i know thay use 175 gr SMK, but what powder is the closest powder to what is used ? is it ball or stick powder ? im looking for all the specs.
- Thread starter savagehunter44
- Start date
Re: want to duplicate m118lr load.
good info, tag
good info, tag
Re: want to duplicate m118lr load.
My load is Rem case, 42.2gr IMR-4064, Fed 210M FGMM primer, 175SMK, 2.800-2.815" COAL. This is a reliable 1Kyd supersonic load out of the M1A/M14. It has been published and in use for around a decade.
Greg
My load is Rem case, 42.2gr IMR-4064, Fed 210M FGMM primer, 175SMK, 2.800-2.815" COAL. This is a reliable 1Kyd supersonic load out of the M1A/M14. It has been published and in use for around a decade.
Greg
Re: want to duplicate m118lr load.
889 lbs of 4064! neat! is this an army or marine contract? do they order separate with different powder etc?
889 lbs of 4064! neat! is this an army or marine contract? do they order separate with different powder etc?
Re: want to duplicate m118lr load.
Many powders over the years have been used. They used 4064 before, but after they had problems with temp. sensitivity of RL-15 they went back to 4064. This is the most recient loading of th M118 LR that I know of.
Many powders over the years have been used. They used 4064 before, but after they had problems with temp. sensitivity of RL-15 they went back to 4064. This is the most recient loading of th M118 LR that I know of.
Re: want to duplicate m118lr load.
M118 Long Range (DODIC AA11) for conventional forces is loaded with Reloader 15 at the lake City Army Ammunition Plant.
Mark 316 (DODIC AB39) is loaded for the United States Special Operations Command with 4064 by Federal on their Gold Medal Match production line.
Both use 175-grain Match Kings but are not the same ammunition.
M118 Long Range (DODIC AA11) for conventional forces is loaded with Reloader 15 at the lake City Army Ammunition Plant.
Mark 316 (DODIC AB39) is loaded for the United States Special Operations Command with 4064 by Federal on their Gold Medal Match production line.
Both use 175-grain Match Kings but are not the same ammunition.
Re: want to duplicate m118lr load.
Just checked with a friend who is an ammo tech. The 4064 load is SOCOMs.
the M118LR load is 43.1-43.3gr of RL-15 in LC brass.
Just checked with a friend who is an ammo tech. The 4064 load is SOCOMs.
the M118LR load is 43.1-43.3gr of RL-15 in LC brass.
Re: want to duplicate m118lr load.
I'd rather have SOCOM's load they found deficiencies in the current M118 LR load that's when they contracted federal to build this one.
Read this
http://www.dtic.mil/ndia/2009infantrysmallarms/tuesdaysessioniii8524.pdf
I'd rather have SOCOM's load they found deficiencies in the current M118 LR load that's when they contracted federal to build this one.
Read this
http://www.dtic.mil/ndia/2009infantrysmallarms/tuesdaysessioniii8524.pdf
Re: want to duplicate m118lr load.
wow, lots of info ! now the question is , is lake city brass worth a crap for loading ?
wow, lots of info ! now the question is , is lake city brass worth a crap for loading ?
Re: want to duplicate m118lr load.
hay,there is no OAL on that spec sheet
hay,there is no OAL on that spec sheet
Re: want to duplicate m118lr load.
Lc brass is fine for loading as long as it wasn't machine gun fired. I buy M118 LR brass from link below.
http://www.theamericanmarksman.com/Lake-City-LR-308-Polished-brass-_p_150.html
Lc brass is fine for loading as long as it wasn't machine gun fired. I buy M118 LR brass from link below.
http://www.theamericanmarksman.com/Lake-City-LR-308-Polished-brass-_p_150.html
Re: want to duplicate m118lr load.
I've been being lazy with my reloading lately on this clone.
Whatever brass I have (Win/BH/FC/REM), WLR primer, 41.7 4064, and a 175 SMK loaded to 2.800.
Still shoots better than I do.
I'm going to start working behind the chrono soon and see if I need to move the powder up a little...then start playing with seating depth.
I've been being lazy with my reloading lately on this clone.
Whatever brass I have (Win/BH/FC/REM), WLR primer, 41.7 4064, and a 175 SMK loaded to 2.800.
Still shoots better than I do.
I'm going to start working behind the chrono soon and see if I need to move the powder up a little...then start playing with seating depth.
Re: want to duplicate m118lr load.
I've shot two different lots of 118LR through my gun and I always get higher velocity's with the 118LR then reloaded/replica loads.
Its usually pretty siginificant too, like 20-40 fps higher.
I've shot two different lots of 118LR through my gun and I always get higher velocity's with the 118LR then reloaded/replica loads.
Its usually pretty siginificant too, like 20-40 fps higher.
Re: want to duplicate m118lr load.
some good looking brass ! better than iv seen in a long time
some good looking brass ! better than iv seen in a long time
Re: want to duplicate m118lr load.
Nice info here. Thanks for sharing.
Nice info here. Thanks for sharing.
Re: want to duplicate m118lr load.
Yea, I like the M118 LR it's a good solid longe range round. Yes it's not the end all be all you can do better with load development. But just like GMM it shoots well in most rifles and it's just plain fun to recreate.
Yea, I like the M118 LR it's a good solid longe range round. Yes it's not the end all be all you can do better with load development. But just like GMM it shoots well in most rifles and it's just plain fun to recreate.
Re: want to duplicate m118lr load.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pusher591</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've shot two different lots of 118LR through my gun and I always get higher velocity's with the 118LR then reloaded/replica loads.
Its usually pretty siginificant too, like 20-40 fps higher. </div></div>
I looked at that figure, 41.7gr, and thought that was low.
Im thinking that 41.7gr is for military brass.
From what I understand the military brass has thicker walls and therefor yields higher pressure than commercial 308 brass.
I think greg's 42.4 load is pretty close.
Then again, what do I know?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pusher591</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've shot two different lots of 118LR through my gun and I always get higher velocity's with the 118LR then reloaded/replica loads.
Its usually pretty siginificant too, like 20-40 fps higher. </div></div>
I looked at that figure, 41.7gr, and thought that was low.
Im thinking that 41.7gr is for military brass.
From what I understand the military brass has thicker walls and therefor yields higher pressure than commercial 308 brass.
I think greg's 42.4 load is pretty close.
Then again, what do I know?
Re: want to duplicate m118lr load.
better to start to low than to high
better to start to low than to high
Re: want to duplicate m118lr load.
from tip to base ? or tip to ogive ?
from tip to base ? or tip to ogive ?
Re: want to duplicate m118lr load.
2.8" would be overall length, rather than ogive length.
2.8" would be overall length, rather than ogive length.
Re: want to duplicate m118lr load.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cpt. obvious</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pusher591</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've shot two different lots of 118LR through my gun and I always get higher velocity's with the 118LR then reloaded/replica loads.
Its usually pretty siginificant too, like 20-40 fps higher. </div></div>
I looked at that figure, 41.7gr, and thought that was low.
Im thinking that 41.7gr is for military brass.
From what I understand the military brass has thicker walls and therefor yields higher pressure than commercial 308 brass.
I think greg's 42.4 load is pretty close.
Then again, what do I know? </div></div>
From "wiki" here's a list of components:
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Cartridge, Caliber 7.62mm Special Ball, Long Range, MK 316 MOD 0 (United States): A 175-grain round specifically designed for long-range sniping consisting of <span style="font-weight: bold">Sierra MatchKing Hollow Point Boat Tail</span> projectiles, <span style="font-weight: bold">Federal Cartridge Company match cartridge cases</span> and <span style="font-weight: bold">Gold Medal Match primers</span>. The Propellant has been verified as <span style="font-weight: bold">IMR 4064 (per NSN 1305-01-567-6944 and Federal Cartridge Company Contract/Order Number N0016408DJN28 and has a charge weight per the specs of 41.745 grains)</span>.[6]</div></div>
By this, it would appear that the "load" is for civilian brass, not the NATO small capacity brass.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cpt. obvious</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pusher591</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've shot two different lots of 118LR through my gun and I always get higher velocity's with the 118LR then reloaded/replica loads.
Its usually pretty siginificant too, like 20-40 fps higher. </div></div>
I looked at that figure, 41.7gr, and thought that was low.
Im thinking that 41.7gr is for military brass.
From what I understand the military brass has thicker walls and therefor yields higher pressure than commercial 308 brass.
I think greg's 42.4 load is pretty close.
Then again, what do I know? </div></div>
From "wiki" here's a list of components:
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Cartridge, Caliber 7.62mm Special Ball, Long Range, MK 316 MOD 0 (United States): A 175-grain round specifically designed for long-range sniping consisting of <span style="font-weight: bold">Sierra MatchKing Hollow Point Boat Tail</span> projectiles, <span style="font-weight: bold">Federal Cartridge Company match cartridge cases</span> and <span style="font-weight: bold">Gold Medal Match primers</span>. The Propellant has been verified as <span style="font-weight: bold">IMR 4064 (per NSN 1305-01-567-6944 and Federal Cartridge Company Contract/Order Number N0016408DJN28 and has a charge weight per the specs of 41.745 grains)</span>.[6]</div></div>
By this, it would appear that the "load" is for civilian brass, not the NATO small capacity brass.
Re: want to duplicate m118lr load.
Tag
Tag
Re: want to duplicate m118lr load.
U guys should chrony that 175 smk 41.7 imr 4064 load l/c brass load from 30 degrees to 104 my velocities were were:
Remington 700P 26" barrel
At 30 degrees, 2616-2625
At 104 degrees 2615-2650
I only shot 10 of each to get a general idea
No bullshit either Vargey schmargay.... I love when douches bags try to tell me that all the military snipers use varget in their loads. I just let them go on looking ignorant.
I'll add that it shot well but I think any given reloader could tweak the load to their rifle with better results. And that I've seen wider es on loads shot on the same day. Hey it happens b.s. if nobody else has ever experienced a 50fps velocity spread.
U guys should chrony that 175 smk 41.7 imr 4064 load l/c brass load from 30 degrees to 104 my velocities were were:
Remington 700P 26" barrel
At 30 degrees, 2616-2625
At 104 degrees 2615-2650
I only shot 10 of each to get a general idea
No bullshit either Vargey schmargay.... I love when douches bags try to tell me that all the military snipers use varget in their loads. I just let them go on looking ignorant.
I'll add that it shot well but I think any given reloader could tweak the load to their rifle with better results. And that I've seen wider es on loads shot on the same day. Hey it happens b.s. if nobody else has ever experienced a 50fps velocity spread.
Re: want to duplicate m118lr load.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Deadshot2</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
By this, it would appear that the "load" is for civilian brass, not the NATO small capacity brass. </div></div>
FC brass and LC brass both have smallish case capacity.
Winchester 308 is lighter and can hold more powder.
Conversely, Win 223 brass has less case capacity than LC 223.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Deadshot2</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
By this, it would appear that the "load" is for civilian brass, not the NATO small capacity brass. </div></div>
FC brass and LC brass both have smallish case capacity.
Winchester 308 is lighter and can hold more powder.
Conversely, Win 223 brass has less case capacity than LC 223.
Re: want to duplicate m118lr load.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 2clicks</div><div class="ubbcode-body">U guys should chrony that 175 smk 41.7 imr 4064 load l/c brass load from 30 degrees to 104 my velocities were were:
At 30 degrees, 2616-2625
At 104 degrees 2615-2650
I only shot 10 of each to get a general idea
</div></div>
That load is about 2350-2380fps in my 16" and 2450ish in my 20" LTR. A friend's SPS varmint shoots it just under 2600fps.
41.5 Varget grouped better for me, same velocity.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 2clicks</div><div class="ubbcode-body">U guys should chrony that 175 smk 41.7 imr 4064 load l/c brass load from 30 degrees to 104 my velocities were were:
At 30 degrees, 2616-2625
At 104 degrees 2615-2650
I only shot 10 of each to get a general idea
</div></div>
That load is about 2350-2380fps in my 16" and 2450ish in my 20" LTR. A friend's SPS varmint shoots it just under 2600fps.
41.5 Varget grouped better for me, same velocity.
Re: want to duplicate m118lr load.
Ttt
Ttt
Re: want to duplicate m118lr load.
Way to try and hide your useless little posts to pad your post count tex. whatcha tryin to sell?
Way to try and hide your useless little posts to pad your post count tex. whatcha tryin to sell?
great info.. not to just find some 175's
Try 43.5 gr Varget with that bullet @2.810" to start. You may find it good enough to go with without a lot of fiddling.
As for the 41.7 gr IMR-4064 in FC cases with 175gr, I found it to be way slower in my 24" bbl than "advertised". 42.8 gr got the speed up where it shot good in my rifle.
The last batch of M118LR I saw loaded at the Lake City plant was RL15, this was in 2011
LC brass is thicker, therefore heavier...weigh your empty brass and you can prove this, this will
also account for slower velocity in commercial brass.
LC brass is thicker, therefore heavier...weigh your empty brass and you can prove this, this will
also account for slower velocity in commercial brass.
A good thread here, I just started with the LC and 4064, at 41.7 I am shooting 1 holers out of my 5 r Savage. I never realized how versatile the 4064 powder was, I will relegate all my varget and RL 15 to the 223 loads until its run out then go to 4064 for that round too..
Mostly that's because NATO 7.62x51 brass is heavier and has a marginally smaller internal capacity. 'My' 42.2gr load uses the slightly roomier commercial Remington .308 Win brass, and adds about .4gr of IMR-4064, which probably brings it back up to an equivalent velocity. It's not really, originally my load; I copied it straight from a Precision Shooting article on getting a guaranteed 1Kyd supersonic load in an M14/M1A.
All barrels have some velocity and harmonics variances, so tuning in and around these load specs will be of some benefit. At the time I was working with this load, the 42.2gr charge was listed by Sierra as a max, but times change.
Greg
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Kind of off the subject, but according to the article in the Sept. 2013 American Rifleman/Advances in US Sniping Ammunition.
The Navy wanted a 7.62 NATO 175gr. precision round that was more temp. stable than M118LR. They developed the Mk. 316 Mod. 0 round, appears to be M118LR spec. with different powder, Varget maybe?
Anyone have any more info on this ammo?
The Navy wanted a 7.62 NATO 175gr. precision round that was more temp. stable than M118LR. They developed the Mk. 316 Mod. 0 round, appears to be M118LR spec. with different powder, Varget maybe?
Anyone have any more info on this ammo?
There was some information circulated either on this site or a similar one that showed an "Assembly Sheet" for the MK316 Mod 0. Powder was 41.7 gr of IMR-4064, the case a "Special" Federal GMM, and Fed GMM primer, using the Sierra 175 SMK.
I've tried this load a couple of times and was OK in my old barrel. Now have to see if it will shoot well in my new Benchmark bbl.
This is great info, now that I've found some IMR-4064. Thanks guys
My question is why are the frikken squids always doing round development? WTF is wrong with my Army or the Jarheads? Good info in here.
Crane provides support, ammo and custom weapons for the Navy Seals.That is probably the reason for all the load development being done.
Regards,Mike
Regards,Mike
I still got a warstock of me clones usin rl15, shit knocks the shit out of an iron maiden at 1,200
I was shooting SOCOM issued ammo (individually weighted bullets, Match components) the other day and getting 1/4 moa groups from a semi auto gun (V=2770). I stole it in 2006 from the FBI, CIA, DEA, DHS, SAD, NSW, RRD, ISA, SSB, NSA, CAG, CMEE, ACE, MLE, TTOS, ad BSA. That about covers it for the self appointed, blow hard, just the tip, internet fact checkers.
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Only two this time? Your name dropping average is starting to slip...
Yall in search of the best long range 175g SMK load should try Alliant Power Pro 2000MR. Here is my last batch in LC brass with CCI200 primers and 47g out of a 20" tube seated to 2.80. Magnetospeed Chronograph. No pressure signs. 98% case fill.
Here is the group. .83 MOA from a bipod.
Here is the group. .83 MOA from a bipod.
Good info - I just picked up some 2000MR. Time to start a new load development process with this powder.
Yall in search of the best long range 175g SMK load should try Alliant Power Pro 2000MR. Here is my last batch in LC brass with CCI200 primers and 47g out of a 20" tube seated to 2.80. Magnetospeed Chronograph. No pressure signs. 98% case fill.
Here is the group. .83 MOA from a bipod.
