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useing blc-2 powder....

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black_ump

Gunny Sergeant
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Jul 16, 2007
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an any one get me started in a safe effective way using blc-2 powder.

what are some accurate 308 loads with these bullet grains, just looking or a starting point, 26" barrel 1-10 twist

110 siarra jhp
147 fmj ball
155 palma match
168 hornady match
175 s match kings
180 combined tech bullistic silver tips
190 siarra match king
 
Re: useing blc-2 powder....

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: black_ump</div><div class="ubbcode-body">an any one get me started in a safe effective way using blc-2 powder.

what are some accurate 308 loads with these bullet grains, just looking or a starting point, 26" barrel 1-10 twist

110 siarra jhp
147 fmj ball
155 palma match
168 hornady match
175 s match kings
180 combined tech bullistic silver tips
190 siarra match king </div></div>

In a 308 BLC2 is too fast to get the best velocities for anything over 165/168 grains. It's designed to run 308's ~ `150gr bullets.

It runs 223's very well with 75gr bullets.

I shot 155 Amax with ~ 47gr max from my dad's 308. BLC2 is a very easy metering powder, shoots consistently, but it does have the annoying temp sensitivity that makes your dope change when the temperature drops or increases more than about 15 deg F

Hodgdon's website will have LOTS of 308 loads for you on this powder.
 
Re: useing blc-2 powder....

Is there a reason you want to run BLC2 in your .308?
If your Full progressive reloading I could see why, but there are many temperature stable powders that do an outstanding job with .308, Like Reloader - 15 and Hodgdon's Varget.

I use BLC2 in My AR-15 but I'm fully progressive reloading, not measuring each charge.
Just wondering what your reloading style is.
 
Re: useing blc-2 powder....

i use it cause my uncle got me started on it, what is a good all around hodgon powder ?
 
Re: useing blc-2 powder....

iam looking for a powder that will "run the scale" of bullets, from 110 to 190
 
Re: useing blc-2 powder....

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: black_ump</div><div class="ubbcode-body">iam looking for a powder that will "run the scale" of bullets, from 110 to 190 </div></div>

You can shoot all of them with BLC-2, it's just that BLC-2 isn't well suited to the heavier ones.

You'll be losing several hundred FPS over something like H4895 or Barget or RL-15

RL-15 would be a good place to look without having to find Varget. That's more suitable for the long range and target bullet application (155-190) and it'll still shoot the light ones. You'll probably be a little limited on velocity in the smaller bullets like the 110 just because you can't get enough powder in the case, but they're still going to be screamin' from that barrel.
 
Re: useing blc-2 powder....

QuickLOAD with 56.0 grains water case capacity shows a 26-inch barrel getting, with a max load of Ball-C(2):

175 SMK: 2775 fps
Port pressure within 200 PSI of M14 max

190 SMK: 2647 (!)
Port pressure closer to nominal than to max for M14

180 Silvertip Omitted b/c I don't have the bullet base-to-tip length

168 Hornady: 2836
Port pressure within high spec for M14

155 2156 New Palma 155: 2951 (!!!)
Port pressure almost 200 PSI over M14 spec

147-gr FMJBT: 3032 YIKES


110 Sierra HP seated 2.49 OAL, almost 7% compressed, 3446.
Exceeds high tolerance of M14 port pressure

Sounds pretty all-round to me.
 
Re: useing blc-2 powder....

looks like iam going to have to use blc2 for every thing 155 and smaller.

so what is a good ( and common ) powder for pushing the heavier bullets out to longer ranges ?
 
Re: useing blc-2 powder....

you boys saying BL-C(2) is not good for the heavies do realize that even hodgdon lists max as getting 100+ fps more than varget at 300CUP less pressure with a 200gr bullet, right? ditto for RL-15. my go to hunting load for northern MN is <span style="font-weight: bold">43.8gr BL-C(2) under a 200gr win silvertip</span> (the old ones with the alum RN). crono's right at 2550 fps. knocks bull moose on their butt.


<span style="font-weight: bold">over max listed load. work up your own loads.</span>
 
Re: useing blc-2 powder....

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jr81452</div><div class="ubbcode-body">you boys saying BL-C(2) is not good for the heavies do realize that even hodgdon lists max as getting 100+ fps more than varget at 300CUP less pressure with a 200gr bullet, right? ditto for RL-15. my go to hunting load for northern MN is <span style="font-weight: bold">43.8gr BL-C(2) under a 200gr win silvertip</span> (the old ones with the alum RN). crono's right at 2550 fps. knocks bull moose on their butt.


<span style="font-weight: bold">over max listed load. work up your own loads.</span> </div></div>



so what your saying is blc2 will work for the heavy loads in my semi auto ?
 
Re: useing blc-2 powder....

no, what he is saying is WORK UP YOUR OWN LOAD. start low, watch for over pressure signs and chill out man. I've only lightly read this thread and if you are asking for a single powder to run the gambit of all projectiles listed, then you had your answer a few replies ago.

H4895, Varget, and RL15 - these three are the quintessential GO TO powders for nearly every guy putting together a buffet for their .308 bang stick.

Bear in mind, EVERY rifle is different. Primer choice matters. Brass choice MATTERS (maybe even more than primer choice...in my random readings i've seen alot of variance in case capacity between brands/makes)...your gun matters.

The only person who is going to be telling you what you WANT to hear is the sarcastic ass that wants to see you blow yourself up. that person does not exist on this board to my knowledge.

So again...

Start low, work up, watch for pressure signs, and if you can...please chrony your loads.
 
Re: useing blc-2 powder....

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JasonB</div><div class="ubbcode-body">no, what he is saying is WORK UP YOUR OWN LOAD. start low, watch for over pressure signs and chill out man. I've only lightly read this thread and if you are asking for a single powder to run the gambit of all projectiles listed, then you had your answer a few replies ago.

H4895, Varget, and RL15 - these three are the quintessential GO TO powders for nearly every guy putting together a buffet for their .308 bang stick.

Bear in mind, EVERY rifle is different. Primer choice matters. Brass choice MATTERS (maybe even more than primer choice...in my random readings i've seen alot of variance in case capacity between brands/makes)...your gun matters.

The only person who is going to be telling you what you WANT to hear is the sarcastic ass that wants to see you blow yourself up. that person does not exist on this board to my knowledge.

So again...

Start low, work up, watch for pressure signs, and if you can...please chrony your loads. </div></div>

above they said varget wasnt good for semi auto's is the rl powders good for this ? i think ill try the imr powder for the heavy loads and the blc for the light loads
 
Re: useing blc-2 powder....

I've chased the one powder for everything for awhile. It seems that the best you can really do is two powders, then settle for what you get. BLC-2 shoots .25 moa from my AR-15 HB, 52 gr. Berger. IMR 4064 shoots ragged holes from both a 40X and an AR-10. 168's For the ususal 100 yrds. I have access to, I don't shoot the heavies. I hate trickling, but the accuracy of the 4064 is hard to beat. I'm trying RL-15, as it meters +/- .2 or .3 through the Dillon, and I want to progressive load both cartridges. Also, I happen to have the RL on hand. I've about settled on Ramshot TAC for the one powder choice, but I don't shoot 1K.

If you want the absolute best performance, you'll probably have to have 2 or 3 powders to get there.
 
Re: useing blc-2 powder....

black_ump - i'm not saying they didn't say that...but IF they did, I missed it. I even re-read the whole thing and can't seem to put my finger on that mark.

One place you might want to look is HERE

alot off good info there complete with the rifle that it was shot out of...but of course, YMMV
 
Re: useing blc-2 powder....

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: black_ump</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
so what your saying is blc2 will work for the heavy loads in my semi auto ? </div></div>

if by "work" you mean it will cycle the action and push the projectile out the other end, then yes. however, i can not speak to how accurate your rifle will be using blc2. only working up your loads will tell you that. but it will certainly "work" and do so safely so long as you work your loads up the proper way. just go over to the hodgdon web site and look at the load table for blc2 in 308 win. it runs from 110gr to 200gr projectiles. in MY hunting rig, it runs that range with a max of .75moa out to 500 yrds. in your rig, it may do as well; it may not.
 
Re: useing blc-2 powder....

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: black_ump</div><div class="ubbcode-body">[snip internal quote]

above they said varget wasnt good for semi auto's is the rl powders good for this ? i think ill try the imr powder for the heavy loads and the blc for the light loads </div></div>
My paper research, QuickLOAD correlated with real-life, and cross-checking some of the insane loads posted on this site make me believe that "they" don't know ***t. I hear a lot of "X powder" or "Y weight bullets" will batter your op rod" from people who never post anything indicating that they have any idea what the port pressure specs are, not to mention what the load actually generates.

What's the port pressure spec for your semiauto? I'm thinking you're on an AR10 system. I don't even know how many inches down the tube the port is. Tell me those two things and then I can weigh in on the likelihood of any powder/bullet combo being too hard on the rifle.

I know that for the M14 and its port at 14.125 inches down from the breechface, the heaviest loads with the lighter bullets are pushing the piston the hardest. Heavier bullet loads push it softer. My ejection patterns indicate op rod speeds consistent with these modeled predictions.

And since the software matches actual testing from the NRA in the mid-1980s, I have reason to believe it's accurate at least for WW-748 and IMR 4895. Ball-C(2) models similarly to 748, with the heavier bullets giving lower port pressures than lighter ones.

Personally, I think the "heavy bullets bash your op rod" and "Varget is too slow for the M14" opinions are ill-informed, unsubstantiated, and demonstrably false shooter's myths.
 
Re: useing blc-2 powder....

Great. When I was a teenager, I studied the drawings on that system and eventually concluded it was a roller-locked, delayed blowback design which seriously abuses the case by using it as a de facto gas piston. Unlocking is by recoil operation of that part of the bolt that releases the rollers.

No port.

I'm not too familiar with the clones or the variations on the G3. Did the msg90 come with a 26-inch barrel? If so, exact same bolt and rollers and such as the G3?

So....what pressure is the chamber supposed to be at when the bullet leaves the bore? How do they figger the specs???? I guess I could calculate the pressure at bullet release for a G3...
 
Re: useing blc-2 powder....

not sure on pressure limits, i do know the msg90 has a 24" barrel i went with 26 didnt wanna cut it down. it is delay blow back just like the g3 but its locking piece has a diffrent angle cut into it and its bolt and locking piece are titanium. the diffrent angle lets it unlock faster
 
Re: useing blc-2 powder....

A while back I bought 80lbs of W846 andloaded it close to BLC2 specs.
I loaded all of it in 223 and 308 and ran it through my HK21 and M16.
BLC2 W846 is a very versatile powder and used to be CHEAP

did I mention how well it meters?
 
Re: useing blc-2 powder....

i had good results with my 5R and 45 gr of BLC2. Only reason I switched to Varget was because of temp sensitivity
 
Re: useing blc-2 powder....

I couldn't get it to print well with a 7mm-08 in a Kimber bolt, went to Varget and got much better results.
 
Re: useing blc-2 powder....

Well, I'm getting 8723 psi muzzle pressure predicted with IMR 4895 and Winchester 147-gr bullets. Had to correct the data file as it didn't have the bullet length or boat-tail dimensions.

In 55.5-gr chambers, it's mild for pressure but gets the 2800 fps at muzzle that I think it needs to be about 2750 at 78 feet like Uncle Sugar's ammo is supposed to be.

So, ASSUMING that the NATO specs for M80 Ball centered around that muzzle pressure out of a 22-inch barrel, it would be like to know the tolerance (high and low range) allowable.

Your 26-inch barrel takes the predicted velocity with that load up to 2900 fps, and the muzzle pressure down to 7185 PSI, and the barrel time of the bullet about 0.117 milliseconds longer.

Will that "extra time" before pressure release to open air affect a G3 system's unlocking, or the residual pressure in the chamber as extraction begins? Heckifiknow. If you can find a timeline of the firing cycle of your HK system, then have at it.

I can tell you that a predicted 2900 fps charge of Ball-C(2) powder models to 7305 PSI muzzle pressure, and has a SHORTER barrel time than the 4895 load, so the paper answer is that with the 147-grain bullet, Ball-C(2) might be easier on your HK system than 4895 loads.

Go up to a Sierra 190 MK, and the muzzle pressure remains lower than the 4895 load using M80 Ball bullets, and barrel time only a small bit longer than the 4895 load.

At this point, call Hodgdon's people and ask them if there are any cautions about using that powder in HK semiautos in .308. If they say no problem, I'd believe them.
 
Re: useing blc-2 powder....

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Grump</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: black_ump</div><div class="ubbcode-body">[snip internal quote]

above they said varget wasnt good for semi auto's is the rl powders good for this ? i think ill try the imr powder for the heavy loads and the blc for the light loads </div></div>
My paper research, QuickLOAD correlated with real-life, and cross-checking some of the insane loads posted on this site make me believe that "they" don't know ***t. I hear a lot of "X powder" or "Y weight bullets" will batter your op rod" from people who never post anything indicating that they have any idea what the port pressure specs are, not to mention what the load actually generates.

What's the port pressure spec for your semiauto? I'm thinking you're on an AR10 system. I don't even know how many inches down the tube the port is. Tell me those two things and then I can weigh in on the likelihood of any powder/bullet combo being too hard on the rifle.

I know that for the M14 and its port at 14.125 inches down from the breechface, the heaviest loads with the lighter bullets are pushing the piston the hardest. Heavier bullet loads push it softer. My ejection patterns indicate op rod speeds consistent with these modeled predictions.

And since the software matches actual testing from the NRA in the mid-1980s, I have reason to believe it's accurate at least for WW-748 and IMR 4895. Ball-C(2) models similarly to 748, with the heavier bullets giving lower port pressures than lighter ones.

Personally, I think the "heavy bullets bash your op rod" and "Varget is too slow for the M14" opinions are ill-informed, unsubstantiated, and demonstrably false shooter's myths. </div></div>


Armalite AR-10, 24" tube, gas port located 13.25" from breach face. Currently running 44.2gr of RL-15, 175gr SHPBT, in LC 89 MG brass. Not sure of MV yet, have not had a chance to chrono, but will print .5moa groups as long as I am doing my part behind the rifle.
 
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