Rifle Scopes I need help choosing scope and mount

[pappy21]

I am new to this forum and I am looking for some advice.
I just purchased a remington model 700 sps tactical .308w I've always been a carbine person and recently decided to get into long range shooting. Sorry if i don't use the correct terms. The world of long range rifles is new to me

1) I know that I want a mil dot scope with mil/mil reticle and turret and I'm pretty sure I want a 10x fixed power. Can anyone give me some examples of good scopes fitting this description.
I've been reading about the bushnell elite tactical 10x mil but the low price is unnerving. And of course the Super Sniper but again cheap. I don't want to spend thousands but $300 to $500 range
I like what i'm reading about the bushnell elite tactical fixed 10x mil dot. Is it just cheaper than the other elites because it is fixed power? Is it durable?

2) Different mounting options. Height of rings and bases??

I see the picatinny type one piece rails that take weaver rings. I guess "tactical" setup.
Then I see two piece and one piece traditional scope mounting bases and rings.

Basically I have the rifle but am completely out of my set of knowledge on where to go with the scope, base and rings

Any input would be great and please include specific items, brand or links so i can figure out what we're talking about
thank you

 

[Helmet]

Re: I need help choosing scope and mount

Are you sure you want a fixed 10x? I'll look some up for you if you want, but you won't be able to shoot very small groups with them. Do you know what kind of shooting you think you want to get into? Will you be shooting benchrest or do you want to get into more of the tactical competition stuff?

 

[Helmet]

Re: I need help choosing scope and mount

This is really the way to go with rings and bases. Everything else this good cost more. These are top of the line, but not in price. If you have any questions you can talk to Glenn Seekins on the phone. He said I should use a 20MOA base with low rings and they have worked great.
http://www.seekinsprecision.com/

 

[Helmet]

Re: I need help choosing scope and mount

You mentioned that the SS is cheap, but it's in the price range you mentioned.
http://swfa.com/SWFA-SS-10x42-Tactical-Riflescope-P53712.aspx
Here is the updated model with better glass, but it's alot more.
http://swfa.com/SWFA-SS-10x42-Tactical-30mm-Riflescope-P50717.aspx

The very best glass comes from the Schott factory in Germany. It's used by the real high end scopes like Swarovski, Schmidt&Bender, and Zeiss. Getting a tactical with this glass gets you into stupid money real fast, but you can get an IOR Valdada with Schott glass in a fixed 10x for alot less. I have the 16x which is identical and it ran me about $800. The 10x would be close to the same cost, but you have to call Scott@ LibertyOptics to find out what he will really charge you for it. http://www.libertyoptics.com/contents/en-us/p184.html The downside to it is it has 1/4" adjustments instead of mil. If you absolutely need mil/mil then it wont work for you. I had mil/mil on my Vortex Viper PST and gave it up to be able to afford better glass on my budget. Definitely no regrets, but I just shoot from a bench so it's not a big issue for me.

Sightron has a reputation for good glass for the money. I don't know what this would actually cost as you would have to call Scott, but again it has 1/4" adjustments. http://www.libertyoptics.com/contents/en-us/p373.html

 

[pappy21]

Re: I need help choosing scope and mount

Thanks for the replies. I want to shoot from a bipod or bench long range. Maybe get back into hunting. The reason I said fixed is because I read that variable throws off mil measurements when you change magnification. Is that true?

The super sniper I saw was 300. I now see there are a lot more. What about the bushnell elite tactical and nikon monarch in the 350 range?

 

[pappy21]

Re: I need help choosing scope and mount

Ok so i have decided on the SWFA SS mil dot with mil/mil

So my question is will the mil adjustments be accurate on a 16x or 20x scope?
i remember reading that mil is only accurate on 10x

is this true?

 

[darkarcher]

Re: I need help choosing scope and mount

WHAT! NM....Fixed power Mil scopes are true Mils. 10, 16, 20, whatever. FFP stay true at any magnification. SFP only is true at whatever the manufacture sets it at. Usually that power is indexed on the scope.

Personally, I would mot want a fixed scope for hunting. 10 power can be too high, but you could make it work.

 

[pappy21]

Re: I need help choosing scope and mount

I don't think i'll be hunting any time soon. I want a long range target rifle and I want to learn how to use mils properly. It's just a fun project for learning.

 

[darkarcher]

Re: I need help choosing scope and mount

SWFA is a fine choice. Pick the fixed power you want. The mils will be accurate. The only time they are not is on variable second focal plane scopes and they are not on the power the factory set them at to be accurate.

 

[darkarcher]

Re: I need help choosing scope and mount

Second note, scope it how you would, but I would not be afraid to put a variable power scope on there, when you know how to use it, the mils will be accurate. I would use the 1 piece tactical rail in 20 MOA. If I were going steel it would be Seekins for base and rings. On a budget, Aluminum EGW 20 MOA rail with Burris XTR rings. JMO

 

[pappy21]

Re: I need help choosing scope and mount

Alright now were getting somewhere. Thanks for all the informative replies.

 

[pappy21]

Re: I need help choosing scope and mount

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/147376/...rt-action-matte

is this what I want?

 

[darkarcher]

Re: I need help choosing scope and mount

That is it.

Steel is better, but almost triple the price. E-bay has them for 39.99 shipped.

 

[pappy21]

Re: I need help choosing scope and mount

ok and this is the scope I want

http://swfa.com/SWFA-SS-16x42-Tactical-Riflescope-P53715.aspx

this is 16x mil dot with mil/mil adjustments correct?

so the EGW base, this scope, and some burris tactical 30mm rings?

the egw comes with mounting hardware so I just screw it on the rifle and it's g2g?

Do i want low, medium, or high rings?

 

[darkarcher]

Re: I need help choosing scope and mount

That is a mil/mil scope.

Ask SWFA what rings when you order, they are popular and are likely to know which ones work with that scope. I would guess with low rings, should be a very close fit.

The EGW will mount right up.

 

[pappy21]

Re: I need help choosing scope and mount

I called SWFA and they wouldn't tell me over the phone. Said they had to measure everything.

 

[pappy21]

Re: I need help choosing scope and mount

Somebody out there has to have this set up.

Remington 700 sps tactical heavy bull barrel

I'm going to use a 20 moa picatinny base, swfa ss 16x mil/mil. The bell diameter is 49.5mm

so which height ring should I get. I'm looking at the Warne rings

 

[Helmet]

Re: I need help choosing scope and mount

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pappy21</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Somebody out there has to have this set up.

Remington 700 sps tactical heavy bull barrel

I'm going to use a 20 moa picatinny base, swfa ss 16x mil/mil. The bell diameter is 49.5mm

so which height ring should I get. I'm looking at the Warne rings </div></div>Although I can't tell you with absolute certainty in all likelihood you will want low rings. I was using a 20 moa base with low rings to mount a 4-16x50 PST. My barrel is a varmint contour which is heavy. I had plenty of room. Now I have a 16x42 IOR. If anything I have too much clearance between the barrel and scope with the low rings.

 

[Helmet]

Re: I need help choosing scope and mount

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pappy21</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Thanks for the replies. I want to shoot from a bipod or bench long range. Maybe get back into hunting. The reason I said fixed is because I read that variable throws off mil measurements when you change magnification. Is that true?

The super sniper I saw was 300. I now see there are a lot more. What about the bushnell elite tactical and nikon monarch in the 350 range? </div></div>Like Darkarcher mentioned an FFP scope will always be true with the mils. The downside is that it magnifies your crosshairs as you turn up the magnification to make them true. So the higher your magnification the thicker your crosshairs. This bothers some people more than others.

In SFP your crosshairs always remain the same, so as your magnification changes so does the mil value. For example, my 4-16x50 PST was an SFP. The mils were correct on 16x. So on 8x I had to double their value. On 4x I had to quadruple their value. If you were in a tactical competition this would be a real disadvantage as you have to do simple math under pressure which makes it seem hard. At a bench it doesn't matter. The advantage of a SFP is that your crosshairs will be thinner on high power.

The Super Sniper did not go up in price. The one that cost more is a different scope. Both are 10x, but one has much better glass. The 16x and the 20x have the same glass as the $300 10x scope. I have heard that the 20x is a bit too much magnification for that level of glass quality and so I wouldn't go above the 16x. I think that the 16x SS is a good choice for the money, but don't expect it to work well for hunting. A fixed 10x is already a bit too much. A fixed 16x just isn't practical, but at $300 you're not married to it. You could get a lower power or a variable power scope down the road.

I've never had a bushnell elite tactical or nikon monarch. In that price range I would be much more comfortable with the Super Sniper.

FYI: If I remember correctly a mil is about 3.6" at 100 yards. Your adjustments will be in .1 mil. That's about .36" at 100 yards. That will be your finest adjustment.