Varmint AR upper feedback wanted: fluting and barrel length

[Beezer911]

Hello everyone,
Wanted to throw a couple questions out to all of you and tap into the collective knowledge pool on a couple choices I need to make to order my next varmint upper.

Quick background - looking to grab a varmint upper for prairie dogging or long range (well, long for 223) target shooting. I've narrowed things down to a White Oak varmint upper in .223 Wylde and am down to two remaining decisions. I'll list them below and would love to hear your feeling based on what you've experienced or seen.

Questions:
1. Barrell length - I have another varmint AR with an 18" barrel and it's been great. I've been going back and forth between 18, 20 and 22. 18 will be more rigid but going longer will produce more speed. Not sure if an extra 50 fps (20) or 100 fps (22) gets me that much in .223 - thoughts on this?

2. Barrel fluting - White Oak does standard (wide) flutes and narrow flutes. I was thinking narrow flutes to help cool the barrel since you can put a lot of pills down range when dogging. I do, however, tend to fire slow(er) as I'm anal about not wanting to thrash the rifling in my barrels (I'm not a mag dumper). It also lightens the gun, which isn't necessarily a plus for long range shots. For those who do a lot of p-doggin do you like / dislike fluted AR barrels? Do they actually help with thermal management or is the dissipation offset by the loss of thermal mass? As far as "looking cool" I couldn't care less. If it's not functional, I'll save the money it costs to flute.

Thanks and looking forward to the discussion!

 

[bfoosh006]

How far away are the critters you are typically shooting ? Shooting off a bench ?

I vote for the 18" narrow flutes. Nice sized AR... maybe 22" if you are stationary, and drive to the shooting position.
Guess it depends on if you move around a lot. At least for me.

This link shows the difference in point blank range between a 16.5" and a 22" 223 / 5.56... it is about 25yds on average from their ammo used.

For everyone else looking... here is the different fluting


Please let us know what you end up with.. and WOA is a trusted barrel manufacturer, so I would love to see groups !

 

[346ci]

While flutes look really cool, most of it will be under the hand guard on an AR. I'd save the money...

If we were taking a bolt gun, I might splurge for some of those crazy patterns from LRI.

 

[Beezer911]

Thanks! Distance-wise I'm fine shooting as far as the cartridge will let me, which is likely between 500-600 yards at a dog.

For targets, the range I belong to goes to 1000yd but I'm much more apt to stick with the 6.5 cm bolt there. That said, I'd probably play around in the 600-1000 range on steel just to see what's possible with the gun (and me).

I'm torn on just getting the 22" for two reasons. The lesser of the two is that it'll be two long for my current AR case, but this is easily fixed by separating the upper from the lower. Not a show stopper, just me wanting to be lazy and avoid buying a longer case. The weight is the bigger issue. Normally we drive to where we shoot, but there are times I prefer to hike away from the road to get a better angle wind-wise. I go overboard and throw my ammo, optics, tripods and gun in / on a meat hauling frame style pack so the weight carries well. That said I've never once wished my gear was just a little heavier...

 

[Beezer911]

While flutes look really cool, most of it will be under the hand guard on an AR. I'd save the money...

If we were taking a bolt gun, I might splurge for some of those crazy patterns from LRI.

If it were just looks, I wouldn't even consider them. I'm trying to figure out if the increased surface area will provide an appreciable benefit in cooling.

 

[Ndbowhunter]

for stated purpose... no flutes. 22"

 

[Mike_in_FL]

I don't know how successful trying to dual purpose a .223 will be. What you want to shoot at targets at distance is not the bullets typically used for varmint hunting. I would not go faster than a 1:8 and then it becomes a guess as to how well anything below 55-ish grains shoots.

Unless you know you're going to be doing high volume shooting where the time for the barrel to cool off quickly is important I would skip the fluting and just go with a heavy barrel. If you're shooting off a bench or prone I'd go 22 - 24" for the velocity.

 

[Ndbowhunter]

53gr amazing (I mean amax) do real well out of 7 and 8 twist spouts

 

[redneckbmxer24]

Personally I’ve buy a Rock River varmint or predator pursuit 20” upper and be done with it. I’ve had a few and they were all 1/2 minute guns. One 18” would shoot little knots with Winchester white box 45gr even.

 

[gimpy]

WOA’s SDM barrel should get you what you want

 

[346ci]

If it were just looks, I wouldn't even consider them. I'm trying to figure out if the increased surface area will provide an appreciable benefit in cooling.

I doubt you would see a difference with those flutes. Save the money.

 

[tuckybill]

22" no flutes and pay extra for a Bartlein cut blank over a Wilson button blank. For the twist I would go 1-8

 

[tuckybill]

Just checked them out. Get the service rifle gain twist Bartlein............sexy! Seriously a Wilson blank should do just find for what your wanting. No real need to pay the cut barreled price. Good luck

 

[bill_van]

From experience, fluting a barrel only reduces the weight. The loss of barrel mass can be described as "yes they cool faster, but they also heat faster" since there is less mass to absorb the heat.

If weight is a concern, get the fluted. If not, skip it and save the $$'s BTW, highly recommend WOA. On the cheap side, I stumbled into an AR Stoner 18" fluted and it ended up being a 1/2 MOA shooter..... much to my surprise! At the time, ER Shaw was the manufacture. 5R and Wilde chamber with 1:8 twist. For what it is, no complaints at all.

 

[n2ishun]

+1 on the gain twist
I'd go 7 finish on the twist so you can shoot the heavier bullets w/o issue....like 80-85'ish.
I've had real good luck with a Lilja heavy 24" fluted for prairie rats (prairie dogs).
Shoot that sucker all day long and never have an issue....let cool after every 300 rounds or so.
When I shoot prairie rats I shoot about 1k rounds a day......I know a huge dog town that's on private land.
The land owner loves me long time

 

[Beezer911]

Thanks for the feedback everyone. I think I’m going to go with the majority of recommendations and do a 22” threaded but no fluting. I’d love to go bezerk and get a Barty gain twist, but I just can’t see doing that on an AR. I do intend to build a bolt gun with a gain twist at some point - I’ve always wanted to try a gain twist barrel...

Thanks again! Now the hard part, waiting the 12-16 weeks to get it…

 

[Beezer911]

+1 on the gain twist
I'd go 7 finish on the twist so you can shoot the heavier bullets w/o issue....like 80-85'ish.
I've had real good luck with a Lilja heavy 24" fluted for prairie rats (prairie dogs).
Shoot that sucker all day long and never have an issue....let cool after every 300 rounds or so.
When I shoot prairie rats I shoot about 1k rounds a day......I know a huge dog town that's on private land.
The land owner loves me long time

I really need to find me a land owner in southeast SD that wants folks to help eliminate their sod puppies.