Savage 220F Boyds Stock Range Report - Help!

[huntingbronco]

Here is the final product:

Opening the barrel channel:

Laying out the lines for inletting on this crazy contoured stock - factory stock for comparison:

 

[huntingbronco]

Re: Savage 220 Bolt Slug in Boyds Thumbhole Stock

Inletting in progress, dremel tool to the rescue:

Bottom metal fits:

 

[huntingbronco]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

On to the bedding - Devcon 10110, Kiwi Neutral Polish and Modeling clay are the secrets to success:

Bottom metal final bedded:

 

[huntingbronco]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

The other side of the finished product.

I'll post shooting results after the first trip to the range. Before that, I have to get the scope mounted and find some quality slugs to feed it.

Thanks again to all of those who contribute here - especially that wicked awesome forum on bedding.

 

[huntingbronco]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

Okay - scope base finally showed up. Amazing how hard stuff can be to find these days. Anyway - here it is with the glass in place.

 

[Marksman]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

Besides the bottom metal, was there any additional inletting to the action area? And how close was the varmint barrel to the contour of the slug barrel? And most importantly, how does it shoot?

 

[AXEMAN]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

looks nice. great dremel job

 

[huntingbronco]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

Wow - I was starting to worry that Snipers and Slug guns did not go together.

Appreciate the interest and happy to answer questions - it was pretty straight forward, or at least that's what I think now - we'll see how it shoots ASAP.

Thanks Axeman - almost went out and bought a new tool, but I managed with my 30 year old dremel. Boyds makes some hard wood.

Hey Marksman - the bottom metal was the only real issue. The bottom surface of the stock had to come up about .25" in the area of the rear action screw for some reason...but it blended well. Barrel channel required just a bit of sanding to opening it up and relieve contact. The barrel really only touches at the front of this stock and then along the sides, so took about 10 minutes with sandpaper. Hope that helps.

 

[huntingbronco]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

Given at least Mortarguy is contemplating this project, I'll describe how I did my inletting, so that other people can offer improvements to my process, before he starts his.

Patience. Prussian Blue and more patience.

Insert tight fitting guide pins in action screw holes to serve as guides allowing you to slide the bottom metal into contact with stock. I used a drill press to remove a lot of material initially, and then dremel for final fit. Only need a small cutting tool as pictured above and little drum sander.

Remove material until you have the depth of the front and rear screws at factory engagement with the receiver. In other words, remove the guides, insert the bottom metal (including trigger guard) and insert the screws and measure how much thread you have protruding through in the place where the receiver goes. Compare that to engagement on factory stock. Stop when they are the same as factory. Final check is positioning of the box mag relative to the bottom of the receiver. You need to make sure the lips of the box mag fit up true to the bottom to ensure proper feeding. Some minor adjustment will likely be required to get the trigger guard and magwell in the same plane on the bottom of the stock. That's easy and is a combination of wood removal and bedding.

Did I forget anything?

 

[mortarguy5611]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

That looks great. I cant wait to get home and put mine in that exact same stock. Very good job. Amazing what one can do with a Dremel a few simple tools and a lot of patience.

 

[mortarguy5611]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

What have you been shooting through yours? I have had really good luck with the Winchester Supreme Partition gold. I never waste the extra money one 3". I dont seem to gain anything over 2.75" Also the Remington Accutips shot well. But the price of the Winchesters were so much cheaper and they perform so i couldnt justify spending more than that.

 

[huntingbronco]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

Okay - made the maiden trip to the range for this otherwise brand new Savage 220F. New scope, base and rings. Ammo on hand included: Remington 3" Accutip (1900 fps), 2.75" Copper Solid (1500 fps), Winchester 2.75" Partition Gold (1900 fps) and 2.75" Silvertip (1700fps).

It was about 35 deg F with a wind predominantly off my back, variable, but about 10mph.

I fired several groups with the gun mounted in the modified Boyds stock, mostly unimpressive - 3"-4" or worse.

The following two targets were shot toward the end of this session and showed the most promise of any of the targets fired with the modified Boyd's stock. I was giving the gun plenty of time to cool between shots, as I was enjoying shooting other, known performers in my stable. I like to do this because it demonstrates to me that myself or conditions are not the cause of unexpected results.

 

[huntingbronco]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

Having high expectations, and this being my first inletting/bedding effort, I thought it could be me. So I put the Savage stock back on and gave that a whirl. Here is the best group I shot with the Accutip with Savage Stock. (I don't know why the images are rotated, they aren't rotated anywhere else.)

The Savage stock did deliver this promising group, but it to exhibited the "let down" I was seeing with the Boyd's stock.

 

[huntingbronco]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

FYI - I shot these groups off bags. I remounted the gun in the stock, retorquing everything, with essentially no effect. I placed some spacers in the foreend to put some pressure on the barrel, it did not tighten the groups, but it did shift the POI.

BTW - I was holding in the center of the target, but I was not adjusting the scope. So in general, it was throwing shots into groups to the right that were touching and then it seemed to throw a shot high, almost on or over center. When I put the pad in the foreend, the shots were more centered - I did not see the grouping to the right.

Soooooo.... I could use some guidance - Is it the gun, the bedding, the inletting or what? I am a bit lost. (As a point of reference, I have no problem getting .25" groups from my VSSF and I have shot 3 shot groups from my F/TR that measure .327 on the outside - so, while it could be me, that is not where I would go first.)

BTW - This is very much worth figuring out, I loved the way the gun shot wearing Boyd's stock. It really seemed to have less felt recoil than the plastic factory stock. Overall, very happy with everything but the accuracy, and I am hoping that is just a matter of tuning. I am hoping to get some tips from you guys on what to look for... At almost $3 a shot, with 47 rounds through the tube today... It seems worth thinking about before my next trip to the range.

Any helpful thoughts much appreciated.

 

[huntingbronco]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

As I think about this, the one thing I am not confident about what I did was how to get the mag well in square. If that was cocked, which in turn would put some side load on the action screws (I really did not notice it), could that be the source? If yes, how do you get the mag well at the correct depth while ensuring it is square?

 

[mortarguy5611]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

Im not sure if I missed something but at what range are those groups? So the groups did not change much in size between both stocks? Did you put any rounds through this gun before you got the new stock? If so were your results similiar?

Im not saying you are not capable of handleing the recoil but im just curious. I know if i let my friends shoot my 220 they are only capable of getting similar groups. If you know someone who shoots alot of magnum calibers or Sabot Slugs alot you may want them to come and try to shoot and see if they get the same results. Like I said im not insulting your ability to shoot just giving another option.

Also make sure everything is till tight ie optics base and rings. I know I have ran into those trouble with slugs. I have started using locktight on all my rings and bases on my slug guns.

 

[mortarguy5611]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

Keep us updated on the progress. Its nice to see another person who enjoys there slug gun.

 

[huntingbronco]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

Mortarguy - no insults taken. I know I have friends that handle recoil better than me. I have only sold a few rifles - 7mm STW was one - just not enough return for bang...haha.

All groups were 100 yards.

I've got more homework to do and have lots of time to tinker.

I am now reading up on conversion to DBM to understand that better. Not that I want to undo much, but I am thinking pillars play a significant role in getting the spacing right between the action and the bottom metal and they would also help keeping things true. I am going to continue noodling to see if I can avoid the pillar route.

Did you do anything special to break your gun in? These were the first groups ever fired from this gun. I just ran a patch down the bore before firing it. Did not clean between shots.

If anything, it got better towards the end of the session.

 

[mortarguy5611]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

I didnt do anything special to mine. I cleaned it when i bought it and then I shot the hell out of it. It will shoot 1.5" groups on a really bad day but normally under 1" at 100.

As far as the pillars go I am no expert but I believe that getting the spacing correct between the bottom metal and the receiver would be more important for feeding from the magazine. If you are not having issues with the magazine i think you should be fine. But pillars are easy and cheap to do so it would give you some piece of mind in knowing that isnt the issue so I would say go for it.

I would suggest haveing someone else shoot a group with it and see what sort of results you are getting.

You also said you were giving plenty of time between rounds. How much time? I know with mine I would give it at least 5 minutes between rounds because those barrels are extremely thin for the amount of powder you burning in it and heat up extremely fast.


If this is your first slug gun I think you may just need some more range time and get used to the recoil. If you dont have a good recoil pad on your Boyds stock I would suggest getting a limbsaver for it.

Like i said I am not subject matter expert but I have abotu 150 rounds through my 220 with great results so I hope this helps.

 

[huntingbronco]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

Mortarguy - I just read an interesting article in American Hunter on this gun.

Here is the quote I found interesting:

<span style="font-style: italic">"To overcome the vibration when shooting a slug gun from a bench, the shooter must grip the forearm firmly and draw it down and rearward while drawing the stock solidly back into the shoulder. Allowing the barrel to ride freely is a prescription for inconsistent slug groups."</span>

I was letting the front float on the bags and holding the rear bag with my off hand. Which technique do you use when shooting from the bench with this gun?

 

[shoots100]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

Been shooting and working on savage firearms for a long time and may have a solution for you.This is a method used for tuneing rifles,especially savage rimfires.The method,is to torque your reciever bolts in sequence and poundage till it shoots better.A torque wrench is needed of course,but I've seen it done on the range when one wasn't available.Not reccommended,but chit happens.You tighten both bolts to 5 pounds,to snug the action into the stock.Gently tap stock butt on ground to snug the recoil lug tight to stock.Tighten front bolt to 30lbs and back bolt to 10pds.Now you'll need to get to the range for testing.Fire 3 shot groups with the gun in a good rest.Tighten the rear bolt in 10 pound increments till your groups are hopefully getting smaller.Usually I go in 5 pound increments,but I know 20ga ammo isn't cheap,especially the Win silver tips.While tightening the rear bolt,you can also tighten the front bolt a bit tighter too.Usually it'll end up being in the 40lb area.Once you see how the bolt tightening sequence effects the grouping,you should be able to dial it in.I'm giving you the short version here.There's plenty of articles written about this procedure that go into greater detail.Good Luck

 

[mortarguy5611]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

I always use my left hand to squeeze the bag i have under the stock for elevation adjustments. I dont hold the front down at all. So I guess maybe that would help I guess I have never had an issue with that. There is alot of muzzle rise with it witch is why I have been thinking of getting my barrel ported to help reduce that. I guess I have never had any accuracy issues with the way I shoot but it is definately something to try.

 

[huntingbronco]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

I like your idea of having someone else shoot it. I'll give that a try.

Not my first slug gun. I have 2 Benelli SBEs that shoot well inside minute of whitetail. I have a Beretta 390 (391) that shoots the same. All fully rifled, cantilevered scoped, etc. Hard as it may seem, I never really shot them for "accuracy", just got them sighted in for 100yd hunting. They all shoot great.

Truth be told, I have Encore with a 20 guage barrel and a fixed 4x Burris - I would be very happy if this Savage shoots as well as that when everything is done. BTW - Recoil on the Encore is more severe than this Savage, especially when the Savage is wearing the Boyds stock.

As for all of my slug guns, I don't do anything special with them - either when shooting or cleaning. That is one reason I figured this should be easy.

The good thing is I will figure it out and we'll have a good recipe to follow here. My only purpose for creating this post was I had not found where anyone had done what I am doing on this gun - when I figure it out, the record will be here for others, including you.

 

[mortarguy5611]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

It is good that you are recording all this since noone seems to have done this before. If i wasnt it the the sand box I would have mine done already haha. Im definately going to set my stock up in the mill so i can get everything true and straight.

I really hope you can get everything straightened out. It could have just been a bad day for you. I know I have had days where even with my proven rifles I could barely keep my groups under a minute and then a buddy will shoot and destroy me haha. That just makes me shoot worse lol.

Hope it all works out and keep us posted. If you have any questions or any comments feel free to shoot me a PM so I dont miss it.

 

[jackalhunter]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

Hunting Bronco,
I have been reading this because I have Savage rifles, and am interested in the Savage 220, supposedly available this year in left hand version. Anyways, my story is a Savage 111 in 6.5-284 which supposedly is a good long range caliber and had a great writeup in a gun magazine. Mine was not real accurate - did lots of load development and trips to a rifle range. Finally asked a gunsmith to inspect the barrel with a borescope. It looked horrible inside with machining chatter marks. Other much older guns of mine and my son looked considerable better. Ordered a new custom barrel in 280 Ackley for my model 111 and it shoots real well. I like some Savage features like the Accu trigger but am suspicious of their average barrel quality when real accuracy is desired for long range or varmit shooting.

 

[F224]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

Two issues that I noticed with my Savage 220 when I owned it. First, Savage only recommends two slugs for accuracy, one Remington and one Federal load. Any other ammo that I tested would shoot ok (under an inch) at 50 yards and look like a shotgun pattern at 100 or greater (10+" groups). The second is the gun was more consistent in it's groups when fired off of shooting sticks.

I have found the H&R Ultra laminated 20ga heavy barreled slug guns the best buy, with ammo they like, a simple trigger polish and silicone under the forearm, they will shoot under 4" at 225 yards. All this for $300.

 

[tcmech]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

I would try cleaning the barrel with JB bore cleaning compound and see if it made a difference. I know that this is not a muzzleloader but it is shooting a saboted slug and the barrel may need to be smoothed out a little to get you the accuracy you desire. The procedures that were recommended for the savage ml on Dougs message board worked for me with a savage 10ml2 and a rifled slug barrel for my mossberg 500 in the past.

Good luck, Craig
http://dougsmessageboards.proboards.com/index.cgi#shootinghunting

 

[huntingbronco]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

Thanks to all you guys for the suggestions. I have a fair amount of time before I get back to the range, so I went ahead and gave pillars a whirl. Hoping this fixes a little something that bugging me in the way things stacked up. Never know, it could have been the source of my problem. For those who have done this, do you normally notch the rear pillar before or after installation?

Here's a pic of the pillars cut to correct length.

Mortarguy - Thank you for your service to our country!

Oh, and yes, I am jealous that you have a mill available to you.

 

[mortarguy5611]

Re: Savage 220F Bolt Slugg in a Boyds Thumbhole Stock

Looks good Bronco hopefully this will fix what is bugging you. And as far as the mill I just happen to have a step dad who has just about anything I need available at work so that is a blessing I will admit. Then it just comes down to him finding time to do it haha.

 

[Carryacolt]

Huntingbronco,
I would like to talk to you concerning the way you inletted your Boyd's stock to your 220F.
My email is carryacolt@ netzero.com. Please contact me.
Thanks

 

[sawcut]

Saw your post and thought I would post a link to a similar exercise I went through setting up my savage for the dbm. In my post I put in the pillar sizes I measured and came up with. I did not finish the stock in my original post, but installed it in another stock an it has worked fine so far. As far as the accuracy issues you are having, I would double check all connections, scope rings and bases, action screws, barrel and tang free float, etc. to narrow down the issue. Something is not right, I think it should shoot a little better.


A posting on Savage shooters about my attempt at a similar set up:
http://www.savageshooters.com/showt...n-DBM-savage-setting-up-a-new-laminated-stock

heres a picture from my post with the pillars I came up with.

I also just received a laminated stock from Stocky's for the savage DBM. I will be bedding this rifle fairly soon, but I was pretty glad to get a decent stock that was properly inletted for the factory DBM. Mine went in no problem, though on one action I tested, the trigger will not function. I'll take it apart and relieve any offending material and it should be fine. But the stock is decent and is really inletted accurately. With a half hour, max, of fitting it will be fine. My other stock in my post needs hours of fitting the dpm, and I have not gotten back to it.

This is the stock from stocky's I got, and it is a good fit for a varmint dbm:
Long Range Varmint Laminated Thumbhole - Savage 10 Blind & Detachable Magazine Models

 

[deer slayer]

That is a beautiful final product. I have a peppered thumbhole coming for my .270 from boyds now.

I'm up here and Canada and have a small project going on with the same 220f. A little history might help ya to know where I'm coming from and more importantly where I'm going with this. I bought mine a year and a half ago. It was a tack driver at 150 yards new. 3 shots no waiting in between. I'm shooting 3" 275gr federals as the 2 3/4, 250gr SST were all over the place.
5th day of season and 8 pointer was at 80 yards. I shot, it bucked and looked around and started feeding. I shot 5 times same thing. I gave up and he walked away. I immediately went to the range.POI was 7 high 7 left first shot. 2nd shot 7 high 15 left,3rd was 8 high and 4 right. Clearly why I missed. Firing right over its back.

Sooo,I ask my self what happened???? Just couldn't zero it after. No groups... I took my action out and found that the factory aluminum pillars were recessed .015" , the lug has worn on one side only and the stock was compressed off center of the pillars under the action. So I have the glass bedding drying as I type. I used bedrock kit and used 1/4 dowels with tape to take up clearance in pillar holes.
I came across this blog and as I have a thumbhole coming for my .270 from boyds and was thinking about changing the stock on my 220f.

I have a few questions so I can make a better decision what I want to do with mine. I want to know if you sorted out the issues with the thumbhole stock and your POI? ,Was it the pillars, if not what you might of found? If you were to do it all over knowing what you know now, what would you improve on in your build process? What stock model stock did you start with? Is there a heavier stock that you could have chosen?

Any Advice would be greatly appreciated.