Rifle Cant

[Shootinsurveyor]

This weekend was my second time shooting 500 yards knowing my dope getting hits right away instead of a spotter walking me in. Shooting a 243 105 Amax. All of my shots both times shooting this distance were about 5 inches to the right. There was some breeze in that direction right where I was shooting from, but the tall grass at the target wasn't moving much. I have a cant indicator that I haven't installed yet. Does this sound like me canting the rifle consistently would yield these kind of results? My shots all fell about MOA +- for that distance. All variables were pretty much the same between the two outings. Same exact platform to shoot from, same lot of reloads.

 

[2Shots]

Re: Rifle Cant

You need put a level on the rail and set a target out at 100 yds and put a 4 foot plumb line on the target and make them match. Then track the scope to 9 mil up and see how the shots track. Bottom line is yes you are probably canted.

 

[7mmRM]

Re: Rifle Cant

Trigger control

more wind than you thought

canted scope

What kind of scope and how did you mount it?

 

[Shootinsurveyor]

Re: Rifle Cant

Scope is a Nitrex 3x15(Weaver Super Slam). HAven't done any box tests or anything like that. Scope was mounted to my rail using the feeler gauge method. probably could be some trigger work needed on my part. I know the scope isn't whats talked about here, but it was a good price and allowed me to get into the game.

 

[Lowlight]

Re: Rifle Cant

Put the rifle in your shoulder and purposely cant it too the right... then put it in your shoulder and cant it to the left.

Based on how your shoulder works, the look and the feel of it, see which direction it seems would be the most natural if you were subconsciously canting the rifle ?

Report back your findings...

Scopes can have an internal cant up to 2 - 3 degrees so without box testing it across 100% of your travel distance it is hard to say it is not the scope. Leveling it via any method without confirming the travel is a straight is missing a very important step in your basic set up.

 

[turbo54]

Re: Rifle Cant

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">...so without box testing it across 100% of your travel distance it is hard to say it is not the scope. Leveling it via any method without confirming the travel is straight is <span style="font-weight: bold">missing a very important step in your basic set up. </span> </div></div>

This.

I had to learn this the hard way. I skipped this with my Schmidt and Bender because, well, it was an SB... A year later I'm still scratching my head wondering why my shit don't work like it's sposed to... come to find out - the scope doesn't track.

Test it!

 

[Shootinsurveyor]

Re: Rifle Cant

I'll give all the mentioned advice a shot and report back. This is the "guidance" I was looking for.

 

[coach482]

Re: Rifle Cant

Wind moves the bullet whether it is only at the target, halfway down range, or just at your starting point.

Right handed shooters tend to cant left and left handed shooters to the right.

+1 to all that said test your scope and level.

Read Lowlights posts on wind, I learned alot.

 

[CanSniper]

Re: Rifle Cant

I know I will catch hell for this...
But... Spin drift prolly counted for SOME of it.
A little breeze + a little SD = a little off.

 

[Shootinsurveyor]

Re: Rifle Cant

Tried mounting the rifle to my shoulder and checking which way would feel more natural and therefore probably more likely to be done subconsciously. Canting to the left was the most natural feeling. Don't think I could cant much to the right without it feeling way off. I'm beginning to think it it just the wind in that location. There is usually a stiff breeze at the shooting sight over a deep hollow and the target is fairly protected by a treeline. I just figured if the wind was causing my problems my hits would have been all over the place and not grouped decently.

 

[fargo007]

Re: Rifle Cant

Canting it will produce drop as well as left or right.

It does not sound like a canting issue to me. Other possibles have been covered.

--Fargo007

 

[Shootinsurveyor]

Re: Rifle Cant

New reply to old post. Got out shooting at the same spot as previously stated. First shot cold bore dead center in the throat area of the target holding center mass. Then the shots started to group right like I posted above. I was grouping 2-3 inches but right of my poa. Had a friend shoot and he dropped his 3 into 2.5 inches, but left opposite where my shots were going. Almost duplicate spot just on the left side of the target. He does shoot left handed so I'm not sure if that indicates a cant issue or what. My shots did seem to pull right if I didn't have the bags set perfectly. Overall I was really impressed that my rifle and hand loads were grouping avg 3 inches at that distance especially with me shooting. I still need to box test the scope though and install my cant indicator. Still a lot to work on, but still having a great time.

 

[Topstrap]

Re: Rifle Cant

Like others have said until you do the tracking test and install the cant indicator you'll not have anything figured out.

Someone mentioned spin drift... at 500 yards???? really doubt that.

The difference in you and your buddy shooting on different sides of the target is probably the way each of you are seeing what looks to be level thru the scope and also a bit of how you are behind the gun. Amazing just how small a cant will cause a change hits. Really is critical on smaller targets.

After you get it tracking perfectly up that line for 9mil or so and get the level then you will see just how small a wind you can't detect between you and the target will move that bullet.

Lots to learn when starting to stretch it out a bit and even more frustrating as you shoot even further.

Good luck, looking forward to your report back after doing the 2 above mentioned things.

Topstrap

 

[Sterling Shooter]

Re: Rifle Cant

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Shootinsurveyor</div><div class="ubbcode-body">New reply to old post. Got out shooting at the same spot as previously stated. First shot cold bore dead center in the throat area of the target holding center mass. Then the shots started to group right like I posted above. I was grouping 2-3 inches but right of my poa. Had a friend shoot and he dropped his 3 into 2.5 inches, but left opposite where my shots were going. Almost duplicate spot just on the left side of the target. He does shoot left handed so I'm not sure if that indicates a cant issue or what. My shots did seem to pull right if I didn't have the bags set perfectly. Overall I was really impressed that my rifle and hand loads were grouping avg 3 inches at that distance especially with me shooting. I still need to box test the scope though and install my cant indicator. Still a lot to work on, but still having a great time. </div></div>

From this post alone, it appears you have minuscule shooter error or a reticle which is not level at a minuscule level. You might want to just adjust the sight. Then take it back to the short line and compare vertical dispersion between short line and 500 yards in MOA. This exercise may help you distinguish shooter error from an equipment problem but since this is not alignment error and your error is very small it can be hard to conclude its source. Everything you said suggests the scope until you bring up the left eye dominant shooter shooting from the left shoulder having the opposite result which suggest shooter error. One way to eleminate you canting the rifle is to get an adjustable butt plate.