arent something that will work. I have at times hit the mag release inadvertenly, out of the box, they just arent comfortable. They are in no way the end all to pistols. I have no issue paying a bit extra for a sidearm that is not only reliable, but fits my hands. So, HKs, Sigs, and 1911's are my go-to guns. I also just fell for the M&P pistols too. Got my wife a M&P 9mm, and its another one to add to the list. The only grip I have is the trigger reset, or lack thereof. A nice crisp trigger with a short reset will have me totally sold.
 
Re: Try before you judge.

I have owned a 23, two 19s, and a 24, and shot even more than that. Glocks don't work for me. I really tried.
 
Re: Try before you judge.

Great post, I have carried Sig, HK, Smith M&P, 1911's, and Glock's on duty. While I love the 1911, I always come back to the Glock as my first choice when it counts.
 
Re: Try before you judge.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rth1800</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have tried them, owned, carried and shot two. They still suck. There is no trigger pull, just a mushy mess until it goes off. </div></div>

+1. Traded both my 19's, one was even an early gen 3 blue label. No accuracy at all, clocked in my hands, bad muzzle rise, even had mepros on them. 15 yards and a 4-6" group, absolutely unacceptable. My 92fs can do that at 20-25 yards....

I do like the trigger reset on the Glock, and I do like the size, simplicity, and they <span style="font-style: italic">had</span> reliability. But I'm not going to drop in aftermarket parts so it can group.

Bought an FNX-45, and it was love at first range trip, so I assume the 9 would be no different. Going to break in a P30 real soon.

<span style="font-style: italic">If</span> I get the Glock bug again, I'll get an XDm and have my smith do some trigger work on it....
 
Re: Try before you judge.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pdogsbeware</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> I'm saying, much like prostate massages, don't knock it until you try it. </div></div>

HAHAHA

kinda weird, but funny. almost spit my beer all over the computer.
 
Re: Try before you judge.

Come on guys! Some of you get it, others don't. Read it again now, and see if you reach a different conclusion as to what point I was trying to get across.


<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: corey4</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pdogsbeware</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> I'm saying, much like prostate massages, don't knock it until you try it. </div></div>
HAHAHA

kinda weird, but funny. almost spit my beer all over the computer.</div></div>
Weird? I find a woman wearing rubber gloves kinda sexy. Besides, I came so hard I passed out. Go ahead, TRY and get that image out of your head!
grin.gif
 
Re: Try before you judge.

i am not doggin' ya man.

it was funny!

kinda reminds me of the american pie 2 with stiffler.

lol
 
Re: Try before you judge.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: kimberseries1</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rth1800</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have tried them, owned, carried and shot two. They still suck. There is no trigger pull, just a mushy mess until it goes off. </div></div>

+1. Traded both my 19's, one was even an early gen 3 blue label. No accuracy at all, clocked in my hands, bad muzzle rise, even had mepros on them. 15 yards and a 4-6" group, absolutely unacceptable. My 92fs can do that at 20-25 yards....

I do like the trigger reset on the Glock, and I do like the size, simplicity, and they <span style="font-style: italic">had</span> reliability. But I'm not going to drop in aftermarket parts so it can group.

Bought an FNX-45, and it was love at first range trip, so I assume the 9 would be no different. Going to break in a P30 real soon.

<span style="font-style: italic">If</span> I get the Glock bug again, I'll get an XDm and have my smith do some trigger work on it.... </div></div>

+1. went this route and extremely happy. Springfield Armory did the combat carry package on mine and it was worth every penny. much shorter reset/travel, breaks right at 3#s every time and is a tack driver. Awesome gun and great choice. fits a lot better than the G19 i sold before purchasing the XDM also.

-Paulus
 
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