Range Report Know-It-Alls (We all know at least one right?)

[melloyello]

Had a friend stop by last nite and saw my ladder targets I had sitting around and he said "Man, somebody needs to work on their form." I told him it was at 400yds and each ladder had 11 shots and none of those were the same charge. He said "Man, you ought to be putting em in a quarter at only 400yds."
I know I am not the best shot in the world and I do throw one here and there. I am hoping to work that out eventually. I just don't think he could grasp the concept of ascending powder charges at distance. I showed him one of my 5 shot grouping OCW targets and he thought the way the POI shifted every 2 or 3 charges was my shooting. All this coming from someone who claims they have a perfect recipe for their rifle and they have shot out to 1000yd. I was also told my bullets were too heavy b/c he uses 168gr and I am using 175gr. Now, I went to the range one day with him to shoot pistols and he broke out his SPS Tactical w/ his recipe and couldn't hit a 20oz Mt.Dew bottle everytime at 98yds. Anyone have one of those kind of friends?

 

[memilanuk]

Anyone have one of those kind of friends?

Not for long, or not unless they have some other endearing characteristics to make suffering them worthwhile...

 

[seanh]

No friends that are like that but when I managed a gun shop/indoor range, yea, there were many that came in. Several were cops, I'm sure you know the type...they're cops so they "know".

 

[seanhagerty]

I'm to impatient to suffer fools very long.

 

[korykhunter]

Run into one every so often. I had a co-worker that told me a .223 and a 22-250 shoot different lead. He said the lead in a 223 was bigger diameter(.223=.223 and 22-250=.22250). I had a reloading manual with me and showed him that both shoot .224 and he wouldn't believe me. I gave up after that.

 

[melloyello]

No friends that are like that but when I managed a gun shop/indoor range, yea, there were many that came in. Several were cops, I'm sure you know the type...they're cops so they "know".

Funny you say that. He is a deputy. Not saying they are all like that but just happens to be true this time.
I think what I will do is take him to our range one day in the near future and let him show me some 600-1000yd shots and see what he can do.

 

[gstaylorg]

Funny you say that. He is a deputy. Not saying they are all like that but just happens to be true this time.
I think what I will do is take him to our range one day in the near future and let him show me some 600-1000yd shots and see what he can do.

Wouldn't surprise me if you get excuse after excuse why he can't make it (LOL). If he shows, definitely share the results with us!

 

[melloyello]

Wouldn't surprise me if you get excuse after excuse why he can't make it (LOL). If he shows, definitely share the results with us!

I will be more than happy to.

 

[Deleted member 10043]

Principles before personalities at the range always wins the day. Is this a range report of some kind...

BTW, I had a U.S. Marshall diss my Makarov for some reason. I guess he doesn't like Iron Curtain weaponry. He said something negative about it needed to be cleaned all the time in comparison to a Glock. I took my weapon and put two mags rapid fire into the head of his federal target. Then I said I hadn't cleaned it lately. He took his target and went home. You gotta be tough to live out West. There is always somebody that has to say something negative when most people are just trying to get along. It seems to happen more at the range than at the grocery store.

 

[CUSTOM1911FAN]

Hahaha, was he a Yankee? No offense to Yankees, but my experience in federal law enforcement was that mfr's that grew up in the Northeast and had NEVER handled a gun before the Academy, came out thinking that they were God's gift to Law Enforcement and that they were EXPERT gun handlers. I routinely told them: "shut the fuck up, most of these ranchers and the people we arrest know more about guns, AND are better shots, than you!" They all believed that only cops should have guns, as well. Again, I told them: "shut the fuck up, you will be thankful when you are getting your ass kicked off of highway 57 and some poor ranch-hand shows up with a gun to help your dumb ass out!" My retorts ended in hurt feelings and a quiet ride. I am glad I am out of the business, I would probably have faced "hostile workplace" complaints from my trainees. As with most places on the left and right coasts, these guys couldn't afford to live where they grew up, so they headed out West to seek their freedom and fortunes, but they brought their gun banning socialist ideas with them. Hopefully, they have seen the light.

Principles before personalities at the range always wins the day. Is this a range report of some kind...

BTW, I had a U.S. Marshall diss my Makarov for some reason. I guess he doesn't like Iron Curtain weaponry. He said something negative about it needed to be cleaned all the time in comparison to a Glock. I took my weapon and put two mags rapid fire into the head of his federal target. Then I said I hadn't cleaned it lately. He took his target and went home. You gotta be tough to live out West. There is always somebody that has to say something negative when most people are just trying to get along. It seems to happen more at the range than at the grocery store.

 

[Jaxdialation]

Your choice of friends reflects on you. If he is really a friend, grow a pair and set his ass straight. If you can't tell him to stfu YOU are the problem.

Had a friend stop by last nite and saw my ladder targets I had sitting around and he said "Man, somebody needs to work on their form." I told him it was at 400yds and each ladder had 11 shots and none of those were the same charge. He said "Man, you ought to be putting em in a quarter at only 400yds."
I know I am not the best shot in the world and I do throw one here and there. I am hoping to work that out eventually. I just don't think he could grasp the concept of ascending powder charges at distance. I showed him one of my 5 shot grouping OCW targets and he thought the way the POI shifted every 2 or 3 charges was my shooting. All this coming from someone who claims they have a perfect recipe for their rifle and they have shot out to 1000yd. I was also told my bullets were too heavy b/c he uses 168gr and I am using 175gr. Now, I went to the range one day with him to shoot pistols and he broke out his SPS Tactical w/ his recipe and couldn't hit a 20oz Mt.Dew bottle everytime at 98yds. Anyone have one of those kind of friends?

 

[melloyello]

Your choice of friends reflects on you. If he is really a friend, grow a pair and set his ass straight. If you can't tell him to stfu YOU are the problem.

I will shut him up my own way. I tried to explain it to him first. Guess he has to see it to believe it.

 

[mkollman74]

I am the only fool I like being around...

 

[Win_94]

I just don't think he could grasp the concept of ascending powder charges at distance.

I don't know any "know-it-alls"... but it took me a long time to get family and friends to understand what I'm looking for in my ladder test targets.

 

[Jethro3898]

The thing I've noticed about a VERY large number of people is that they don't even remotely understand lengths and distances at all.
People talk about shooting at "600 yards or so". You take that person to a 600 yard range and they are shocked at how far it really is. Don't even get me started about 1,000 yards....most people end up saying, "Man, this has to be nearly a mile, right?".....ummmmmm.....no.
I'm talking people who are't necessarily ignorant about shooting either.

I just had one this week where a guy told me he regularly puts 5 rounds in a "coffee can" with his Remington R5 (obviously he meant 5R) at 1,160 yards.
I'm not saying it can't be done, but it sure is unlikely. Truth be known, he is probably only shooting 500 or 600 yards. I just thought it was strange that he had some off the wall distance like 1,160 yards.

When people talk about distance I usually take it with a HUGE grain of salt. Most people just have no concept of distance past 100 yards, thus making them a regular Annie Oakley in their own eyes.

OP: your friend is probably just another casualty of the "crappy distance club". I wouldn't worry about it.

 

[melloyello]

The thing I've noticed about a VERY large number of people is that they don't even remotely understand lengths and distances at all.
People talk about shooting at "600 yards or so". You take that person to a 600 yard range and they are shocked at how far it really is. Don't even get me started about 1,000 yards....most people end up saying, "Man, this has to be nearly a mile, right?".....ummmmmm.....no.
I'm talking people who are't necessarily ignorant about shooting either.

I just had one this week where a guy told me he regularly puts 5 rounds in a "coffee can" with his Remington R5 (obviously he meant 5R) at 1,160 yards.
I'm not saying it can't be done, but it sure is unlikely. Truth be known, he is probably only shooting 500 or 600 yards. I just thought it was strange that he had some off the wall distance like 1,160 yards.

When people talk about distance I usually take it with a HUGE grain of salt. Most people just have no concept of distance past 100 yards, thus making them a regular Annie Oakley in their own eyes.

OP: your friend is probably just another casualty of the "crappy distance club". I wouldn't worry about it.

I have noticed the distance issue with many people. Even at 3D shoots where distances only go out to 50-55yds so many people misjudge the distance. If you can't judge from 0-50yds then there is no way you will be able to tell me what 1000yds looks like. I have been hunting with plenty of people and they call out distances to things and I just laugh. Once something is past about 600yds it may as well be at least a mile.

 

[ldunnmobile]

The thing I've noticed about a VERY large number of people is that they don't even remotely understand lengths and distances at all.
People talk about shooting at "600 yards or so". You take that person to a 600 yard range and they are shocked at how far it really is. Don't even get me started about 1,000 yards....most people end up saying, "Man, this has to be nearly a mile, right?".....ummmmmm.....no.
I'm talking people who are't necessarily ignorant about shooting either.

I just had one this week where a guy told me he regularly puts 5 rounds in a "coffee can" with his Remington R5 (obviously he meant 5R) at 1,160 yards.
I'm not saying it can't be done, but it sure is unlikely. Truth be known, he is probably only shooting 500 or 600 yards. I just thought it was strange that he had some off the wall distance like 1,160 yards.

When people talk about distance I usually take it with a HUGE grain of salt. Most people just have no concept of distance past 100 yards, thus making them a regular Annie Oakley in their own eyes.

OP: your friend is probably just another casualty of the "crappy distance club". I wouldn't worry about it.

THIS!!! People don't know jack about how far (or short rather) they're actually shooting. "Yeah I shot that elk at 1000 yards. Just aimed up above his back and let her rip."

 

[Deleted member 10043]

Well for one thing there are too many trees in Arkansas to shoot an Elk at 1000 yards.

 

[memilanuk]

A classic example of the distance problem (the guy wasn't a 'know-it-all'... I asked *him*)... I was at a new gun range and rather than shoot at the upper rifle-only range where they were shooting BR, I was down at the general purpose range - ya know, pistol, rifle, whatever. I knew it was 100yds max, but I wasn't positive of the distances of the intermediate berms - I *thought* they were probably 25, 50, 75 & 100, but not sure. So I asked the fellow at the bench next to mine how far - and had to laugh. He told me he was pretty sure they were 50, 100, 200 & 300yds! I looked down at his bench and realized I'd just asked a hand-gunner - probably not the best candidate for a 'range' question beyond 25 yds! Oops.

 

[Early Cuyler]

Met a guy through work and he's a really nice guy and knows a helluva lot, just not about guns. Well he got invited to go out west for a military weapon demonstration. He said there was a house size target at the base of a mountain about 3-4 miles away from a set of bleachers. Once the stands were full of higher-ups and everything was clear, he said two F-16s flew overhead firing their 20mm cannons at the targets and a missile. Epic explosion. However the line that caught me is when he said, "And those bullets only drop 1/16" over those 3-4 miles!"

I quickly called bullshit and informed him that my 308win drops over 30 FEET at 1000yds with a 100yd zero. His mind was blown.

 

[19Scout77]

If you do not know a "know-it-all" as described, then, in all likelihood, you probably face such a person...every time you look in the mirror!!

 

[peaceatwar]

I think we all know a few of these people. I'm comfortablem making this kind of person uncomfortable. I will be the first one to say: "Show me bro, I can't wait to learn from you how to shoot quarter at 600 yards. Lets go to range this weekend." or "Really? I can't believe that shooting style works so well I've never tried it, you can really hold 1" @ 25 yards with your factory glock? 10 shots? Lets go to the range right now so I can learn from you." I have never once had one of these people actually volunteer to show me their wizardy. If I do and they are no bullshit. I will report to the hide.

 

[Shooter McGavin]

Hahaha, was he a Yankee? No offense to Yankees, but my experience in federal law enforcement was that mfr's that grew up in the Northeast and had NEVER handled a gun before the Academy, came out thinking that they were God's gift to Law Enforcement and that they were EXPERT gun handlers. I routinely told them: "shut the fuck up, most of these ranchers and the people we arrest know more about guns, AND are better shots, than you!" They all believed that only cops should have guns, as well. Again, I told them: "shut the fuck up, you will be thankful when you are getting your ass kicked off of highway 57 and some poor ranch-hand shows up with a gun to help your dumb ass out!" My retorts ended in hurt feelings and a quiet ride. I am glad I am out of the business, I would probably have faced "hostile workplace" complaints from my trainees. As with most places on the left and right coasts, these guys couldn't afford to live where they grew up, so they headed out West to seek their freedom and fortunes, but they brought their gun banning socialist ideas with them. Hopefully, they have seen the light.

First off I am a Yankee. I wasn't born in Texas, but I got here as fast as I could. Onto the part of were these guys come to Texas with their gun banning socialist ideas with them, "F" them. I would be willing to give up my right to vote in the state of Texas if they would only allow Texans to vote. Keep Texas conservative!

 

[tylerw02]

A guy that serves on an NRA committee with me is all the time telling everybody how dumb it is that I've spent "so much money" on my rifle and glass. He has a couple Savage bolt guns and a couple Marlin rimfires---all equipped with Simmons optics. He claims every group he shoots out to two hundred yards is one hole, with both his .223 Rem and .17HMR. He said if he had "that expensive stuff" he'd be so accurate it would be "scary." I've continuously invited him to the range and to matches. He declines every time because he just doesn't have time. I tell him I need a chance to learn from him so that maybe I'll be as good as him someday. The guy is retired and the only obligation he has is serving on this NRA committee. I wonder why he won't come?

 

[Genin]

OP, I know exactly what you are saying. I have a friend, that is genuinely my friend, but he is a damn know-it-all when it comes to firearms. I have tried to have discussions with him but his gear, gun choices, antiquated techniques, modificiations, etc. are always the best. He buys the most expensive items possible but never comes to the range to use them. He quickly fell behind the curve of our regular shooting group and knew it. He stopped coming to the range with us basically. In fact, the only time he's come in months and months was when we took a large (10+) group of new shooters to the range to teach them firearm safety. I strongly feel he only went because he felt like he knew more than them and wanted to act like a big shot. It's sad because he really is a good person, just an ego maniac clown when it comes to firearms. Basically we're good friends but found we weren't the best range buddies lol.

 

[Niles Coyote]

Basically we're good friends but found we weren't the best range buddies lol.

LOL, I like that line.

 

[lash]

Well, you probably shouldn't be called a "know it all" if you really DO know it all, right?

I personally know so little about long range shooting, that I prefer to not claim any knowledge at all. Sure I've been shooting for many years and I'm a fair shot in general, but LR is a different discipline altogether IMO. Just about any average joe can put good groups together out at 100 and perhaps 200 yds, but anything much past that and you better have a lot of practice in place or the BS will shine through.

 

[Heman]

There is a guy who shows up on Sunday's around 2PM at our local range and just starts talking crap. I have heard the following from him before.

1. He has a Druganov that he can shoot dimes with at 1000yds. I have routinely asked him to please bring it and we can have a match.
2. He tried to explain to me how a .30-06 shooting an identical bullet as a .308 at the same velocity will have more power.
3. That the AR-15 doesn't work past 200yds. To this I always said well sir I shoot my in across the course and we go to 600, and first year I shot at Camp Perry at LR Nats I was squaded with an AMU shooter using his for Palma.

However the best was the last good day we had this past fall I showed up to shoot some smallbore to practice and he was already there. Instead of leaving I stayed and he lectures me about how .22LR isn't accurate passed 50yds. Well I was shooting 100yd practice with irons and he had targets set up at 100yds shooting off the bench with a scoped AR. Well I was finally able to challenge him. Needless to say nobody has seen him for awhile.

 

[P7id10t]

A guy that serves on an NRA committee with me is all the time telling everybody how dumb it is that I've spent "so much money" on my rifle and glass. He has a couple Savage bolt guns and a couple Marlin rimfires---all equipped with Simmons optics. He claims every group he shoots out to two hundred yards is one hole, with both his .223 Rem and .17HMR. He said if he had "that expensive stuff" he'd be so accurate it would be "scary." I've continuously invited him to the range and to matches. He declines every time because he just doesn't have time. I tell him I need a chance to learn from him so that maybe I'll be as good as him someday. The guy is retired and the only obligation he has is serving on this NRA committee. I wonder why he won't come?

Because intuitively he understands you will destroy his delusions of grandeur at a ripe old age. No one wants to be Willy Lohman.

There's a gentleman at a place I shoot, I bump into at the pistol range occasionally. The first time I thought I was going to chew my arm off he was talking so much. But I did learn a few things from him. Finally I said, "I came here to shoot more than talk. If you'll excuse me please I'll get back to business."
I have been that knowitall fool before too. Now all I do know is I'm a dumbf#ck from the swamps of Michigan.

 

[Aimsmall55]

I had a guy that kept on telling me how awesome his .300 win mag was and that if he could see it 9 times out of ten he would hit it. Any how the guy asked me if I could make him a few reloads so I obliged him. He showed up with his rifle..... His .300 win mag he said, it was a RUM. I said" Jason ... This is not a .300 win mag it's a .300 rum. He didn't even understand the concept that their were different .300 magnums. I picked up some of his brass and on the 3rd piece I was inspecting a dang bullet fell out. I told him I was sorry but if he wasn't willing to buy brand new brass he would not have any reloads. Long story short , the dumb ass had actually been using 7mm Rum brass. I dropped him like a bad habit. That's the craziest "dumb" story I've got ....

 

[Bill Larson]

Get some new friends.......you can learn and share knowledge with...... this guy is wasting your time.......

 

[dworrel]

It is more important to know what you don't know (your limitations) than it is to know what you know.

I had no idea how little I knew about long range shooting until I started reading SH about 3 or 4 years ago. It is always fun to find someone who genuinely wants to learn, and painful to listen or be around someone who knows it all.

 

[Deleted member 10043]

I have a hard time explaining the history of my 300 H&H when people explain to me I should be using 300 Win Mag. You will be surprised how many people think there is only the 300 Win Mag. That is a remarkable amount of smart marketing by Winchester a long time ago. It has created a bunch of dumb asses.