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Trying to decide on a couple of prefit barrels...

oldnewguy

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Minuteman
Jun 21, 2021
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I've got an Origin incoming and I'd like to pick up barrels for a couple different cartridges. The 3 options I'm considering are basically the same price.

PVA Rock Creek prefits on sale
Proof prefits on EV
Criterion on NSS

I don't necessarily want the Proof competition profile, so that's my #3 choice. I like the idea of the Criterion shouldered barrels vs the nut, but not a huge deal. Is there any substantial reason to choose one over the others?
 
My preference is for a shouldered barrel over a remage, outside of that all three of your choices I have used in the past and all of them shot well.
 
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I like the freedom the nut provides. I can set my own headspace. Eliminates the blame game when either the barrel or action doesn’t seat correctly on a shouldered prefit.
 
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I like the freedom the nut provides. I can set my own headspace. Eliminates the blame game when either the barrel or action doesn’t seat correctly on a shouldered prefit.

Use a reputable vendor (read good CS) like PVA or send in your action and that’s a non-issue. Of course if a barrel nut works for you then why not. I mainly just don’t like the aesthetics. Personal preference.
 
I’m known to swap barrels around on different actions. That makes the nut, the “mutt’s nuts!”

That makes sense for that purpose. I swap barrels around but for the most part have my actions narrowed down to a couple and mark the barrels for their respective actions. I don’t burn through barrels like some of these guys but I do change barrels like socks.
 
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I've got an Origin incoming and I'd like to pick up barrels for a couple different cartridges. The 3 options I'm considering are basically the same price.

PVA Rock Creek prefits on sale
Proof prefits on EV
Criterion on NSS

I don't necessarily want the Proof competition profile, so that's my #3 choice. I like the idea of the Criterion shouldered barrels vs the nut, but not a huge deal. Is there any substantial reason to choose one over the others?
I’ve had two PVA Prefits, two Criterion Remage barrels (not on my Origin), and a Proof prefit. They’ve all shot well. For convenience, at the same price, I’d get a shouldered prefit. It’s slightly easier to install and should headspace without adjustment. All 3 options have shot well for me (chambered in 6BR, .308, and 6GT). I have my first Criterion shouldered barrel on the way - should be here this week.

Buy what’s in stock if you need it now, otherwise there can be some lead time with PVA and Criterion. Add 2-4 weeks to whatever they tell you and you won’t be disappointed.

The Proof competition contour is thick, I ordered my Criterion as a straight contour. If you want a lighter profile, you may not be able to find it in stock.
 
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I’m known to swap barrels around on different actions. That makes the nut, the “mutt’s nuts!”

Different brand actions?

I use PVA and they are very accurate. I have 4 of their prefits now in three calibers and they all shoot great. @bohem Josh is here on the Hide also to talk to.
 
I'll take a minute to throw in some professional advice and I'll do my best not to make it completely a PVA Horn Tooting soap box. I will admit up front that there will be some tooting of my own horn as I have worked hard to bring our company capabilities and processes into a game where there are few true competitors.

The barrel nut prefits we have on sale are the same spec Rock blanks that we sold for years as the "button" version. They're excellent shooters, sometimes they're a little ugly inside but they shoot awesome. At the end of the day matches are won by what the target says not what the borescope says. Until we launched the Ospreys as our flagship offering, the Rock buttons were what I used personally for several years and I won a lot of local and regional stuff with them.

Should you want a shouldered install I would recommend our Ospreys. They're excellent barrels and in blind comparison they are up in the same sentence as the premium cut rifled barrels with some added benefits of life longevity and consistency in velocity across several different barrels.

Proof makes great barrels. We do some things differently than they do in the cores as well as the wrap. However I will not, even as a competitor who would like to win your business, bad mouth them for the differences in their process vs. ours. They make a broad range of things with standard chambers and what they make they make well. I offer more flexibility/customization to the end user because we have the flexibility within the process to do so. We have a program with EB right now that you can order a proof blank from their website and get it chambered by us. EB takes the order and payment for everything, they ship to us, we cut the barrel as ordered and ship direct to the customer. If Proof wasn't making good blanks I wouldn't be doing that program.

Criterion makes good stuff at the price point they sell. I've seen them to be somewhat softer steel and the blanks seem to come up shorter on barrel life. They do shoot and you can get a few things from them that I don't make. Likewise, I make a lot of stuff that they don't. Comparatively, PVA went head to head on a contract bid with Criterion for an OEM and we won on quality and lead time. They beat us on price point by about 10%. They're very competitive on cost to both OEM's and end users.

Ultimately, PVA is still very much custom oriented with the capacity to handle contracts for places doing 25-100 barrels a month. This puts us in a bit of a unique position within the precision rifle market. We're not Proof or Criterion doing 1000+ a month but we're also more capable than the bespoke custom shop that can do 2-3 barrels a day and only handles custom work. Our work is 100% dialed into the spindle on both ends of the barrel, we do not use the "skim pass and collet" method. This has cost us some production contracts that were more price sensitive than quality sensitive but as I explained to the OEM bid, it's a quality metric that I'm not willing to sacrifice. We offer shouldered configurations that others don't and we are typically the pioneering entry to market for new actions: IE we had the first CDG prefits out there as well as the first to offer both the barrel nut and shouldered prefits for the Tikka T3 and Sako actions.

When I opened PVA in 2013 I offered shouldered prefits for Bighorn TL and TL2 actions as the first order of business. The prefit idea was non-existent then, now it has become ubiquitous. If a new action comes out that doesn't handle prefits people don't buy it. I would like to think that idea was driven in large part by our efforts.



Barrel nut barrels offer some flexibility that don't come with shouldered prefits. One option you have from us is you can send your action and we will custom fit the first barrel, then provide a laser engraved tag for that specific action with the dimensions required to make replacements for you. We never need to see the action again unless you do something like swap the bolt or recoil lug or in other ways change the headspace. It's a standard part of our process with the installation of a custom fit barrel for an action like a Rem 700 or a Defiance Deviant; IE actions that don't have shouldered prefit capability.

PVA Benefits

1) There's no "we don't have that contour" here, everything is contoured to order. If it's not on the website let's figure out how to get what you want.
2) Every single chamber, no matter what, is dialed into the spindle. Doesn't matter what prefit or custom install we're doing they all get the same chambering treatment.
3) We are 100% CNC driven process and the consistency of size and shape on the chambers is exceptional.
4) I'm here answering questions and our reputation for cutting hammers is well known.
 
Ultimately, the decision will come down to personal preference and any specific requirements you have for your build.
 
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I'll take a minute to throw in some professional advice and I'll do my best not to make it completely a PVA Horn Tooting soap box. I will admit up front that there will be some tooting of my own horn as I have worked hard to bring our company capabilities and processes into a game where there are few true competitors.

The barrel nut prefits we have on sale are the same spec Rock blanks that we sold for years as the "button" version. They're excellent shooters, sometimes they're a little ugly inside but they shoot awesome. At the end of the day matches are won by what the target says not what the borescope says. Until we launched the Ospreys as our flagship offering, the Rock buttons were what I used personally for several years and I won a lot of local and regional stuff with them.

Should you want a shouldered install I would recommend our Ospreys. They're excellent barrels and in blind comparison they are up in the same sentence as the premium cut rifled barrels with some added benefits of life longevity and consistency in velocity across several different barrels.

Proof makes great barrels. We do some things differently than they do in the cores as well as the wrap. However I will not, even as a competitor who would like to win your business, bad mouth them for the differences in their process vs. ours. They make a broad range of things with standard chambers and what they make they make well. I offer more flexibility/customization to the end user because we have the flexibility within the process to do so. We have a program with EB right now that you can order a proof blank from their website and get it chambered by us. EB takes the order and payment for everything, they ship to us, we cut the barrel as ordered and ship direct to the customer. If Proof wasn't making good blanks I wouldn't be doing that program.

Criterion makes good stuff at the price point they sell. I've seen them to be somewhat softer steel and the blanks seem to come up shorter on barrel life. They do shoot and you can get a few things from them that I don't make. Likewise, I make a lot of stuff that they don't. Comparatively, PVA went head to head on a contract bid with Criterion for an OEM and we won on quality and lead time. They beat us on price point by about 10%. They're very competitive on cost to both OEM's and end users.

Ultimately, PVA is still very much custom oriented with the capacity to handle contracts for places doing 25-100 barrels a month. This puts us in a bit of a unique position within the precision rifle market. We're not Proof or Criterion doing 1000+ a month but we're also more capable than the bespoke custom shop that can do 2-3 barrels a day and only handles custom work. Our work is 100% dialed into the spindle on both ends of the barrel, we do not use the "skim pass and collet" method. This has cost us some production contracts that were more price sensitive than quality sensitive but as I explained to the OEM bid, it's a quality metric that I'm not willing to sacrifice. We offer shouldered configurations that others don't and we are typically the pioneering entry to market for new actions: IE we had the first CDG prefits out there as well as the first to offer both the barrel nut and shouldered prefits for the Tikka T3 and Sako actions.

When I opened PVA in 2013 I offered shouldered prefits for Bighorn TL and TL2 actions as the first order of business. The prefit idea was non-existent then, now it has become ubiquitous. If a new action comes out that doesn't handle prefits people don't buy it. I would like to think that idea was driven in large part by our efforts.



Barrel nut barrels offer some flexibility that don't come with shouldered prefits. One option you have from us is you can send your action and we will custom fit the first barrel, then provide a laser engraved tag for that specific action with the dimensions required to make replacements for you. We never need to see the action again unless you do something like swap the bolt or recoil lug or in other ways change the headspace. It's a standard part of our process with the installation of a custom fit barrel for an action like a Rem 700 or a Defiance Deviant; IE actions that don't have shouldered prefit capability.

PVA Benefits

1) There's no "we don't have that contour" here, everything is contoured to order. If it's not on the website let's figure out how to get what you want.
2) Every single chamber, no matter what, is dialed into the spindle. Doesn't matter what prefit or custom install we're doing they all get the same chambering treatment.
3) We are 100% CNC driven process and the consistency of size and shape on the chambers is exceptional.
4) I'm here answering questions and our reputation for cutting hammers is well known.
This gives me a warm & fuzzy feeling inside with a raging hard-on the outside!
 
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I have prefits from the following:

Proof
Pva
Ern at Altus
Keystone (kreiger blank)

All shoot very well with minimal load work up.

I also have non prefits for same actions and others by LRI and Black Canyon Customs.
They shoot very well too.
ETA: also have Deep South Tactical and Schultz Precision barrels that are in the same class as the others.

I live 15 min from BCC and the joy of drop off and pick up, as well as in person details, are a solid bonus.
 
I wish PVA/Keystone were in another state as I get hit with a $40-$50 extra cost each time I'm in need of a barrel.
 
👈 Another PVA fan here. As stated above they are very accurate. The barrel nut sale right now is also a deal for that quality of barrel.
 
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Proof makes great barrels. We do some things differently than they do in the cores as well as the wrap. However I will not, even as a competitor who would like to win your business, bad mouth them for the differences in their process vs. ours. They make a broad range of things with standard chambers and what they make they make well. I offer more flexibility/customization to the end user because we have the flexibility within the process to do so. We have a program with EB right now that you can order a proof blank from their website and get it chambered by us. EB takes the order and payment for everything, they ship to us, we cut the barrel as ordered and ship direct to the customer. If Proof wasn't making good blanks I wouldn't be doing that program.

Been a long day already. Who is EB?
 
I wish PVA/Keystone were in another state as I get hit with a $40-$50 extra cost each time I'm in need of a barrel.
Our barrels ship flat rate for $24.95 CONUS

Been a long day already. Who is EB?
Sorry, I should have made that more clear.
Evolved Ballistics.
 
I'll take a minute to throw in some professional advice and I'll do my best not to make it completely a PVA Horn Tooting soap box. I will admit up front that there will be some tooting of my own horn as I have worked hard to bring our company capabilities and processes into a game where there are few true competitors.

The barrel nut prefits we have on sale are the same spec Rock blanks that we sold for years as the "button" version. They're excellent shooters, sometimes they're a little ugly inside but they shoot awesome. At the end of the day matches are won by what the target says not what the borescope says. Until we launched the Ospreys as our flagship offering, the Rock buttons were what I used personally for several years and I won a lot of local and regional stuff with them.

Should you want a shouldered install I would recommend our Ospreys. They're excellent barrels and in blind comparison they are up in the same sentence as the premium cut rifled barrels with some added benefits of life longevity and consistency in velocity across several different barrels.

Proof makes great barrels. We do some things differently than they do in the cores as well as the wrap. However I will not, even as a competitor who would like to win your business, bad mouth them for the differences in their process vs. ours. They make a broad range of things with standard chambers and what they make they make well. I offer more flexibility/customization to the end user because we have the flexibility within the process to do so. We have a program with EB right now that you can order a proof blank from their website and get it chambered by us. EB takes the order and payment for everything, they ship to us, we cut the barrel as ordered and ship direct to the customer. If Proof wasn't making good blanks I wouldn't be doing that program.

Criterion makes good stuff at the price point they sell. I've seen them to be somewhat softer steel and the blanks seem to come up shorter on barrel life. They do shoot and you can get a few things from them that I don't make. Likewise, I make a lot of stuff that they don't. Comparatively, PVA went head to head on a contract bid with Criterion for an OEM and we won on quality and lead time. They beat us on price point by about 10%. They're very competitive on cost to both OEM's and end users.

Ultimately, PVA is still very much custom oriented with the capacity to handle contracts for places doing 25-100 barrels a month. This puts us in a bit of a unique position within the precision rifle market. We're not Proof or Criterion doing 1000+ a month but we're also more capable than the bespoke custom shop that can do 2-3 barrels a day and only handles custom work. Our work is 100% dialed into the spindle on both ends of the barrel, we do not use the "skim pass and collet" method. This has cost us some production contracts that were more price sensitive than quality sensitive but as I explained to the OEM bid, it's a quality metric that I'm not willing to sacrifice. We offer shouldered configurations that others don't and we are typically the pioneering entry to market for new actions: IE we had the first CDG prefits out there as well as the first to offer both the barrel nut and shouldered prefits for the Tikka T3 and Sako actions.

When I opened PVA in 2013 I offered shouldered prefits for Bighorn TL and TL2 actions as the first order of business. The prefit idea was non-existent then, now it has become ubiquitous. If a new action comes out that doesn't handle prefits people don't buy it. I would like to think that idea was driven in large part by our efforts.



Barrel nut barrels offer some flexibility that don't come with shouldered prefits. One option you have from us is you can send your action and we will custom fit the first barrel, then provide a laser engraved tag for that specific action with the dimensions required to make replacements for you. We never need to see the action again unless you do something like swap the bolt or recoil lug or in other ways change the headspace. It's a standard part of our process with the installation of a custom fit barrel for an action like a Rem 700 or a Defiance Deviant; IE actions that don't have shouldered prefit capability.

PVA Benefits

1) There's no "we don't have that contour" here, everything is contoured to order. If it's not on the website let's figure out how to get what you want.
2) Every single chamber, no matter what, is dialed into the spindle. Doesn't matter what prefit or custom install we're doing they all get the same chambering treatment.
3) We are 100% CNC driven process and the consistency of size and shape on the chambers is exceptional.
4) I'm here answering questions and our reputation for cutting hammers is well known.

Great post Josh. I have to add a .308 Osprey to the collection soon. Making my .223 TL3 the "TAC" TL3.
 
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I'll take a minute to throw in some professional advice and I'll do my best not to make it completely a PVA Horn Tooting soap box. I will admit up front that there will be some tooting of my own horn as I have worked hard to bring our company capabilities and processes into a game where there are few true competitors.

The barrel nut prefits we have on sale are the same spec Rock blanks that we sold for years as the "button" version. They're excellent shooters, sometimes they're a little ugly inside but they shoot awesome. At the end of the day matches are won by what the target says not what the borescope says. Until we launched the Ospreys as our flagship offering, the Rock buttons were what I used personally for several years and I won a lot of local and regional stuff with them.

Should you want a shouldered install I would recommend our Ospreys. They're excellent barrels and in blind comparison they are up in the same sentence as the premium cut rifled barrels with some added benefits of life longevity and consistency in velocity across several different barrels.

Proof makes great barrels. We do some things differently than they do in the cores as well as the wrap. However I will not, even as a competitor who would like to win your business, bad mouth them for the differences in their process vs. ours. They make a broad range of things with standard chambers and what they make they make well. I offer more flexibility/customization to the end user because we have the flexibility within the process to do so. We have a program with EB right now that you can order a proof blank from their website and get it chambered by us. EB takes the order and payment for everything, they ship to us, we cut the barrel as ordered and ship direct to the customer. If Proof wasn't making good blanks I wouldn't be doing that program.

Criterion makes good stuff at the price point they sell. I've seen them to be somewhat softer steel and the blanks seem to come up shorter on barrel life. They do shoot and you can get a few things from them that I don't make. Likewise, I make a lot of stuff that they don't. Comparatively, PVA went head to head on a contract bid with Criterion for an OEM and we won on quality and lead time. They beat us on price point by about 10%. They're very competitive on cost to both OEM's and end users.

Ultimately, PVA is still very much custom oriented with the capacity to handle contracts for places doing 25-100 barrels a month. This puts us in a bit of a unique position within the precision rifle market. We're not Proof or Criterion doing 1000+ a month but we're also more capable than the bespoke custom shop that can do 2-3 barrels a day and only handles custom work. Our work is 100% dialed into the spindle on both ends of the barrel, we do not use the "skim pass and collet" method. This has cost us some production contracts that were more price sensitive than quality sensitive but as I explained to the OEM bid, it's a quality metric that I'm not willing to sacrifice. We offer shouldered configurations that others don't and we are typically the pioneering entry to market for new actions: IE we had the first CDG prefits out there as well as the first to offer both the barrel nut and shouldered prefits for the Tikka T3 and Sako actions.

When I opened PVA in 2013 I offered shouldered prefits for Bighorn TL and TL2 actions as the first order of business. The prefit idea was non-existent then, now it has become ubiquitous. If a new action comes out that doesn't handle prefits people don't buy it. I would like to think that idea was driven in large part by our efforts.



Barrel nut barrels offer some flexibility that don't come with shouldered prefits. One option you have from us is you can send your action and we will custom fit the first barrel, then provide a laser engraved tag for that specific action with the dimensions required to make replacements for you. We never need to see the action again unless you do something like swap the bolt or recoil lug or in other ways change the headspace. It's a standard part of our process with the installation of a custom fit barrel for an action like a Rem 700 or a Defiance Deviant; IE actions that don't have shouldered prefit capability.

PVA Benefits

1) There's no "we don't have that contour" here, everything is contoured to order. If it's not on the website let's figure out how to get what you want.
2) Every single chamber, no matter what, is dialed into the spindle. Doesn't matter what prefit or custom install we're doing they all get the same chambering treatment.
3) We are 100% CNC driven process and the consistency of size and shape on the chambers is exceptional.
4) I'm here answering questions and our reputation for cutting hammers is well known.

Hey, thank you very much. I appreciate the information, and your passion for your products.
 
Why would you want a shoulder?

Why wouldn't you is a better question. It's like screwing a nut into a bolt. When the shoulder hits the action you are done. No setting headspace or messing with extra pieces like a nut. Nuts have their place in a Savage or Remage but if using a custom action that can take shouldered prefits then shoulders are just making your life harder for no reason.
 
Why wouldn't you is a better question. It's like screwing a nut into a bolt. When the shoulder hits the action you are done. No setting headspace or messing with extra pieces like a nut. Nuts have their place in a Savage or Remage but if using a custom action that can take shouldered prefits then shoulders are just making your life harder for no reason.

This was my thinking as well...