my first full bolt gun build, where to start?

[jjrgr21]

so i'm wondering where to start. either savage or remington, cause i'd like to end up getting the JP chassis.

i like the fact that i can rebarrel the savage, but is it that costly to rebarrel a remmy?

the remmy sps is pretty cheap, as is the model 10, or model 11.

the 11 had a DBM, but not sure how that effects stock choices, cause i thought of getting a b&c medalist or similar till i can afford the JP.

i searched about 30 pages and found nothing, though i'm sure this has been covered.

how are the shilen or mcgowen barrels?

i want to go 243win in a 1/8 22"

i'm mainly confused on the stock availability for the model 11, as going that route would give me longer to save up for the chassis.

any help is appreciated.
thanks,
J

 

[SuburbanHick]

well.... i cant say what the best barrel out there is... but heres my plan

started life out as a remy700 SPS varmint in 308
got a bartlein barrel (heavy varmint countour) 1-11.25
apa lil jimmy
sent all that to mark at Accurate Ordinace to do their thing

Ill have XLR tactical evo waiting for it gets home

what is waiting is a NXS 8.5-32x56 with the MOAR..still need rings tho

 

[josephberry]

you're on the right path.

 

[SuburbanHick]

you're on the right path.

who is on the right path...?

 

[turbo54]

If you are intending on rebarreling and installing in a chassis, I suggest you start with the cheapest base rifle you can...Don't spend anything extra on an upgraded stock or DBM or anything, because you're essentially just buying an action.

To answer your question about the cost of rebarreling a Remington - no, it's not *that* costly. About 350 for a barrel, and about 300 for fitting, chambering and muzzle treatments (crowning and threading). The bummer with anything that isn't a DIY rebarrel is waiting for someone you trust to do the work.

...if they'd put you on the roster and call you up a week before they actually worked on it, it wouldn't be a big deal, but most shops require your rifle to sit in a dank, dark corner for the duration of your wait...

It's nice to get home from work to find a barrel on your doorstep, and spend 30 minutes installing it.

 

[jjrgr21]

thats what i like most about the savage

the model 11 is around 400, no accutrigger. would it be worth it to get the model 10 w/accutrigger for the extra $60? or just get the base gun all around and get a timney

 

[Scimitar]

I'd go with the Remington if you are building a custom. If the shit hits the fan in your personal life(monetarily speaking) and you need some money, it will be easier to sell.
Stock rifles, hell I love Savage rifles. Shoot two of them. But I'm not putting money into modding them. Just my opinion.

 

[Heronion]

If you're handy, go with Savage. It's cheaper and fun to do all the work yourself. If you're going to have a smith work on it, go Remington (many gunsmiths don't even bother with Savage rifles). Remington has more aftermarket options by far. I went Savage for the ability to change anything my self later on. I've put a McGowen .308 1-10 on my Savage, it shout around 1/2 - 3/4 MOA with American Eagle 168gr 7.62x51 ($16/box). I was very please with it. And now I have a .300 BLK barrel from Triton I'm waiting to shoot for the first time.

 

[JB02]

Turbo is spot on with his advice. From my read of your post, it sounds like you want a Savage Model 12 LRP in 243 Win. You can get one for just under $900. This is a great starter rifle. If you want to see what you can do with a Remington 700, look at LoneWolf USMC's "Budget Precision Rifle" series.

 

[jjrgr21]

that would be a good rifle for me, but i don't want a 26" barrel, i want a brake, and don't like the HS company.

i want to do a real build

i was thinking a model 11, and mcgowen barrel, a B&C stock, and eventually a chassis.

thoughts?

 

[vpexp]

If i was installing a new barrel, the barrel itself would be the last place i would try to save a few $. I have nothing against McGowen but for my money I would go with a Bartlein, Brux or Kreiger. At a minimum it will add value if you ever decide to sell.

 

[turbo54]

Speaking of resale, it should be noted that Savage resale is shit.

It sounds to me like the op would be better off piecing a custom rifle together rather than buying a complete factory rifle and working it up.

If a Remmy is desired, Brownells carries the action. If that is the plan, consider the costs of tuning it up, including new bolt, or bolt knob and extract or, truing, upgrading scope base holes, etc etc. You can easily spend $1000. A custom action might be a better solution.

 

[jjrgr21]

how does the barrel life differ between say a mcgowen or shilen vs a bartlein or kreiger

 

[Maxyim]

I just made a thread on this subject (focusing on Savage) that is pending approval, feel free to look it up and contribute to the discussion once it goes live!

 

[turbo54]

how does the barrel life differ between say a mcgowen or shilen vs a bartlein or kreiger

No difference

 

[RTO]

Something to consider, if you buy a Remington you are going to need to true the action, have a m16 or sako extractor installed, probably add a bolt knob so your costs are going to be almost the price of buying a custom action. I typically show this to customers so they can see what all the costs are involved so they can make a decision for the direction they want to go before they start a build. Savage you can build much cheaper and do yourself and does not require any smith fees if you have a barrel vise, action wrench and go guages. I personally would never own a Remington, even though I build my own rifles and can spin my own barrels it doesnt make sense why I would ever own a Remy over a custom. If I was to buy a factory action to build on it would be FN. I own and have owned several and they are great actions to build on, all that is really needed is a bolt knob. I am not trying to push you one way or another, just trying to make sure you realize what you are getting into. Find a smith you want to build for you and talk to him about prices of all the options. These costs that I am talking about trueing the action, extractor, and bolt knob are just a one time expense that you will not have to do again but when you add them all up you arent going to be far from paying for a custom action.

 

[jjrgr21]

i didn't realize that a remington would be that costly, but i have already started to lean towards the savage.

if there is no difference in barrel life, and if the mcgowen barrel can achive .5moa why spend the extra $200 on a kreiger? i'm not wanting a benchrest gun, just a good groundhog/prairie dog gun.

will the kreiger barrel hold better groups after it heats up over the others. i have a douglas on an AR that is no doubt better than the shilens, side by side, when they get hot.

 

[mwroseberry]

i didn't realize that a remington would be that costly, but i have already started to lean towards the savage.

if there is no difference in barrel life, and if the mcgowen barrel can achive .5moa why spend the extra $200 on a kreiger? i'm not wanting a benchrest gun, just a good groundhog/prairie dog gun.

will the kreiger barrel hold better groups after it heats up over the others. i have a douglas on an AR that is no doubt better than the shilens, side by side, when they get hot.

I have shot against many custom barrels from high end manufactures. I have come to a realization. Any barrel can shoot if you handload for it properly. Once you get tighter than 1/2MOA in my opinion its a mute point as you as a shooter can not shoot better than that EVERY time you pull the trigger. The weakest point of any decent weapon system is the operator. With that said the higher end barrels do one thing better than the mid level barrels and that is shoot box ammo. I have helped a guy install a shillen select match and that thing shoots any ammo well. My Mcgowen shoots just as tight of a group with handloads as the best group out of the shillen but it has to have hand loads to do it. You can't grap any box ammo off the shelf and shoot 1/2moa groups with it where is with the shillen you pretty much can. So in my opinion if you're going to hand load there is no difference.

Good luck,
Merritt

 

[jjrgr21]

the best i can consistently achieve is .5 moa out of any of my rifles. anything better than that is a fluke. my 308 has a JP on it, and it's a solid .5 moa rifle for me, probably better with a better shooter.

mcgowen says $350 for exactly what i want, shipped to the house.

i couldn't afford to shoot if i didn't handload. but components are getting scarce.

 

[jjrgr21]

ok, so say i get a model 11 that has a DBM, what are the issues involved to use a blind magazine stock, until i can get a chassis?

 

[diderr]

i'd go with a Remington SPS. Dont be afraid to buy a used gun either if all youre going to leave stock is the action. For the trigger just have your gunsmith rework it. If he's competent a remington trigger is a breeze to make break clean. Unless you want an adjustable trigger. And as for Shilen barrels. I have one on my 300wsm, and it shoots fantastic. you can often find the blanks instock on Midway for around $175.

 

[scatterbrains]

I was kinda in the same boat, i have a stevens 200 in 243win $325, i have a XLR carbon on the way $1100, a vortex 4-16x50 pst $600 on the way to local shop. Rings $130 will be decided when the rifle goes into the chassis. Trigger will be a rifle basics sav-1 $85.

As far as barrels go i was torn between a shilen or a criterion from Northland shooting supply, after talking to lots of people ill be going with the CBI barrel just due to wait times.$320.

I went savage because i love to tinker and try new things(calibers) If you do a savage factor in the cost of tools action wrench barrel wrench=$85 pus $60 for headspace gages in whatever caliber you want to do.
NSS also has some real nice recoil lugs and new machined barrel nuts another $56 for both. Only thing not factored in is the Bolt knob as im not sure what i will do but its at least another $100

My total is sitting about $2700 spread out over about 6 months not including the bolt knob. Ill have a shooter minus the barrel by the end of april. best part is i will have done it all myself.

Now with all of that said IF i were to really start doing some serious LR comps/matches i would start from a stiller tac30 action $950, all other items would be the same as the savage.

 

[308plinker]

I just completed a custom build. As far as I'm concerned, if you don't have the funds to get exactly what you want, save up. It's better to spend the extra on the best components you can find rather than build something inferior only to regret not having done it the way you should have in the first place. That said, I agree with the Remington action starting point. Re-sale value will be there later. I started my journey many months ago and found a nice Remmy 40X repeater action on a sister forum classified for a premium price....$625. The kicker there is that the action will always bring top dollar because of it's reputation. From there it's barrel choosing time. I found that unless you talk to a smith who has a deep selection of barrels in stock, you will wait a minimum of 120 days on a barrel from Kreiger, Shilen, Bartlein, etc.....I was able to find a Bartlein 5R 1-11.25" from "Grizzly" for $345 shipped to my door. So those two parts alone blows a $1,000 dollar bill all to hell. From there it's on to stock/chassis choice. Depending on whether or not you will ever try to compete should help in your decision here. I personally wanted a tactical rig that I could also shoot "F" with, so I went with the AICS 2.0 chassis. The beauty there is no bedding is required. The AICS is made to "bolt and go". This will save some dough with your smith because you're omitting a step in the process. The AICS will set you back a chunk though. Starting at around $875 for the 1.0, and up to $1275 for the 2.0, depending on where you shop. I bought mine from Eurooptic.....no tax and free shipping. So there's 2K spent already, and we've not covered Glass, Glass mounting, bolt, and extras like ceramic paint, fluting, muzzle brake, etc......I was told by a long time match shooter many years ago, "you should spend as much or more on your glass as you do on your entire rig". Now I don't know if that really holds true anymore. Competition among Scope manufacturers have really made some great optics more affordable. Of course once you set your mind to getting a top of the line optic, then Nightforce, Shmidt and Bender, March, and Swarovski come to mind. But there are a few companies out there making awesome glass at a much lower price point, like Vortex's PST line, or Sightron's S series. We could talk glass all day, end the end get what you want here, because if you're like me, cutting corners on glass to save money will only lead to regret later. I went with the Nightforce NXS 12-42X56 and couldn't be happier. Of course at $1,700, it will make your wallet sulk and get mad at you for several days afterward. When it comes to rings I went with Seekins, and have been very happy with the style and performance of Glen's rings from day one. But go ahead and figure another $150 there. A good base will set you back $100, but it makes no sense to cut corners on glass mounting. It's like buying a BMW and putting some cheap 200 dollar set of off brand tires on it. I hope this has helped, because I'm getting "typer's cramp writing this post". At the end of the day, get what you want and be happy with your decision. That will ensure you aren't constantly trying to upgrade or swap parts later. Here's a pic of the rig I just finished. It was expensive, but I have no regrets. Good luck with whatever direction you decide........