Turns out Corona Virus threat is all horsecrap.

vh20

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Just a thought........

It could be cultural.... like they kiss and hug each other multiple times to say hello and goodbye, especially elders....
Things like this can ALWAYS be valid factors...like eating bats.
 
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Dthomas3523

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So you think it’s more reasonable to assume that they didn’t breathe in any virus than it is to assume the virus was eliminated by their immune system? How do these medical professionals know what droplets contacted whose throat? They don’t.
I think it’s much more reasonable that the global medical community is right and you are wrong.

So, yes.
 

RyanScott

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Just a thought........

It could be cultural.... like they kiss and hug each other multiple times to say hello and goodbye, especially elders....
Italians do have cultural and demographic reasons for a high infection rate but the claim that they have 7x the death rate is based on a misunderstanding of the study period.
 
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phlegethon

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@phlegethon Yes, but how do you account for the nearly 3100 people that didn’t contract the disease? Do you think they weren’t exposed? From what I’ve seen 3711 people on board, 634 tested positive, 306 symptomatic vs 328 a symptomatic, 7 dead (all over 70), average age onboard was 58. Assuming everyone was exposed, I think it’s hard to believe they weren’t, that’s .2% mortality amongst a population 20 years older than the US.
They locked everyone in their rooms as soon as they realized there was a pandemic. We can learn about how many were symptomatic and how many die, from this ship. It was NOT a model for uncontrolled spread.
 
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phlegethon

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Italians do have cultural and demographic reasons for a high infection rate but the claim that they have 7x the death rate is based on a misunderstanding of the study period.
There is no misunderstanding. The death rate in Italy was much higher than baseline because their health system was overrun. Just like Wuhan—somewhere around 5-10%. Elsewhere in China it was 1%.

The death rate in NYC will end up closer to Wuhan and Italy for the same reason. Probably many other cities too.
 
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Dthomas3523

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The same ones that used to practice bloodletting and 1 million other forms of barbarism, and still maintain that we came from monkeys?
If you are of the opinion we didn’t evolve from the mammal we share 99% of our DNA with.......you are incapable of having a serious discussion about medicine or science.
 

phlegethon

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My my my.....
The new climate change debate is here.
They are SCIENTISTS people! They are unencumbered with personal bias and political slant!
Jeez.
Scientists have personal feelings and biases. The scientific process is very good at keeping those out of the final product. There is nothing political about the virus, but the decision to pretend it’s not a threat is clearly quite political.
 

vh20

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And just as not everyone is tested, just as many deaths as are confirmed are being labeled incorrectly.

Not every person in the country who dies or died of pneumonia is being tested for corona.

We don’t have enough tests for the living. We aren’t going to use them on the dead.

So, for every non diagnosed corona survivor, there is likely 1-3% deaths not account for either.

You can’t say some people who survived weren’t tested without including the dead who weren’t.
There are ways to diagnose the disease post mortem that don't involve test kits for the living, so that's not an issue. I venture to say that since it officially hit, anyone who has died with symptoms has been counted. Again, this is the information put out by our Covid Czar. If you want to believe the medical professionals, why not him?
 

Dthomas3523

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Shut it down folks. The people on sniper’s hide have decided the entire global medical community has missed a ghost immunity to a virus that they are all dedicating their entire life to.

None of them were able to find this immunity with all their tools and education, not to mention life’s devotion.

Sniper’s hide members in their underwear at home figures it out though.
 

Dthomas3523

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That’s literally what you’re saying. The global medical community has completely missed it and doesn’t see there is a massive amount of people immune to a virus the human body has never encountered.
 

armorpl8chikn

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Shut it down folks. The people on sniper’s hide have decided the entire global medical community has missed a ghost immunity to a virus that they are all dedicating their entire life to.

None of them were able to find this immunity with all their tools and education, not to mention life’s devotion.

Sniper’s hide members in their underwear at home figures it out though.
Don't forget that some of us have actual professions outside this board and eating cheetos in our underwear.
I am keenly familiar with scientific method and have been over 30 years.
 
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Dthomas3523

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Don't forget that some of us have actual professions outside this board and eating cheetos in our underwear.
I am keenly familiar with scientific method and have been over 30 years.
Then you should get off your computer and go show them the immunity they have missed.

That way they can stop all these measures they implemented.

Since you know what they missed, you should be able to use your profession to show them right? Why are you still here. You can save the economy single handedly today.
 

ken226

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The same ones that used to practice bloodletting and 1 million other forms of barbarism, and still maintain that we came from monkeys?

I sure hope my doctor didn't used to practice bloodletting, but I'll certainly keep an eye open for that!

The dentist that took out my wisdom teeth at Martin Army Hospital was a barbaric fucker though.
 

Dthomas3523

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If 3,000 people’s off that ship of 4,000 immune system fought off the virus, we have zero need for all of this.

75% of people are immune to it according to those numbers.

Apparently they somehow didn’t see that........
 

armorpl8chikn

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Then you should get off your computer and go show them the immunity they have missed.

That way they can stop all these measures they implemented.

Since you know what they missed, you should be able to use your profession to show them right? Why are you still here. You can save the economy single handedly today.
Really?
Un fucking believable.
 

Dthomas3523

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Really?
Un fucking believable.
Exactly. Sit down and let the people who know what they are doing (medical professionals worldwide) do their job.

Unless you can contribute something to actually help other than spreading misinformation.
 
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jakelly

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I’m saying that the scientific community, has been infiltrated, politicized, and weaponized. In order to find facts or truth within that realm, you are going to have to dig much deeper and think critically. It wouldn’t be a bad idea to examine the work of the many folks who have been ostracized, forcibly silenced, and removed from their ranks. Those publicly advertised (especially during crisis) as experts are among the last voices to be trusted.
 

armorpl8chikn

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Unless you can contribute something to actually help other than spreading misinformation.
You mean like you are doing?
Dismissing people because you think they "are just internet warriors".
Dismissing people because they "don't believe they evolved from a monkey"?

Your bias is showing....and I gotta say, it might be blocking your vision a bit.
 
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Dthomas3523

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You mean like you are doing?
Dismissing people because you think they "are just internet warriors".
Dismissing people because they "don't believe they evolved from a monkey"?

Your bias is showing....and I gotta say, it might be blocking your vision a bit.
My bias is towards misinformation.

Here’s how much of this misinformation plays out.

80% of corona patients will not need any type of hospital care.

20% will.

10% will need ventilator.

3-5% who go on ventilators will die.

We don’t have enough ventilators. So, now even more of those 10% will die because they didn’t have access to a ventilator.

Every time someone online says “it’s not as bad as they say” or “this is not worth ruining the economy” that is another chance of someone reading it who was on the fence with their opinion. Or they where leaning towards the same opinion.

Now that person who has no clue they have corona feels validated in leaving their house when they should be sitting at home doing their part with social distancing.

Now, they have a good chance of spreading it and now we have even more people with a chance to not get that ventilator.

That’s my bias.
 
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Dthomas3523

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I’m not here to change anyone’s mind already posting here.

Just like the threads with misinformation about loading, ballistics, fundamentals, etc etc, I’m trying the keep the other people reading from getting caught up in noise without facts.
 

jakelly

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What does it matter what opinion anyone has? Our actions are being dictated by decree and necessity. Seems like most of the population is doing what you want to see them doing. So far as it in their power. If it is like you’re saying, then we probably ought to just bring in martial law and make the unruly obey. For two months nobody goes outside and we should be good. Fifty percent of the population will starve to death, and we’ll destroy our country, but we won’t have to worry about Corona virus.

Have you considered the possibility that you’ve been lied to, and that your side is actually spreading dangerous misinformation?
 
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phlegethon

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If 3,000 people’s off that ship of 4,000 immune system fought off the virus, we have zero need for all of this.

75% of people are immune to it according to those numbers.

Apparently they somehow didn’t see that........
Remember there are differences between people genetically, so just like there are people who are immune to HIV (this happens rarely but it exists) there could be people who are immune to SARS-CoV-2. Maybe they have a slightly different ACE receptor. But the key thing is it doesn’t matter. If there were widespread innate immunity, that would show up in the observed spread of the virus and the R0. That isn’t the case, unless you believe in crazy global conspiracies and the whole world is a lie and only you are right.

edit: to be clear, when I said “you” above I meant in the generic sense, not @Dthomas3523 who seems to be one of the few smart people here.
 
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armorpl8chikn

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My bias is towards misinformation.

Here’s how much of this misinformation plays out.

80% of corona patients will not need any type of hospital care.

20% will.

10% will need ventilator.

3-5% who go on ventilators will die.

We don’t have enough ventilators. So, now even more of those 10% will die because they didn’t have access to a ventilator.

Every time someone online says “it’s not as bad as they say” or “this is not worth ruining the economy” that is another chance of someone reading it who was on the fence with their opinion. Or they where leaning towards the same opinion.

Now that person who has no clue they have corona feels validated in leaving their house when they should be sitting at home doing their part with social distancing.

Now, they have a good chance of spreading it and now we have even more people with a chance to not get that ventilator.

That’s my bias.
What you've written sounds a lot like a bad flu season. You don't ever see it, cause there isn't a fucking reporter, misreporting numbers hourly.
You yourself, admitted to posting bad numbers up thread.

What's driving me nuts is people everywhere screaming that we are "all gonna die".

During flu season, I agree, people should limit their exposure, and practice good hygiene. And. Stay the fuck at home if you are sick.
If you are saying the world is full of assholes, I completely agree. I am an asshole myself, got a badge and trophy to prove it. I stay at home when I'm sick though.

I think I've had that shit.
I'll be the first to line up and be tested and give plasma......but that isn't being requested.
Why?

There is more waffling by to scientists every day.

You don't believe what you cant prove. I respect that.
I don't believe everything disseminated by MSM or government scientists. That makes me a retard to some. I'm good with that too.
 

Dthomas3523

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Remember there are differences between people genetically, so just like there are people who are immune to HIV (this happens rarely but it exists) there could be people who are immune to SARS-CoV-2. Maybe they have a slightly different ACE receptor. But the key thing is it doesn’t matter. If there were widespread innate immunity, that would show up in the observed spread of the virus and the R0. That isn’t the case, unless you believe in crazy global conspiracies and the whole world is a lie and only you are right.

edit: to be clear, when I said “you” above I meant in the generic sense, not @Dthomas3523 who seems to be one of the few smart people here.
People immune to HIV are mutations stemming from the bubonic plague and are about 3% of a very small population.

Anyone immune to this Coronavirus is going to be incredibly rare......if such a person exists.

So, I completely agree with you. And I’m not saying there isn’t someone immune somehow.

Bit it ain’t 3,000 people on a cruise ship.
 

phlegethon

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Also, I keep seeing this straw man argument that we have to choose between doing nothing or closing everything down for a year. That is not true. Effective control at the beginning will require more than we are doing, yes, and it will be painful. But once things start to slow it may be possible to restart many parts of society in a controlled fashion. This is a great article about what that may look like:
 

Dthomas3523

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What you've written sounds a lot like a bad flu season. You don't ever see it, cause there isn't a fucking reporter, misreporting numbers hourly.
You yourself, admitted to posting bad numbers up thread.

What's driving me nuts is people everywhere screaming that we are "all gonna die".

During flu season, I agree, people should limit their exposure, and practice good hygiene. And. Stay the fuck at home if you are sick.
If you are saying the world is full of assholes, I completely agree. I am an asshole myself, got a badge and trophy to prove it. I stay at home when I'm sick though.

I think I've had that shit.
I'll be the first to line up and be tested and give plasma......but that isn't being requested.
Why?

There is more waffling by to scientists every day.

You don't believe what you cant prove. I respect that.
I don't believe everything disseminated by MSM or government scientists. That makes me a retard to some. I'm good with that too.
Problem is, even with a bad flu season, we have developed herd immunity and have decades of research and vaccines to draw from.

We are at ground zero for corona.

In another year or 20, it’s very well possible corona will be another seasonal virus like the flu in which we have immunities and it only kills 0.06%
 

phlegethon

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People immune to HIV are mutations stemming from the bubonic plague and are about 3% of a very small population.

Anyone immune to this Coronavirus is going to be incredibly rare......if such a person exists.

So, I completely agree with you. And I’m not saying there isn’t someone immune somehow.

Bit it ain’t 3,000 people on a cruise ship.
Yes. True. The only thing I’ll add is that the reason all 3700 on the Diamond Princess didn’t get it is almost certainly that they locked the whole ship down. Was that perfect, no probably not. But people are trying to use that as some worst case example. It wasn’t.
 

Son of Dorn

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Fucked up as it might seem, people are actually putting bets on future numbers.
Never underestimate the ability of people to do fucked up shit like that. But that's kinda mild and pleasantly macabre compared to some things.
 

The DFC

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Rocketmandb

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If you are of the opinion we didn’t evolve from the mammal we share 99% of our DNA with.......you are incapable of having a serious discussion about medicine or science.
You have just hit on a critical point - many people suffer from the same incapability. Honestly, as data-driven and logical as I've seen you be on these forums, I don't know why you're engaging here. It can only be an exercise in frustration. I've been lurking out of sheer infatuation with trying to understand how far people will go to defend their opinion over data presented to them.
 
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Rocketmandb

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Also, I keep seeing this straw man argument that we have to choose between doing nothing or closing everything down for a year. That is not true. Effective control at the beginning will require more than we are doing, yes, and it will be painful.
Bing! Bing! Bing! This is the winning argument!

As cold as this may sound to some, the happy medium (if you can call anything about this "happy") is to throttle the spread to match healthcare capacity to care for the critically ill (with a buffer, of course). Spread is throttled by increasing or relaxing "quarantine" measures in different areas.

To do this, however, we need testing. Contrary to what someone said a few weeks ago ("anyone who wants a test gets a test"), there are not nearly enough tests out there, and those that are out there are woefully inadequate, with results taking days (they need to take minutes). This one item has been a colossal failure of leadership which has dramatically impacted the spread of the disease.
 
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DarnYankeeUSMC

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You forgot to add in that these practicing experts also account for about 150,000 deaths per year due to malpractice/misdiagnosis or whatever. It really doesn't matter it's still 150K people.
So doctor's killed more people yesterday than the virus. But no one's counting.
The same ones that used to practice bloodletting and 1 million other forms of barbarism, and still maintain that we came from monkeys?
 

wade2big

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My bias is towards misinformation.

Here’s how much of this misinformation plays out.

80% of corona patients will not need any type of hospital care.

20% will.

10% will need ventilator.

3-5% who go on ventilators will die.

We don’t have enough ventilators. So, now even more of those 10% will die because they didn’t have access to a ventilator.

Every time someone online says “it’s not as bad as they say” or “this is not worth ruining the economy” that is another chance of someone reading it who was on the fence with their opinion. Or they where leaning towards the same opinion.

Now that person who has no clue they have corona feels validated in leaving their house when they should be sitting at home doing their part with social distancing.

Now, they have a good chance of spreading it and now we have even more people with a chance to not get that ventilator.

That’s my bias.
How do you know there aren’t enough ventilators? We have plenty as of now. The future is just that. New York has thousands sitting in warehouses unused. Even Cuomo had to admit that after he was called out.

These end of the world models being pushed were created by left wing activists. They have not been proven accurate. The opposite actually.
 
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wade2big

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Scientists have personal feelings and biases. The scientific process is very good at keeping those out of the final product. There is nothing political about the virus, but the decision to pretend it’s not a threat is clearly quite political.
Its clearly political for the ones pushing mass hysteria.
 

DarnYankeeUSMC

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So you are a believer in evolution but you don't want to continue with it?
I think your statement to disqualify any one's contribution to the discussion that doesn't believe in evolution is total bullshit and a copout.
If you are of the opinion we didn’t evolve from the mammal we share 99% of our DNA with.......you are incapable of having a serious discussion about medicine or science.
 

DarnYankeeUSMC

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One of the first cruise ship passengers that docked in Japan has tested positive multiple times, over five I believe, but has never had a symptom. His wife tested positive and had a fever for eight hours and no other symptoms. She's now testing negative.
Maybe they should be studying him?
Then you should get off your computer and go show them the immunity they have missed.

That way they can stop all these measures they implemented.

Since you know what they missed, you should be able to use your profession to show them right? Why are you still here. You can save the economy single handedly today.
 

Zorrosdens

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I’m saying that the scientific community, has been infiltrated, politicized, and weaponized. In order to find facts or truth within that realm, you are going to have to dig much deeper and think critically. It wouldn’t be a bad idea to examine the work of the many folks who have been ostracized, forcibly silenced, and removed from their ranks. Those publicly advertised (especially during crisis) as experts are among the last voices to be trusted.
Who??
 

Snipe260

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We will likely have over 1k deaths in this current 24hr period.

It’s going to get a lot worse before it gets better.

With a virtual 100% infection rate if you are exposed, and not doing a 100% lockdown, we will start (we have already begun) to see exponential increases very soon.
I agree with this! Some people think this is a joke! That’s far from the truth! This shit is serious and any one with a brain will take it that way!
 
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jakelly

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Bing! Bing! Bing! This is the winning argument!

As cold as this may sound to some, the happy medium (if you can call anything about this "happy") is to throttle the spread to match healthcare capacity to care for the critically ill (with a buffer, of course). Spread is throttled by increasing or relaxing "quarantine" measures in different areas.

To do this, however, we need testing. Contrary to what someone said a few weeks ago ("anyone who wants a test gets a test"), there are not nearly enough tests out there, and those that are out there are woefully inadequate, with results taking days (they need to take minutes). This one item has been a colossal failure of leadership which has dramatically impacted the spread of the disease.
How can any logic that demands shutting down a major city today, not warrant keeping it shut down three months from now?
You want data:
1700 people have died in the US.
158000000 have been told to stay home.
3700 people were on a cruise ship with 696 carriers testing positive, and 8 over age 70 died. Most infected were asymptomatic.
This is if you believe what we’re told, and I have serious doubts.
If you don’t believe people in a vast global conspiracy, well you aren’t listening...
339C86F0-88EC-43CE-8C00-5926FF6F8B96.jpeg
 

Dippy

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If you are of the opinion we didn’t evolve from the mammal we share 99% of our DNA with.......you are incapable of having a serious discussion about medicine or science.
Mr. Scientist:

Can you inform me which one of these mammals we evolved from and share 99% DNA with please?

Yours truly
A Creation of God
 
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Dippy

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Scientists have personal feelings and biases. The scientific process is very good at keeping those out of the final product. There is nothing political about the virus, but the decision to pretend it’s not a threat is clearly quite political.
Everything has been corrupted and politicized, including but not limited to:
Science
Scientists
Scientific tests
Wuhan virus
Climate change
Human history
 
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