Fouling shots and accuracy

[jambau]

How many rounds does it take till your guns settle in? I've noticed that depending on what loads I shoot to foul the barrel I will get different results. For example: My current load for my .223 uses a v-max. I had many rnds left over from a previous load that uses an SMK. I've been using them for fuling shots. On a previous trip to the range I used the SMK's to foul the barrel. It took about 6 shots for the gun to settle in and the V-Max's printed it's typical groups of 3/4". Yesterday, being all out of the SMK's,
I used the V-Max loads to foul the barrel. It took about 16 shots for the gun to settle in. I thought my scope mounts came loose. The groups fired ran 1/2" or better. I actuall fired my first, five shot, "one hole group". Has anyone else notice this? What's the cause? I'm thinking jacket material.

Tikka09

 

[steve123]

Re: Fouling shots and accuracy

Maybe this is your problem???

I used to clean my barrels perfectly clean. No more. I learned it's just not necessary. Think about it...the very next shot you fire out of the barrel it's dirty again. I clean less often and clean the barrel adequately but I don't get every tiny bit of copper out.

"All" of my rifles "come in" on the 2ncd shot out of a clean cold barrel now whereas before it would take 4-5 shots, sometimes more to foul up.

 

[Smsnipes]

Re: Fouling shots and accuracy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: steve123</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Maybe this is your problem???

I used to clean my barrels perfectly clean. No more. I learned it's just not necessary. Think about it...the very next shot you fire out of the barrel it's dirty again. I clean less often and clean the barrel adequately but I don't get every tiny bit of copper out.

"All" of my rifles "come in" on the 2ncd shot out of a clean cold barrel now whereas before it would take 4-5 shots, sometimes more to foul up.

</div></div>


+1

I Only clean every 3-500 shots or when accuracy deminishes.

 

[jambau]

Re: Fouling shots and accuracy

smsnipes,

Thanks for the response. I do not clean my guns very often. Like you, only when accuracy falls off.I just thought it was odd that some bullets will foul the barrel more quickly than others.

Tikka09

 

[Smsnipes]

Re: Fouling shots and accuracy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tikka09</div><div class="ubbcode-body">smsnipes,

Thanks for the response. I do not clean my guns very often. Like you, only when accuracy falls off.I just thought it was odd that some bullets will foul the barrel more quickly than others.

Tikka09 </div></div>

Different bullets just foul more than others. There are also other variables such as muzzle velocity, grains, etc. I guess i'm lost why do you need to shoot "fouling" shots if you haven't cleaned your rifle before a range trip? My rifles are all dead on first round fired in most cases. If it's not then it's my fault.

 

[jambau]

Re: Fouling shots and accuracy

Sorry for the confusion. Here's what I should have said: I noticed that after I DO clean thoroughly It takes more shots for the gun to "settle in" with some loads than others. I do not clean after each session.

 

[anschutz64ms]

Re: Fouling shots and accuracy

I clean or at least run a few patches through the bore every 75 rounds.

 

[doc76251]

Re: Fouling shots and accuracy

Different metals in the jacket will affect things. I have observed on several different platforms that Berger's and AMAX's can be interchanged even at every other shot to no ill effect. Stuff a SMK, Nosler or Hornady in there and it will take a while to come back to you.

That is different from the settling back in after a complete scrub down of the bore. I generally see accuracy come back in at 10 - 20 rounds reaching peak at about 50 or so. This will maintain for about 500 - 600 rounds before it starts to fall off. This is in a 308. I'm currently at a touch under 700 on my 30-06 and I haven't cleaned it yet, it still shoots better than I do.

Cheers,

Doc

 

[corey4]

Re: Fouling shots and accuracy

how often, time wise, not round count, do you clean? how long does it take you guys to shoot 5-600 rounds? i have had my AR for 2 years, and have only sent 300 rounds down it.

 

[Smsnipes]

Re: Fouling shots and accuracy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: corey4</div><div class="ubbcode-body">how often, time wise, not round count, do you clean? how long does it take you guys to shoot 5-600 rounds? i have had my AR for 2 years, and have only sent 300 rounds down it. </div></div>

No specific time table for cleaning? Just when I feel accuracy is going to start being affected, which is often around 500 rounds for me personally. And when i clean my rifles I usually only run a bore snake or swab down the barrel a couple of times. No hard scrubbing with brushes or anything of that nature. As far as how long it takes to shoot that many rounds? Depends on the time of year. Springs and summer i'll blow through 500 rounds of .308 ammo every 2- 3 months.

 

[corey4]

Re: Fouling shots and accuracy

you are from mars, huh? i'm in fox chapel.

is there a long term effect letting a gun sit that long without being cleaned? will the burnt powder attract moisture?

 

[Muttt]

Re: Fouling shots and accuracy

I agree with Steve123. I usually only run a bore snake or an OTIS brush through once or twice after a range trip. I only deep clean when the accuracy drops off. I do clean the bolt and the rest of the rifle after each range trip. But, I leave the rifling alone.

 

[Smsnipes]

Re: Fouling shots and accuracy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: corey4</div><div class="ubbcode-body">you are from mars, huh? i'm in fox chapel.

is there a long term effect letting a gun sit that long without being cleaned? will the burnt powder attract moisture? </div></div>

It depends on how "long" i'm not sure exactly how long it takes, but i've let guns sit for 5 months between shootings without any visual damage or accuracy damage done. But i'm sure it's possible.Different powders are a factor also, as i'm sure some of their corosive properties differ from one to the next. I try not to let them sit that long without running some lube down the bore, but i'm human.

 

[Doeboy]

Re: Fouling shots and accuracy

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: corey4</div><div class="ubbcode-body">you are from mars, huh? i'm in fox chapel.

is there a long term effect letting a gun sit that long without being cleaned? will the burnt powder attract moisture?</div></div> I was woundering that my self, maybe, they just run a patch or two of gun oil down the tube then it's put away, right guys??

 

[Muttt]

Re: Fouling shots and accuracy

That's why I at least snake them once or twice. To get the crud and carbon out.

 

[corey4]

Re: Fouling shots and accuracy

wouldn't a patch or two of lube on a dirty bore be counter productive? oil attracts dirt. and putting oil on something dirty will just make it gummy. yes, no?

 

[Smsnipes]

Re: Fouling shots and accuracy

Storing a gun for long periods of time and cleaning when accuracy falls off are two different things. Maybe i should have been more clear about my storing procedure. If I store a rifle I usually use a nylon brush and bore swabs/ snakes until I clean out all the powder residue. Not the copper foulings just the powder. Basically run the patches then the brush again and again untill they are no longer black. If you see blue, Stop! Unless you are trying to take the copper out. Then after all that is said and you have run some dry patches down the tube. I usually oil a swab fairly heavy then send it down the tube just once, then away she goes.

 

[corey4]

Re: Fouling shots and accuracy

so, when you are ready to shot again, let says a year later, run a dry patch to wipe all the crap out? or just go shoot?

 

[Smsnipes]

Re: Fouling shots and accuracy

Either way. It doesn't hurt for the mear 5 cents to send a dry swab down. Probably will help it settle back in faster. It usually takes 10 + shots before your groups tighten back up to what is to be expected of your rifle.

 

[corey4]

Re: Fouling shots and accuracy

where do you shoot long range? i belong to springdale, but their range is only 100, and it is pretty crappy.

 

[Smsnipes]

Re: Fouling shots and accuracy

Well I was shooting Reade's range in Tyrone, but since they are closing range use privlages to shooters who dont shoot there competitivly, I have been shooting more frequently at Harry Jones 1000yard range in Fairmont, WV. I also spend some time at the Lawrence County Sportsmans Ass. they have a 600 yard range.

 

[howabouttheiris]

Re: Fouling shots and accuracy

My .223 is slow to recover after a good cleaning....

I shoot a friendly email comp onto a target with four 5 shot POAs. I had a good zero from earlier in the week, and started firing 5 shot groups from clean and cold.

I shot ~1.4MOA, ~1.1MOA, ~0.7MOA for the 1st 3... I suspect it looked "right" after about 8-9 rounds.

 

[perazzisc3]

Re: Fouling shots and accuracy

I am a little confused after reading everyones opinions. I'll try each and see which method works best for me.

 

[Charger442]

Re: Fouling shots and accuracy

i let the high speed projectile clean my barrel for me. and i never worry about how long its been between being shot and if i should wipe it down. but thats just me, maybe....