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Hunting & Fishing Best Way to Carry in Grizz Backcountry?

Fisky

Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Apr 6, 2010
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Jamestown, ND
Gun will most likely be a Gen 4 G29.
I am looking for recommendations on the best way to carry this pistol for bear defense, with a pack on, and binos on the chest via bino harness. Obviously the lighter it is, would be a plus too.
I carried spray this year and all the locals (MT) thought I was nuts (bow hunting). They were all toting big and heavy 44's. Starting to think they know something I don't know.

Thanks!!
 
You can get a Glock converted to run .460 Rowland, Also an XD. Never seen an M&P done but I'm not sure it cant be.

1911's can be converted too if you find a cheap one that's been neglected you could get it fitted for .460 Rowland. I don't have a need to defend against the Griz but if I did I wouldn't mind a leg up in capacity on the revolver fellas.
 
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OP,
I fish Alaska whenever I have the opportunity. Before my first trip up there, I researched the recommended pistol caliber & if pepper spray was worth it. Fish & Game said I could forget the magnum pistol & the pepper spray but don't forget a dependable rifle of at least 30-06 caliber with 180gr or better bullets of proper construction. So for me, it is a 30-06 with 180gr. TTSX rounds or a shotgun with Brenneke slugs. A fellow co-worker (afield with his better half) already had to pull the trigger in AK a few years back. Their story is educational especially in regards to bear spray.

Brown Bear Charge on Montague Island - YouTube
 
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Wish I could figure out how to post this in a larger format .....to do this shot justice.

For a frame of reference. Here's a NW MT Grizzly. NOT a Park or zoo bear. He IS exceptionally LARGE...But they ARE out there.

I carry a 6" .44 mag or at minimum my FA M-97 in .44 Spcl with near .44 mag loads in an El Paso Saddlery 1942 chest rig.

Few years back near St Regis I had a grizzly 1/2 the size of this guy at 30 feet and THAT was about as stimulated as I want to be. Even with my 6" M-29 leveled on his head.
 
As someone who spent their early life hunting grizz country I can tell you this, they are not to be trifled with. Their biology makes walking killing machines covered in armor. They are covered head to toe in soft armor that is every bit as good as IIIA kevlar. They also have a thick sloped skull capable of deflecting even some rifle rounds. If you can take a medium caliber rifle loaded with ball rounds to make sure you get to vital organs. If you have to carry a pistol then like others have suggested go big or go home. If you have to use a pistol try to get him to stand and or roar at you. The only chinks in their armor are the roof of the mouth and the crook of the throat. Use ball ammo to make sure it reaches the brain or brain stem depending on which target you pick. I hope this helps.
 
I bought an airliite 44 mag from smith for this reason. It is not bad to carry. It is not comfortable to shoot, but has much more energy than a 10mm


--Daniel
 
Guides holster, these can be carried on the chest or belt. On the chest is best for easy access to the firearm with a pack on etc for quickest draw, if ole booboo knocks you down and you roll over, on chest can be drawn the easiest by either hand. If booboo in on top smashing you around, the easiest access on the chest. Plus it does not get in the way as much hiking, fishing. chopping wood, etc.

Caliber is personal but me, 10mm has lots of love these days but me no way. Revolver for me is more reliable in glacier silt, mud, dirt, backcounty use and will not come out of battery and be useless if a bear is rolling your around on top and that Glock 10mm because a club. Have to think of the whole bear encounter.

Revolvers should be heavy framed like Red Hawk because hot loads in a light weight wheel gun can have the revolver jump timing or the bullet becomes unseated and jams on the forcing cone. How do I know, have the t shirt and see it quite often.

44 is now consider min but I run 454 cas now with buffalo bore or grizzly hard cast for a little extra HP, still about the HP of a 30.30win, its still a handgun power.

Bear spray is the best deterrent. The last thing any backcountry traveler needs is to wing teeth and claws into a rage, now your bear encounter has become bad juju.
 
Totally agree^^^,Bear spray is a good option,anything smaller than a 44mag...,make sure you file that front sight down nice and smooth...
 
You can get a Glock converted to run .460 Rowland, Also an XD. Never seen an M&P done but I'm not sure it cant be.

1911's can be converted too if you find a cheap one that's been neglected you could get it fitted for .460 Rowland. I don't have a need to defend against the Griz but if I did I wouldn't mind a leg up in capacity on the revolver fellas.

Only way to run the 460 is with a 1911. I have a glock 460 and a 255 grain hard cast lead bullet at 1130fps, the glock frame can not take the energy. The 1911's can run the same bullet at 1360-1410 fps. It is mid to top end charge for 44 mag with the same bullet weight but reloads are quite a bit quicker and the extra capacity is a plus, 9 rounds in the gun. Just make sure if you run a semi auto in this role it needs to be cleaned and maintained daily or kept in a dry place, like the HPG chest rig.
 
I hunt ALOT of grizz country, my first Griz sidearm was a Taurus titanium 2" 44mag. It was very light but also very bulky, I ended up selling that and going to the S&W 329pd 44mag and decided it was still hard to shoot accurately and recoiled like a raped ape. Now I just carry my Glock 22 40cal. I've got 15 pills in the mag and I train with it on a regular basis(duty gun) I'm comfortable carrying it in bear country, granted a 10mm would be a better choice and may go that route down the road. I know of 3 bears shot here in Wyoming in self defense with 41mags and they all took a dirt nap, the 41 and 10 are ballistically identical.

I use a Blackhawk Serpa holster with a quick release, I have an attachment on my eberlestock pack hip belt and one on a paddle attachment. So I can transition my side arm to my pack or my pants depending on how I'm hunting.
 
Here's my .02 on bear handguns-been there, done that and have rugs on the wall. I shot a midsize grizzly at less than 25 yards with a .375 H&H. Good shot..bear jumps up and runs into the nastiest, thickest brush you have ever seen. Spent two hours with two trusted friends tracking the bear. the tracking in the brush became its own spiritual experience. Now that we have established a benchmark for stopping power, lets talk about handguns.

I laugh at the short barrel magnums and here is a test to prove your testosterone level. place a 12 inch diner plate at 10 yards. draw and aim dead center. pull the trigger as fast as you can. repeat without ear protection for the full effect....

try the same exercise again with your glock. man with a glock can keep a full magazine on the target. Man with short barrel S&W or ruger Alaskan is now deaf with on hole on paper and the rest fired straight up into the air. Therefore the Glock wins hands down. Yes I lived in Alaska for several years and formed an opinion. YMMV

I quit carrying .44 magnums and went with a Glock 21. The 10mm is even better.
 
The concern is not shooting and hitting a bear standing, bluffing or charging. They have been popped with 9, 45s, all sorts of calibers. Its not that any firearm or caliber will stop a bear, its about a bear on top slapping you around, chewing, stomping on you. This is where semi just make a poor choice as they can come out battery and not fire with a greater chance of fur, dirt, clothing etc jammed in the action, push the muzzle of that Glock into the chest, neck of a bear that is on top mauling and it will come of battery and not go bang, that is a fact semi will not go bang out of battery.

Everybody seems to have this notion that a bear stands erect 20 yards away with mouth open in a nice clean open area. If you think so, sorry to say your sorely mistaken. Bears are in head high grass, thickets so dense sunlight has a hard time finding its way through, all sorts of different terrain and this is where they are most dangerous, they cannot see what is there only by sound and smell.

Blast with spray will most likely send the bear into what just happened and you can back out slowing. I prefer bear spray as my first line of defense for bear encounters. I prefer 12ga as a stopper but very hard to tote a long gun and do things, it gets in the way. I have set my shot gun down to fish, gather wood. gather berries, walk down to the creek to get water, only to see mr bear there and realize I left my shot gun laying or leaning a long way away. I have slithered through thickets so dense the barrel of shot gun and rifle was tangled every second in the thicket. Hunting with my cousin just this very thing, on hands and knees and belly and backs, my cousin said bear, we stared right into a massive beautiful grizzled fur and eyes staring right at us, what to do, can not back out, bear is not backing out either just those eyes staring back, can not aim rifles as they are tangled up, we could unholster hand cannons and take a bead.

A full hell bent charge, sorry but there is no time to draw a any weapon so caliber is not that important. What is, being able to draw what ever firearm you have by either hand, one hand may be in the bears mouth,under a paw, under you body, etc muzzle up the bear so short barrel is best and pull the trigger until it stops going bang.

I was charged and knocked down by a young brownie, I was in head grass, heard the campraiders just a split second before hearing something coming from 4-5 oclock. By the time I spun my head around, bear hit my legs knocking me down, all I saw was brown blur. I was lucky being a young bear or he may have been scared that I was a dominate male. He knocked me down and kept running jumping up of a large rock where he began to survey. He sniffed, popped and stomped. I played dead until he left.

I have been bluffed numerous times down to 10-12 yards but most of them 15-20 yards or so. Had bears walk into camp, slither out of the darkness and appear, no warning, some stopped, others kept walking, others ran off seeing humans and or blast of spray. In the backcountry. Had bears see me and run. Had bears see me and stop. Had bears see me and bluff. Had bears see me and go back to eating grubs. Bears are unpredictable and every encounter and every bear is different. Its best to put odds in your favor at the highest degree possible.

Certification for bear guard requires hits on the charging bear target. The cert was, a target set up on pulleys and cable pulled by a 4 wheeler from 25 yards from the side and behind with the instructor yelling bear and then all sorts of confusion was instilled into the cert. Yea I know, we all are one hole dead eye sharpshooters but the cert was very hard and stressful for everyone to include the instructors running the drills, hand magnums and 12ga.
 
I used to hunt in Mt Grizz country. I considered it the bonus part of the sport to be in the foodchain while hunting my food. The Deer/Elk I was after had no sidearm or spray to defend against me- only fair that I had to worry about my own bacon while stalking theirs.

I used to be waaaay dumber than I am now.
 
Not so easy to carry as a pistol, but potent medicine nonetheless.
marlin2_0.jpg

4570exiters.jpg
 
I'm in the Glock 10mm camp and bow hunt in Montana griz country (not Kodiak Island). I carried a .41 mag wheel gun for many years as a bow hunting side arm and sleeping pill when camped in a thin tent in areas covered with black bear and griz sign. Great pistol, fun to practice with and, FOR ME, total junk when trying to rapidly get back on target. Single action, double action: didn't matter, follow up shots were off the mark. The reality of ME accurately popping off rapid shots at a moving target wasn't going to happen. Then I tried a Glock 10mm. Personally hate the plastic feel but 15 rounds of pretty powerful slugs, one right after the other, simple to keep on target....I did the math on # of hits over a short period of time and this was the way to go for ME. I'm not going to carry a special short barreled .458 mag rifle or shotgun when bow hunting. Get real. MY assumption is that I'm going to be very lucky to unholster a pistol in time if it happens. If you can shoot a wheel gun quickly and accurately, good on you. A .44 Mag so used beats the 10mm hands down other than having 9 fewer shots. However, it wasn't even in the ball park for me in terms of accuracy, back on target, rapid shots, etc.. I'm very happy with my Glock (not the looks) as an anti-griz tool for me.

There isn't one weapon that addresses all potential griz attack scenarios and, regardless of caliber, pistol bullets don't just bounce off griz fur and "just piss them off". Even where I hunt, just outside Jellystone where you will see griz sign if you look, the chances of me even seeing one are quite rare. If I lived in AK or Kodaik Island, different story.

Whatever you pick, practice.
 
I always pack a wheel gun , either my 357 or 44 when I'm hunting. No clip to worry about falling out, no jamming, just a simple pull and shoot. I do own autos just don't pack them hunting.
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"Worry about" isn't something I consider with 0.01% chance stuff. Internet stories, drama and rare reports from the range aren't reality.
 
To be fair, this thread is/was about how to best carry a pistol in bear country, with a pack on and binos on the chest. I have little experience carrying a pistol, so I was looking for ideas on how best to carry it, again with a pack on and binos in a harness on my chest. Ie; drop leg, chest rig, attached to the pack belt, etc etc etc....

I have already pretty much decided on a 10mm Glock before I posted this thread.....Sorry for the confusion, and I appreciate the input thus far.
 
Blah blah blah, but when that 0.01% chance happens, I know I'll have a gun that won't fail. This thread is about packing in grizzly country. Keep on punching paper with your 9mm bro!


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Thanks for the reminder about the reason for the post. I've been packing, hunting and camping in griz country for over 30 years and understand what the thread is about, which is why I answered the OP: from actual experience, not reading about pathetic scenarios from dreamers.

I also know I have a gun that wont fail, we're in good company. It's about effectiveness in real situations, not invented/dramatic possibilities that don't happen in real life. I've tried both and know what works for me. I don't own a 9mm or .357 for that matter, no use for them.

Keep on dreaming! Good for entertainment.
 
Glock or wheel gun is fine, for an emergency backup. I would have a Tikka T3 light in 300 WM on my shoulder though. It only weighs six pounds. A Ruger Redhawk probable weighs 3. Going into Grizz country with only a pistol is a macho mans suicide. I would rather have 200 grain slugs traveling at 3000 fps than 1400.
 
I just don't understand where 8 ounce is worth dying for. Stick with the 44. I have a 4 inch smith 329 pd. This gun weighs less than a fully loaded glock 20. I love the people that say I have 15 pills..... Really if you have that much time to shoot that many rounds, one of you already dead. Maybe the bear and may be you. Bottom line you have to think that your only going to get on shot, it better have the power to do what you need to do with it. Think about it this way, if your going into the woods to specifically hunt a brown bear what would you take. At minimum a 44. Why risk anything else. The 329 is an awesome weapon and yes you don't want to take it to a range and shoot it a lot, but it serves a very specific purpose.
 
To be fair, this thread is/was about how to best carry a pistol in bear country, with a pack on and binos on the chest. I have little experience carrying a pistol, so I was looking for ideas on how best to carry it, again with a pack on and binos in a harness on my chest. Ie; drop leg, chest rig, attached to the pack belt, etc etc etc....

I have already pretty much decided on a 10mm Glock before I posted this thread.....Sorry for the confusion, and I appreciate the input thus far.


Like I said, I lived and played in bear country my whole life and the best method I have found and most seen in the backcounty of Alaska so I recommend a chest rig so you can draw with either hand. The morale of what I am saying is, bears do not stand in front of you in a nice open area for you to take bead and drop ole booboo in its tracks but they come silent from close range hell bent on bringing viscous hurt so what ever weapon you have if must but be accessed the quickest and easiest way, not only standing but you may be on the ground fighting for your life, take it or leave I do not care if anyone accepts what I know or experienced but I give my recommendation and experience on what I have to those who ask. On the chest its out of the way when carrying a pack and rifle. The firearm has to be accessible in dire straights and not be a nuisance when carrying. Binos included, I tote my hand gun on my chest.
Guides Choice Chest Holster, Original Alaskan Holster

Uncle Mikes made them from nylon for different framed revolvers up to 500SW and semi loaders that I sold a pallet full every year, BlackHawk has tried to continue.

good luck
 
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Like I said, I lived and played in bear country my whole life and the best method I have found and most seen in the backcounty of Alaska so I recommend a chest rig so you can draw with either hand., take it or leave I do not care if anyone accepts what I know or experienced but I give my recommendation and experience on what I have to those who ask.[/url]

Thank you 45/308: actual experience. Personally, I love the drama and fear that people have of griz in the lower 48/Northwest. It keeps the doughnut eaters and range-shooter folk out of the wilderness and there more room for the rest of us to have fun.

I'm going to take your advice and get a chest rig. Frankly, my holster is OK and in practice the pistol comes out in a jiffy but chest rig would be so much better.
 
Like I said, I lived and played in bear country my whole life and the best method I have found and most seen in the backcounty of Alaska so I recommend a chest rig so you can draw with either hand. The morale of what I am saying is, bears do not stand in front of you in a nice open area for you to take bead and drop ole booboo in its tracks but they come silent from close range hell bent on bringing viscous hurt so what ever weapon you have if must but be accessed the quickest and easiest way, not only standing but you may be on the ground fighting for your life, take it or leave I do not care if anyone accepts what I know or experienced but I give my recommendation and experience on what I have to those who ask. On the chest its out of the way when carrying a pack and rifle. The firearm has to be accessible in dire straights and not be a nuisance when carrying. Binos included, I tote my hand gun on my chest.
Guides Choice Chest Holster, Original Alaskan Holster

Uncle Mikes made them from nylon for different framed revolvers up to 500SW and semi loaders that I sold a pallet full every year, BlackHawk has tried to continue.

good luck

Thank you. Carrying on the chest would be my preference. Just didn't know how it would work (if at all) with binos on as well. I see in their gallery they have 1 picture with a guy with gun and binos on chest...Them Diamond D's sure are popular.
 
Personally, I love the drama and fear that people have of griz in the lower 48/Northwest. It keeps the doughnut eaters and range-shooter folk out of the wilderness and there more room for the rest of us to have fun.

I agree with you. My experience in bear country is very limited thus far, I spent 2 weeks bow hunting the backcountry of your state in Sept. It was VERY easy to see that where the bears are, there is less hunting pressure. I am for less hunting pressure, I think I'd rather deal with bears than humans any day. I am not deathly afraid of bears, but there were times when I'm under my tarp (no door) a branch would snap and I could imagine a bear sticking it's head in for a peek. Took me about 5 minutes to start breathing again. Bear spray would be useless to me at that point. I just feel a pistol would offer more confidence.

That said, I had some buddies hunting deep in an area where they ran into one guy who had been there for about 9 days. He packed in 3 cans of bear spray and had gone through two of them already. His $1000 Hilleberg tent also got shredded as the guy accidentally left a camp towel in there one day. Not sure I would wander around that area for too long.
 
but there were times when I'm under my tarp (no door) a branch would snap and I could imagine a bear sticking it's head in for a peek. Took me about 5 minutes to start breathing again. Bear spray would be useless to me at that point. I just feel a pistol would offer more confidence.

That's why I call my pistol a sleeping pill! My wife and I were camped on a ridge where we carried in water a few weeks prior to archery season. When we got there during the season bear tracks (not very big honestly, but long-ish griz claws way out front) were all over the place w/scratches in the trees, etc., but there wasn't any other level ground. Pistol next to our heads added an hour or two extra sleep.

The non-grizzly range mountains in Montana are getting hammered by hunters more and more while just outside the Park you're almost alone compared to 20 years ago. It didn't used to be that way but fear of bears and the number of bears are growing hand in hand.
 
Alaskan here. For our big brown Volkswagens nothing beats a SW 500. May sound odd but many maul victims will say they wish they had a lanyard on their pistol after they got swatted. Just a thought.

For a guide rifle I prefer my 458 WM or my 45-70