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Range Report Ballistics and zero from sub-sonic to supersonic

waste_knot

Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Mar 7, 2012
301
0
Tidewater Va.
How do you get ballistics tables or software to show two tables for two different loads one being 1100 FPS and the other 3000 FPS. I'm looking for how much adjustment needs to be dialed into the scope to zero the slow ammo at 100yrds from the fast ammo at a 200yrd zero. The problem is most of the tables and software show a relative tajectory curve with the scope zeroed at some distance. I'm looking for absolute drop curves as if the firearm was held level and the bullet drops from there. Can I just set the zero point in JBM a 20yrds or something close and compare the two tables. I tryed using 1 yard zero and you get some funky numbers.
 
Re: Ballistics and zero from sub-sonic to supersonic

To keep it simple, that drop you are looking for would be the maximum ordinate of the round along the trajectory curve (it's highest position along the curve).

Same information, different way of saying it. If it goes that high for POI/POA, then it goes to say that it drops that far when fired horizontally.

Also, your drop can be determined by figuring out how long it takes your round to go from point a to point b, then figure in the drop it takes over time, that drop will occur the same as it always does on Earth: 9.8m/s^2.

This will work okay to do it this way for shorter distances and where not much velocity is lost. The more velocity lost, the more difficult to impossible it becomes to get a valid answer without resorting to differential equations and a bunch of calculus. Though it could put you in the ballpark, and a few rounds afterwards tweaks the findings.

There is more to the math, but I'm not getting into it. If you don't know it, I can't teach you on here, and if you do then I have nothing to add. Just know that even those of us that do know the math seldom use it. For instance, I recently zeroed a .300BLK using a Leupold M/RT. I basically just zeroed it at 100m and at 200m using the supersonic loads, then I fired subs without making any changes. Measurements were taken between groups. The following shots were done with the adjustments dialed into the scope.

Is this what you are trying to get at? As far as a program goes, I don't use any, but when I do I generally just use an old multivariable physics application from .edu.
 
Re: Ballistics and zero from sub-sonic to supersonic

Get away from programs and go to the range and get bullet hole data.
 
Re: Ballistics and zero from sub-sonic to supersonic

Trying to see where to set the scope if I swith from 168smk (zero @ 200) to a 110 HP in the field without having to shoot the zero at 100yd and then set the dial.
I found a setting in JBM "Elevation correction for zero range" that seem to compute the trajectory direcly out of the barrel. It says: my scope which is set at zero at 200yds is actually looking 1.6 mils down from the bore if held level. The same drop for the 110 at 100 is 0.6 so I need to subtract 1 mil from dial before I apply the DOPE.
 
Re: Ballistics and zero from sub-sonic to supersonic

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gunfighter14e2</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Get away from programs and go to the range and get bullet hole data.

</div></div>
I'm hunting coyote in a populated area and I'd like to use the 110gr out to about 350 and the 168smk beyond. This may not occur in the same corn field but one day to the next. But you are correct I need to verify this at the range which I will do.
 
Re: Ballistics and zero from sub-sonic to supersonic

I have the data on every bullet I load or shoot on the weapon and a cheat card.
The correction for them all is from my base LR load w/o the can. My can do to weight, requires 3.5 IPHY of up for the droop (heavy F/A rated can). The different load dots, are all in different color along the yardage plot line, with any wind-age notes, if any.
 
Re: Ballistics and zero from sub-sonic to supersonic

Just to give you an idea. My Gap .308 is zeroed at 100 yds. with 175 SMKs running at 2650 fps (with can). When I shoot my 170 gn. subsonic load running at 1050 fps, I have to dial in 12 MOA to zero at 100 yds.
 
Re: Ballistics and zero from sub-sonic to supersonic

Can't you just set the zero of both in your software to 200 yards and get the difference at 100 yards? Seems too easy though.
 
Re: Ballistics and zero from sub-sonic to supersonic

Hey, thanks Hogs for the real world data.
I found the setting in JBM "Elevation Correction for Zero Range" by unchecking this it displays absolute drop out of the barrel. The true drop in the 175smk at 100 is 6.1moa at 40deg using 2" sight height and 17.8moa using 170 pro hunter at 1050fps. So the difference is 11.7moa which is real close to 12moa.
 
Re: Ballistics and zero from sub-sonic to supersonic

JBM at least gets you in the ballpark to check and make notes from your testing.
 
Re: Ballistics and zero from sub-sonic to supersonic

Ok I think I'm understanding how to explain what I'm looking for.
In this discussion I'm starting off with a weapon that shoots level and has no drop.
The bore of weapon is leveled along with the scope and shot across a 200 yrd flat field at the target. The POI is exactaly the elevation of the bore. The POA is 2" higher because the scope is 2" higher than the bore. The scope must be canted down 1.0moa. The POI and the POA only match at 200yrds.The scope will still have to be adjusted for different ranges even on a weapon that has flat trajectory. Now for the real world. Same level weapon but a 168smk @2550mv. At 200 yrds the drop is 5.7moa so the scope is canted farther down plus another 1.0moa to account for the 2" sight height so now the POA and POI match. The knobs are set to zero. This is what we are all calling zero but it is a relative setting. So if you know where your absoluted zero is (level scope)you can switch loads and not have to reshoot the 200 yrd zero. Just dial on the absolute difference at 200 and start your range ballistics from there. This way the current dope card for each load can still be used after the offset is applied.
 
Re: Ballistics and zero from sub-sonic to supersonic

There's a place in JBM to enter zero height and offset so the easy way to do it would be to set your scope for your 200 yards supersonic zero and shoot your subsonic round at 100 yards. Measure the distance from poa to poi and enter that into the zero height box. Put in the other data for you sub load and your done.
 
Re: Ballistics and zero from sub-sonic to supersonic

That sounds like it will work. If so, that will also work in Shooter b/c each ammo profile allows you to store a zero offset in the profile and dial from the current turret zero. Just Dial and smile. It's like running a Vegamatic. Just set it and forget it.